The Russian-Ukrainian War Thread

John Fedup

The Bunker Group
Well he's business survivor, he has ups and down so does much of businessman. However what matters is, the way that his politics style has reflection on how his businesses style. So understanding his business style seems will give insight how's he approach on doing his POTUS style.
I am guessing his business survival wasn’t due to wisdom but rather wise guys (probably Italian and Russian ones).
 

swerve

Super Moderator
His personal business survival is often accompanied by the failure of the businesses he runs, so other shareholders find themselves holding worthless paper, workers are laid off, & suppliers don't get paid, while he walks off with a lot of money.

Voting for him on the grounds of his business acumen seems to me to be about as wise as investing in a minority stake in one of his businesses, or selling to one of his businesses on credit.
 

John Fedup

The Bunker Group
His personal business survival is often accompanied by the failure of the businesses he runs, so other shareholders find themselves holding worthless paper, workers are laid off, & suppliers don't get paid, while he walks off with a lot of money.

Voting for him on the grounds of his business acumen seems to me to be about as wise as investing in a minority stake in one of his businesses, or selling to one of his businesses on credit.
Yup, about as wise as paying tuition fees at failed Trump University....mind you, what kind of moron would hire a Trump U graduate if Trump U hadn't gone down the drain? Whoops, forgot about the MAGA feeble-tons.
 

Fredled

Active Member
Meme of the day:
meme_trump_ukraine_rareearths2.jpg
Link to related article (Ukrinform)

IMO, this is a nice trick to tell Trump that if he wants his rare earths, Ukraine, with the help of the US, should first liberate territories occupied by Russia.
It could backfire if Putin offers Trump to mine rare earths directly in Russia. But I don't think that he will do so, or that Trump will be able to accept a proposal from Putin.
 

Big_Zucchini

Well-Known Member
This is nonsense. Israel is both a buyer of EU made weapons & equipment & a supplier to EU countries.

For example, Italy operates Israeli AEW systems, fitted to US business jets in Israel, & is buying more. Israel has Italian jet trainers & ground-based systems which work with them. The Israeli navy has German submarines & corvettes, with Italian guns. Germany is buying Israeli radars, e.g. for warships, & MRLS & ATGMs. In 2019-23 30% of Israel's military equipment imports were from Germany. Denmark is buying Israeli 155mm SP guns & MRLs, & Israeli firms are competing to supply air defence systems. A few years ago Lithuania was complaining about Israel - because weapons Lithuania had ordered from Israel weren't being delivered on time. It was settled after a while, & Lithuania's now buying more. Estonia has Israeli ATGMs, anti-ship missiles & UAVs. Latvia has ATGMs (20 EU countries have bought Spike). Sweden - UAVs.

And so on . . . .
EU -> Israel
Multiple key nations imposing arms embargos or obstacles for trade.
2019-2023 were peak years because of the delivery of Sa'ar 6 ships and submarines. Germany was uniquely positioned to supply such vessels as one of only few builders in those categories, and besides Germany is the only country in Europe that's actually an ally to Israel and has the capacity to be useful.
Other friendly nations lack the defense industry.
Defense imports from the rest of Europe are minimal because they're not dependable. They're cut off immediately when there's war, chief among them the UK which sees it as a national sport.


Israel -> EU

Israel's MIC is focused on local maintenance capability and low rate production of critical items. It's able to produce its own ammo for example, but at least not at all sufficient to support an ongoing war effort.
Due to Israel's frequent wars, its MIC would essentially be restocking in between, and would be of little use to Europe in terms of total work done.
What it can contribute is reference designs to facilitate local production in Europe. That much is assured no matter how hostile these nations become.
That is not what makes one a strategic arms supplier. Far from it.


This brings me back to my point that the US is irreplaceable for Europe, no matter how hard they try. It could be replaceable, had Europe not abandoned security these past 30 years.
 

