Arms race: Greece & Turkey
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Mmmh, I really like the camo Greece uses for it's forces. 
BTW, are there plans to add some more PzH2000? As long as I know the Greek army is satisfied with the performance of the system but the numbers are not that big.
And did the Greek army bought the whole ADLER (II) system including COBRA fire finder radar or do they implement the PzH2000 into another already existing system?
BTW, are there plans to add some more PzH2000? As long as I know the Greek army is satisfied with the performance of the system but the numbers are not that big.
And did the Greek army bought the whole ADLER (II) system including COBRA fire finder radar or do they implement the PzH2000 into another already existing system?
I guess the different camo is due to the change in the geography and fauna of Thrace due to global warming, we really need to take better care of the environment.
Anyway good pics, thanks guys.
Cheers.
@waylander
Greek Army is satisified with PzH2000, there was an option for 12 more of them, if the option is still open, then we will learn more about this program soon.
Before a year or a bit more the army was thinking about 48 Dutch and German reserves systems, but since then nothing happened, maybe because the cost to bring them in the same level with PzH2000GR was high.
About your other questions i don't know but i will look to find something
Greek Army is satisified with PzH2000, there was an option for 12 more of them, if the option is still open, then we will learn more about this program soon.
Before a year or a bit more the army was thinking about 48 Dutch and German reserves systems, but since then nothing happened, maybe because the cost to bring them in the same level with PzH2000GR was high.
About your other questions i don't know but i will look to find something
Atilla [TR]
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I was wondering if he understood. And yes he talks about the Turkish army a lot yet he puts pictures of Greek army.@Attila what you said means "why you show the pics of Greek army my friend?"
right?
:@waylander
I found something for you my friend.
Greece has the Arthur Weapon Location System (WLS), it is comparable to the Cobra you mentioned. Also operational are also the TPQ-37 and TPQ-36.
With the use of M-557 Α2 Fire Direction System.
The truth is that the numbers of PzH2000GR in service are small, so in the future i think more of these systems will be on service.
I found something for you my friend.
Greece has the Arthur Weapon Location System (WLS), it is comparable to the Cobra you mentioned. Also operational are also the TPQ-37 and TPQ-36.
With the use of M-557 Α2 Fire Direction System.
The truth is that the numbers of PzH2000GR in service are small, so in the future i think more of these systems will be on service.
@waylander
Such info weren't published but the Dutch PzH2000 and Pzh2000GR had differences in 350 points (!!!!), the price that each of the Dutch vehicles were offered was 4,000,000 Euros, including the expenses to make it in the same standard as PzH2000GR.
One of the differences i know about is that PzH2000GR (as long as Leo2HEL, ARTHUR, some FAC's and other systems) have a WISPR system which is developed from INTRACOM SA.
Such info weren't published
but the Dutch PzH2000 and Pzh2000GR had differences in 350 points (!!!!), the price that each of the Dutch vehicles were offered was 4,000,000 Euros, including the expenses to make it in the same standard as PzH2000GR.One of the differences i know about is that PzH2000GR (as long as Leo2HEL, ARTHUR, some FAC's and other systems) have a WISPR system which is developed from INTRACOM SA.
contedicavour
New Member
The F35 is multi-role, not meant for bombing... a bit like the F16. The Navy will use it eventually to replace F18s, while the Marines and the RN and the Italian Navy will use it to replace the Harriers.Atilla [TR];136170 said:
Once it's equipped with AIM 120 C or Meteor it's one hell of a A2A fighter !
cheers
Ah, yeah the Greek battlefield management system makes sense.@waylander
Such info weren't published
One of the differences i know about is that PzH2000GR (as long as Leo2HEL, ARTHUR, some FAC's and other systems) have a WISPR system which is developed from INTRACOM SA.
But the other points would be really interesting.
I can hardly imagine them being major expensive points.
Maybe ammo integration into the FCS?
But shouldn't be that big of a problem, too.
Atilla [TR]
New Member
No it is called T-155 Firtina. It is copied of of a Korean Panzer but it is made in Turkey and has Turkish electronics.You are right it looks like "undeployed" Stinger
Maybe we will never know most of the differences, except if someone of us serves in both armies
I thought that the ventilation system would be different but as far as i know, Dutch systems were deployed in Afghanistan, so i don't think they modified them just to send them there.
I searched about the artillery program i told you, and is running now, there is a demand for 190 new systems, this program is estimated at 1 billion Euros. I think that the winner is without question PzH2000, it would surprise me a lot to see another winner.
I thought that the ventilation system would be different but as far as i know, Dutch systems were deployed in Afghanistan, so i don't think they modified them just to send them there.