John Fedup

The Bunker Group
EU -> Israel
Multiple key nations imposing arms embargos or obstacles for trade.
2019-2023 were peak years because of the delivery of Sa'ar 6 ships and submarines. Germany was uniquely positioned to supply such vessels as one of only few builders in those categories, and besides Germany is the only country in Europe that's actually an ally to Israel and has the capacity to be useful.
Other friendly nations lack the defense industry.
Defense imports from the rest of Europe are minimal because they're not dependable. They're cut off immediately when there's war, chief among them the UK which sees it as a national sport.


Israel -> EU

Israel's MIC is focused on local maintenance capability and low rate production of critical items. It's able to produce its own ammo for example, but at least not at all sufficient to support an ongoing war effort.
Due to Israel's frequent wars, its MIC would essentially be restocking in between, and would be of little use to Europe in terms of total work done.
What it can contribute is reference designs to facilitate local production in Europe. That much is assured no matter how hostile these nations become.
That is not what makes one a strategic arms supplier. Far from it.


This brings me back to my point that the US is irreplaceable for Europe, no matter how hard they try. It could be replaceable, had Europe not abandoned security these past 30 years.
Lots agree with but the US (albeit to a lesser degree) screwed up as well cutting back key programs like the F-22 and Sea Wolf SSNs, both of which would be more useful now in larger numbers. The manufacturing MIC has shrunk somewhat as well; but worse still, just like other NATO members, ammo inventory was allowed to shrink. Yes, like Russia, they can ramp up, but compared to China, a decade or more is needed. The Asia-Pacific $hitstorm is probably happening sooner.
 

seaspear

Well-Known Member
The U.S is ramping up its production of 155mm shells according to this article also that older shells do age out over time ,the U.S will refurbish its stockpile quickly a question would be would it sell to Ukraine ? did the expense of the upgrade to capacity to manufacture come out of funds that were assigned to Ukraine
This article supplies a breakdown of how much is spent in the U.S developing aid to Ukraine
 

Redshift

Active Member
Well he's business survivor, he has ups and down so does much of businessman. However what matters is, the way that his politics style has reflection on how his businesses style. So understanding his business style seems will give insight how's he approach on doing his POTUS style.
In his business only he and his family matter, his employees, investors and customers suffer, If he treats the US like this, and given the Trump merch he has sold them to date is anything to go by, he intends to treat the US in the same way.
 

T.C.P

Well-Known Member
And simultaneously fighting against the Kurds, allied with the US and Israel.
I never understood, why EU even supported the Kurds that heavily to begin with. The YPG were an alliance of covenience, against Isis. Turkey both as a member of NATO and a check on Russia in the caucus region is too valuable for EU to lose over a small ethnic militia group.

https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/1ix72q1
Look at the company who voted against condemning Russia. I mean we all kind of expected Trump to be a bit biased to Putin, but this level of kowtowing is insane. His supporters are convinced that this is 4D chess and will ensure Chinese-Russian seperation. But man does that seem wild.
 

John Fedup

The Bunker Group
I never understood, why EU even supported the Kurds that heavily to begin with. The YPG were an alliance of covenience, against Isis. Turkey both as a member of NATO and a check on Russia in the caucus region is too valuable for EU to lose over a small ethnic militia group.

https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/1ix72q1
Look at the company who voted against condemning Russia. I mean we all kind of expected Trump to be a bit biased to Putin, but this level of kowtowing is insane. His supporters are convinced that this is 4D chess and will ensure Chinese-Russian seperation. But man does that seem wild.
A C-F in the making.
 

T.C.P

Well-Known Member
Even the Abstention list. There is Argentina, Milei prior to election win was heavily pro Ukr and very antti Russia. But the man will take his cues from Trump.

On the voting for list- I am surprised to see Nepal vote for it. The two nations that have the most influence on them voted to abstain.
 

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
Update.

Kursk area.

North of Sverdlikovo Russian forces have broken into Lebedevka and in the east they've recaptured now most of Cherkasskaya Konopel'ka. South of Sverdlikovo Russia has reached the border and there are reports Russian forces have entered Sumy region, aiming for the villages of Noven'koe and Basovka. If accurate, this is a serious threat to the MSR into Sudzha. Though the Loknya river does separate this incursion from the road, it's not a major river.


Russian Molniya drone strikes in Kursk region.


Lebedevka, Kursk region, just north of Sverdlikovo, a Ukrainian Bushmaster gets hit, the occupants bail out but are hunted by another drone.


Russian drone strike on a Ukrainian dugout, reportedly Kursk area.


Russian bomb strike landing near Sudzha, and the bomb apparently detonated when it hit the tree branches.


FAB-3000 strike landing near Kurilovka, west of Sudzha.


Russia hits a Ukrainian Kozak armored car near Melovoy south-east of Sudzha.


Mystery guided missile (Bulsae-4?) striking a BMP-2 near Sudzha.


Russia hits a Ukrainian M109 decoy, Kursk region.


Another Ukrainian CV90 taken out in Kursk region. This is probably the most capable IFV on the Ukrainian battlefield but even it is vulnerable to the trio of drones, artillery, and land mines.


A series of Russian FPV drone strikes in Kursk region, hitting a Bushmaster MRAP, a VAB, a Bradley (1st link), an MRAP, a Stryker, and unknown targets (2nd-3rd links), a BMP and a M777 or decoy (4th link).


We have our first look at Pbv 302s getting hit near Noven'koe village, Sumy region, near the Kursk region border. It burns down and the close-up shows off a cage armor but likely too close to the main hull to be effective.


A series of Russian drone strikes in Sumy regions, they hit something netting, unclear, a van, an armored car of unknown type on the move, another armored car parked, a truck parked in the trees, some other unidentified vehicle under netting, a pickup on the move, and some vehicle also on the move. These strikes on vehicles entering a major combat area are reminiscent of the road of death into Artemovsk/Bakhmut when Wagner forces had the road under fire.

Операция Z: Военкоры Русской Весны

Russian UCAV footage in Kursk region, here they apparently strike a bridge near Mahnovka.


Russian Iskander strike takes out allegedly either an S-300 element or a Buk-M1, it's hard to tell.


Russian Iskander hits Ukrainian vehicles, on the north-eastern outskirts of Sumy city.


Russian Tornado-S hits Ukrainian vehicles, in the village of Boromlya south of Sudzha.


Another knocked out Stryker in Kursk region. It has an interesting looking turret. It might be the same one we see in the links above getting hit.


A captured Kozak armored car in Russian service, with the 155th Marines, was knocked out in Kursk region.


Russian soldiers examine smashed Ukrainian vehicles. There's a MT-LB, a BMP-1, and a Kozak armored car. Note the clean MT-LB with the robust drone cage in the first link is Russian. In the second link you can see the Ukrainian MT-LB covered by snow and without such a cage.


Some footage of Russia's VVS 1st Motor-Rifle Rgt formed presumably out of airfield security formations. This unit first went into combat around Korenevo when Ukraine went into Kursk region. Apparently they're still active.


Ukrainian CV90 and M1 Abrams near the border of Kursk region.


Russian Akhmat artillery operating a D-30, Kursk region.


Russian Tornado-G in the Kursk area from the 52nd Artillery Bde. Pre-war Russia produced 1 btln per year, but we've had no news of deliveries during the war. On the other hand before the war all 122mm rocket artillery was in tank and motor-rifle units. Artillery brigades had BM-27s. I've never heard of this unit before so it's possible this is a new unit. There is a practice of forming new units from scratch and handing them new equipment from fresh deliveries.


Kharkov area.

Russian forces made small gains inside Volchansk. Overall the front near Kharkov remains static.


Kupaynsk area.

Russian forces have taken all or almost all of Topoli on the Russian border. It's still a good distance to the other crossing, but this bridgehead can be supplied from the Russian side of the border and can be expanded westwards along the line of Ukrainian defenses on the border, instead of into the teeth. It can also go southward to meet up with Russian forces heading north out of Figolevka. East of Kupyansk Russian forces have restarted advances, biting off a couple of tree lines.