I searched about the artillery program i told you, and is running now, there is a demand for 190 new systems, this program is estimated at 1 billion Euros. I think that the winner is without question PzH2000, it would surprise me a lot to see another winner.
As long as the problems that occur are solved there is always room for future deals.
If someone looks the recent Greek Army's history he will find how many deals were made with German companies, especially KMW, so there is no doubt about KMW's reliability and the relations with Greek Army.
There was an article in a Greek newspaper about the suppliers of weapon systems for the armed forces.
According to the MBT's, when the Leo2HEL program will be completed and all the old MBT's are withdrawn then the percentages of the systems will be 60,60% German made and 39,40% US made.
According to the Artillery the percentages in 2007 were 88,69% US made, Czech 8,3%, German 1,72% , Italian 1,29%. Of course with the new artillery program, the percentages will change, i hope in favour of Germany.
Another interesting information is that the BMP-3 IFV's, that were bought by Greece, will be produced in Greek industries, in a percentage of 30% of the whole vehicle. And the Russian side have offered 40 BMP-3F's amphibious vehicles to be used with the Greek Marine Corps.
Finally, Cyprus will buy 41 new MBT's. This program begun about 1 year ago and now the offers are in the final stage of valuation. The MBT's offered are the Russian T-80, the French MX-30B2 and the Ukrainian T-84UD. Cyprus has in service T-80's and MX-30B2.
The surprise of this program was that KMW offered Leo-1A5! The offer was out of date and it wasn't counted.
If someone looks the recent Greek Army's history he will find how many deals were made with German companies, especially KMW, so there is no doubt about KMW's reliability and the relations with Greek Army.
There was an article in a Greek newspaper about the suppliers of weapon systems for the armed forces.
According to the MBT's, when the Leo2HEL program will be completed and all the old MBT's are withdrawn then the percentages of the systems will be 60,60% German made and 39,40% US made.
According to the Artillery the percentages in 2007 were 88,69% US made, Czech 8,3%, German 1,72% , Italian 1,29%. Of course with the new artillery program, the percentages will change, i hope in favour of Germany.
Another interesting information is that the BMP-3 IFV's, that were bought by Greece, will be produced in Greek industries, in a percentage of 30% of the whole vehicle. And the Russian side have offered 40 BMP-3F's amphibious vehicles to be used with the Greek Marine Corps.
Finally, Cyprus will buy 41 new MBT's. This program begun about 1 year ago and now the offers are in the final stage of valuation. The MBT's offered are the Russian T-80, the French MX-30B2 and the Ukrainian T-84UD. Cyprus has in service T-80's and MX-30B2.
The surprise of this program was that KMW offered Leo-1A5! The offer was out of date and it wasn't counted.
AMX-30B2 against T-80??? Surplus or what???
Cyprus has already 41 T-80 and about 100 AMX-30, the info was for 41 new MBT's.
AMX-30B2 is pretty old and cannot be compared to T-80.
Also to prevent any questions about German exports to Cyprus. The embargo which was imposed by Germany was cancelled when Cyprus joined the European Union.
AMX-30B2 is pretty old and cannot be compared to T-80.
Also to prevent any questions about German exports to Cyprus. The embargo which was imposed by Germany was cancelled when Cyprus joined the European Union.
Dear eliaslar,
Excuse me but you have said that the MBT's offered are the Russian T-80, the French MX-30B2 and the Ukrainian T-84UD. Is there a typo? (maybe you have mistakenly written AMX-30B2 instead of LeClerc) or did the French indeed offer AMX-30?
the info i read was about AMX-30B2 i was also shocked about this, because it's a pretty old MBT.
here is the link
http://strategy-geopolitics.blogspot.com/2007/08/41.html
unfortunately it's in Greek, but in the first lines of the second paragraph you can see the candidates.
i was also shocked about this, because it's a pretty old MBT.here is the link
http://strategy-geopolitics.blogspot.com/2007/08/41.html
unfortunately it's in Greek, but in the first lines of the second paragraph you can see the candidates.
The BMP purchase spunds indeed good if one has to buy a certain number of IFVs with a limited budget. Greece would have been hard pressed to get the same number of western IFVs with that budget.
As for Cyprus. I would opt for the T-80s. Gives you alot of bang for the money and is a good way of standardizing the equipment. Maybe the T-84 might also be a good option and I defenitely would like to see Ukraine sell some of them.
As for Cyprus. I would opt for the T-80s. Gives you alot of bang for the money and is a good way of standardizing the equipment. Maybe the T-84 might also be a good option and I defenitely would like to see Ukraine sell some of them.
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