Russian drones stalk the streets of Kovsharovka, south of the Kupyansk-Uzlovoy town. A local civilian waves at the drone as it passes by. This isn't the first time we've seen Russian drones offer good enough resolution to easily bypass civilians and strike only military targets.

 

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
Oskol front.

Near Borovaya Ukraine's 3rd Assault bde (Azov) launches Darts loitering munitions.


Across from Terny Russian forces have expanded northward and captured Novolyubovka. In the south they've taken all of Yampolovka.


Russian Grad operations on the Krasniy Liman axis. Note the anti-drone picket. This Grad doesn't have armored plates on the cabin, just a drone cage of dubious value.


Russian UAV crews flying a Merlin-VR UAV to direct M-46 fires.


Seversk salient.


It appears Russia has finally taken all of Belogorovka, all of the refuse mound, and the area between the two.


Chasov Yar.


South of Chasov Yar Russian forces have retaken the entire mine complex area and are advancing on Stupochki. North of Chasov Yar Russian forces have taken all of Grigorievka.


Russia's 98th VDV evacuates a wounded vehicle driver near Chasov Yar. The vehicle looks like it might be a BMP-3 or BMD-4M.


Russian strike on a Ukrainian tank in the village of Verolyubovka, west of Chasov Yar, north of Konstantinovka.


Toretsk.


Ukrainian forces have recaptured parts of northern Scherbinovka.


This is allegedly December footage of a Russian soldier interacting with civilians in Dzerzhisnk/Toretsk. However I have some doubts. The buildings look very intact, and there are only a few areas of apartments like that in Toretsk, all of which saw heavy fighting. If this is indeend the general area of Toretsk, I suspect this is Artemovo/Zheleznoe, the town south-east of Toretsk, between it and Gorlovka. That are was taken faster and it's far likelier that some intact areas survived.


Pokrovsk area.

South-west of Pokrovsk Russian forces have taken the village of Zaporozhye, all of Nadeevka, and have taken a number of fields. In Kotlin Russian forces have retaken all the positions in the village and the mine offices, but haven't retaken the farm buildings north of it or the mine ventilation shaft. On the eastern flank Ukrainian forces have retaken the intersection for the third time.


Ukrainian Bradley counter-attacking near Nadeevka. It and the dismounts get hit.


Russian forces hit a Kirpi MRAP near Udachnoe. The vehicle looks stuck.


Russian drones double-tap a Leo-1A5 near Novosergeevka, west of Uspenovka.


Russian strike on a Krab howitzer near Grishino, north-west of Pokrovsk.


Drone wars continue, Russian drone strikes a Ukrainian UGV south of Pokrovsk, near the village of Belgiyka.


Russian VT-40 drone strikes near Zverevo, one hits allegedly a mine-clearing vehicle (hard to tell, something on a tracked chassis and engineering related), another an armored car or MRAP of some sort that's unloading troops.


A series of Russian drone strikes in the village of Zaporozhye.


Novonikolaevka, Dnepropetrovsk region, Ukraine attempts to set up defenses but a Russian drone strikes the truck.


Russian Buk-M2 radar, uparmored with what looks like rusty sheet metal, near Pokrovskoe. The armoring looks surprisingly neatly made, not typical of improvised up-armoring, but it's unpainted and firmly rusted, so factory made kits are unlikely.


Kurakhovo area.

Ulakli has fallen completely to advancing Russian forces. Konstantinopol' is also contested. All of Andreevka is under Russian control and west of Andreevka Russian forces continue to advance


Russian drone hits a T-72M1 near Bogatyr'.


Velikaya Novoselka.

Russian pushes in this area are continuing. West of the village Russian forces are pushing north, approaching Burlatskoe. Across the river Russian forces have grabbed the village of Novoocheretovatoe. They're also advancing on the east shore of the river northward.


Russian mechanized assault on Novoselka, from the 57th Motor-Rifles. Note this is the same unit we saw using an up-armored GAZ-66 to deliver an infantry team. Now they appear to have armored vehicles and an MBT. They drop off the infantry and pull out.


Russian D-30SN strike destroys a bridge between Komar and Fedorovka north of Velikaya Novoselka.

 

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
Zaporozhye.

Russian forces have re-entered Pyatihatka. The village itself is in a lowland area and isn't particularly significant.


Allegedly Russian strikes on Ukrainian infantry and a tank near Pyatihatka. The tank explodes and then burns.


Dnepr front.

Russia hit the shipyards in Kherson with gliding bombs, allegedly Ukrainian drone operators were staged there. Note the shipyards themselves are non-functioning and most of the city remains empty.


Russian strikes inside Kherson, target unclear.


Russian BMP-3M on the Dnepr. There's an EW kit over the roof cage.


Strikes.

Reportedly the night of Feb 21st-22nd saw a huge Russian drone wave hit Ukraine, 267 drones reported.


A large attack wave, some reports have it at over 50 UAVs hit Kiev. It appears almost none got intercepted.


At least some downed UAVs hit residential buildings.


Unrelated and earlier then the striker above, Russian Shaheds hit rail infrastructure near Belaya Tserkov, Kiev area. I'm not sold they're aiming for those train tracks, it might be a miss or a downed Shahed.


Russia hit a Ukrainian gas works near Mirnoe, Kharkov region. This is the second such strike after the recent one in Poltava, and it seems that Russia is targeting these as part of some new approach. Some sources claim that as a combination of these strikes Ukraine has lost 40% of their natural gas production, though presumably this is temporary.


Russia hit the Karlovka fuel storage facility in Poltava region, no good BDA is available at least that I saw.


Russian strike on alleged Ukrainian munition storage in the Fedorovskoe area of Dnepropetrovsk region. Reportedly the target was initially hit by a Kh-59 or 69, and then finished off by drones.


Russia hit a restaurant in Krivoy Rog with an Iskander. A gas station across the street also blew up but it's unlikely to be the target.


Russia hit Odessa region. Targets include power grid substations and the Il'chevskiy fishery port. Reportedly there were 15 explosions across the region. Note footage is from two waves of strikes.


Ukraine hit the Syzranskiy oil refinery in Samara region. It caused a fire, no major damage is reported, but that doesn't mean it's there.


Ukrainian inbounds over Belgorod, Russian air defenses are firing.


A downed Ukrainian UAV in Sevastopol', type unknown.


A Russian Kamaz with an AK-306 ship-based SHORAD mounted on it, presumably for drone defense. Not the worst idea, assuming they have some sort of decent fire control.


Interesting bits.


Another Russian Buk-M3 decoy gets hit. The fact that they hit 3 should have been a giveaway. There are tiny quantities of Buk-M3s in the entire Russian armed forces. The last we saw was in Zaporozhye, in the last update, this one has no location, but the flurry of footage suggests at least some quantity was delivered recently and deployed.


Ukraine hit what appears to be a Koksan DPRK SP howitzer. If correct, this is the first time one got hit, but it was always a matter of time.


A knocked out Russian T-80BVM with the new turret-based expanded drone cage. It also has smoke launchers set up over the cage (the circles on the back). This new cage design showed up in 2024.


A rare shot of a Russian S-350 in Ukraine, note the up-armoring. This modern SAM remains very rare in Russian service.


A new Russian interceptor drone has been spotted, it's unclear if it's a factory model or something improvised, though the paintjob suggests the former.


A Russian BTR-82A with an improvised mine trawl of questionable effectiveness. There's still no factory-made solution for BMPs, BTRs, or the various MRAPs Russia fields.


Another Russian Sarmat-3, this one with a drone cage. These armored cars are one of the few new vehicles Russia has started accepting for service during this war and it appears some quantity continue to be getting delivered as rare but regular sightings persist.


A Russian Kamaz with the fully armored cabin from Remdizel. Note this isn't a kit for existing trucks, but a new cabin.


Russian BMP-2 tank sheds, with smoke launchers mounted on the exterior. Note the extra-armor kit on the actual vehicle. It's ironic that pre-war many commentators criticized the Kurganets-25 for being too tall, and now this is the norm.


A Russian soldier poses with a Turkish Hatsan BTS12 shotgun, unclear if that's his weapon or a trophy.


A quick look at recent Russian recruitment efforts, advertising 2.3 mln to 4 mln rouble bonuses. It also advertises debt forgiveness of up to 10 mln roubles, a pardon for crimes, and free land alottments. I wonder if it's possible to rack up 10 mln rouble in debts just to have them written off this way.


Ukraine's 117th TerDef Bde with Romanian APR-40 MLRS.


Ukraine's 44th Mech with Leo-1A5s. We've seen a lot of Leo-1s in recent training footage from a variety of units but they remain relatively rare on the front line. It suggests Ukraine is holding some forces back.


Another look at the Archers of Ukraine's 43rd Arty Bde. The unit also operates PzH-2000, 2S7s, and Giatsint cannons.


Another sighting of Copperhead guided artillery shells in Ukrainian service being fired from an M109.


Ukraine will reportedly get another aid package from Sweden, 107 mln euros, in the form of MANPADS and AAA.


There are reports that Belgium will delay their F-16 deliveries to Ukraine by a year.

 

KipPotapych

Well-Known Member
This is rather funny though:

IMG_8824.jpeg

To note here, the American resolution had passed in the UNSC, with the UK, France, and Denmark, in particular, abstaining. Something something louder than words? I’d say so.

P. S. Thanks for the update, Feanor.
 

Big_Zucchini

Well-Known Member
I never understood, why EU even supported the Kurds that heavily to begin with. The YPG were an alliance of covenience, against Isis. Turkey both as a member of NATO and a check on Russia in the caucus region is too valuable for EU to lose over a small ethnic militia group.
ISIS was never an issue in itself. There were and still are plenty of terrorist orgs like it and some even more extremist - Hamas, Al Qaeda, Hezbollah.
It was always a casus belli.
Russia came in to allegedly defeat ISIS, but stayed past its destruction and allied itself with other terrorist organizations like Hezbollah in the process.
The US came in to allegedly defeat ISIS but practically also overstayed, guarding its Kurdish allies, resources, and an important junction between Iraq-Syria-Jordan (Al Tanf base).

Turkey may be in NATO but NATO does not limit its members freedom to pursue independent policies, even against allies in and out of NATO.
Turkey won't leave NATO on its own even if pushed. Its rule is fragile, it lacks a nuclear deterrent, conventionally it is in many ways also a paper tiger per regional custom, and it has surrounded itself with enemies for very little strategic gain in return.

Another reason the US has to step in and keep Turkey off Syria is to prevent a power competition between Turkey and Israel. With Erdogan promising to succeed Iran as the regional center for export of terrorism, it'll need, similarly to Iran, spend huge resources it doesn't have, to try and compete. This will, however, leave Turkey vulnerable from every other direction, and will put its territorial and political integrity at severe risk.

Even the Abstention list. There is Argentina, Milei prior to election win was heavily pro Ukr and very antti Russia. But the man will take his cues from Trump.
Milei is hawkish, it makes sense.
"This resolution is about condemning Russia" - is an overly simplistic view. Here we are supposed to analyze things a bit deeper.
"This resolution is part of a Euro-US tug of war regarding Ukraine policy" - is a more accurate view. There's more to it, but this at least should be the basis.
So while Russia indeed voted against it, the US's vote against has less to do with its sentiment toward Russia, and more to do with the way it wants to move forward regarding European security.

Look at the company who voted against condemning Russia. I mean we all kind of expected Trump to be a bit biased to Putin, but this level of kowtowing is insane. His supporters are convinced that this is 4D chess and will ensure Chinese-Russian seperation. But man does that seem wild.
Sure, let's briefly go over it.

A handful of African nations - Russia gained influence in some African areas recently, makes a lot of sense. Some are also more aligned with the US and want to get some cookie points.

Micro nations and Americas - always vote together with the US. Also makes a lot of sense. It's automatic. If you don't believe me, just look at their usual voting pattern.

Pro-Russia European nations - Belarus, Hungary. Does it really surprise you?

Israel - Only one that surprised some people, not me. Like micro nations it also votes automatically with the US in exchange for US almost always voting in its favor. Also Ukraine has a long record of voting against Israel, so this may also be political retaliation.


I cannot find a single voter against that doesn't make at least some sense.

It's a common narrative that Trumpy runs foreign policy the same way he runs businesses, and that he's some clumsy buffoon that doesn't realize what he's doing. Once again an overly simplistic view that, like a broken clock it'll get you the right conclusion from time to time, but it won't be consistent.
Barring some decisions that IMO are net harmful, like opposition to the TikTok ban, it seems Trumpy's policies can be simply derived from a hawkish worldview on enemies, and egalitarian worldview on allies.

If we look at the grand picture, Ukraine is just part of a larger issue called "European security". And European security won't be guaranteed until Europe takes its security seriously.
But to that there are also prerequisites. Europe once did have armies and navies and air forces and such. Why all of a sudden were they nearly entirely disbanded?
Because naturally you need an enemy to prepare for (or perish at his hands). Russia invaded in 2008, then again in 2014, then again in 2022. Why throughout this period did Europe not prepare? Because they already had an army - The US Army. And an air force - The US Air Force. And a navy - The US Navy. Why would they make any defense investments if in a hypothetical Russian invasion they'll only lose Poland, Ukraine, the small baltics, and nordic countries? Small sacrifices anyway. And if Russia moves even further west it'll just meet an American armed force.

So to me it seems the best solution isn't to show Europe an enemy, but to show that their shield has expired, and now they need to pay for one of their own.

I honestly don't know what Trumpy is doing exactly right now. I can only guess. But I'm observing from the side and I'm seeing European countries starting to talk about finally ramping up defense production and forming armed forces, and that's amazing!
I don't judge people by their words. I judge by their actions. And the actions I see are yielding a positive effect. If European politicians that cowardly slashed defense budgets to a pathetic ~2% (or sub-2%) feel like they need to lash out at Trumpy to justify things, so be it. As long as they can actually fight.
 

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
Remarkable level of european unity in yesterday's UN vote.
Even more impressive if you think that the US voted against.
View attachment 52341
Votes are cheap. Especially when you can immediately apologize for voting that way afterwards. Let's see them actually provide Ukraine with sufficient materiel to win the war (as opposed to losing slowly). That would show some unity.
 

rsemmes

Member
Ukraine has agreed terms with the United States on a crucial minerals deal, a Ukrainian government source has told Sky News.

Also FT.
Ukrainian officials say Kyiv is now ready to sign the agreement on jointly developing its mineral resources, including oil and gas, after the US dropped demands for a right to $500bn in potential revenue from exploiting the resources.

Is Ukraine fracking?
 

Big_Zucchini

Well-Known Member
Right on cue.
For a country seemingly upset about US disengagement and "siding with Putin", they sure seem glad to sign a deal with major strategic importance (with ramifications for generations to come), even when the hate wagon generated an allegedly more "fair" Ukraine-EU deal proposal.

Truth is, there is not going to be any disengagement. Trumpy just gave his voter base the "casus belli", a deal that shifts Ukraine from "freeloaders" to strategic partners.
With or without American re-engagement in Europe, aid to Ukraine will likely soon shift to a higher gear.

Oh and the draft I read yesterday, if it hadn't changed drastically, contained a section lifting Ukraine's investment commitment to the joint fund from 50% to 66% for resources extracted from currently designated "Russian occupied Ukrainian territories".
Ukraine already has an inherent interest in returning its territories. What it does is it increases the US's interest in those territories, specifically under Ukrainian control.


EDIT: @rsemmes you beat me to it by 6 minutes. Damn.
 
Top