Royal Australian Navy Discussions and Updates 2.0
- Thread starter OPSSG
- Start date
iambuzzard
Well-Known Member
It looks like 8 on each ship. I'm not sure how many hulls.
I wouldn't trust Johnston to tie his shoe laces.
An election coming so Murdoch sticks the boot into Australian industry, what a suprise.
BAE staff have just gone out on strike, it appears their wages are 20% below current market rates, and they've only been offered 12% over three years. That sure doesn't sound like the unions have been rorting etc. it actually sounds like they have let their members down.
Lots of speculation around at the moment, about the only facts I've seen recently are, the RAN has six Collins class boats, they were built by ASC, designed by Kockums and they are getting a life extension. Pretty much everything else is people who don't know guessing.
downunderblue
Active Member
Including the d/PM by the sounds of it.
I'm not anti union but tired of bloated contracts. I saw the AMWU press release about the 30% increase request over 3 years with only 15% offered. As for whether they are underpaid or overpaid etc, it all depends upon scarcity. I just don't want to see the bill going up in similar fashion.
The Allen govt was asked how they could afford paying nurses some 30% more over 3 years (or similar) to which the new Premier replied "the usual way". She meant debt borrowing but didn't have the guts to say it.
Public monies should always be utilised like they're your own, and to quote someone, you ego can't keep writing cheques you body can't cash.
As for Johnson, he was widely criticised due to his language but he did have a point.
I've worked in engineering on major projects for decades, our pay is, if not below what we were paid a decade or decade and a half ago, well below CPI. In the same time financial sector and non technical PMs salaries have gone through the roof, literally doubled in some cases.
Reality check, the issues we are having is project management, contract management, administration and management in general, the highest paid are the least qualified, the least professional and the least competent. Yet the blame is thrown at those who deign, build and fix things.
Maybe if the people who actually needed to be qualified to do their jobs were paid more than the unqualified people who manage, if they, instead of unqualified managers, were in-charge, things would be better?
Many managers used to be engineers or even came off the tools, now they are admin people who fall into PM, contracts and administration roles. Think on that.
I wasn't going to say it, but I need to. The kids who weren't good at maths and science, follow an easier, kinder path into device related roles. Because of the low intellectual bar, and the lack of anything actually quantifiable, they are promoted on popularity and likability. They end up as senior managers and directors, decision makers.
The actual doers, the smart skilled people, unless they strike out on their own as sole traders contractors or consultants, are subordinate to the popular but dumb ones. Actually, even if they are contractors or consultants, they are still subordinate to the dumb fs.
Then when shot goes wrong, who gets the blame? The dumb f manager? No it's the smart person who wasn't listened to.
Last edited:
2 are currently fitted with NSM, 2 more in the process of being kitted out right now. 2 more should have them fitted by the end of the year.
d-ron84
Member
And two will never have NSM grace their decks
Surface Fleet down to 2 Hobarts and 6 Anzacs by the end of 2026, surely we can do something to increase the size between now and 2035?
2026> 2 Hobart, 6 Anzac = 8 ships
2029> 3 Hobart, 1 GPF, 5 Anzac = 8 ships
2032> 3 Hobart, 3 GPF, 2 Anzac = 8 ships
2035> 3 Hobart, 4 GPF, 1 Hunter, 0 Anzacs = 8 ships
2026> 2 Hobart, 6 Anzac = 8 ships
2029> 3 Hobart, 1 GPF, 5 Anzac = 8 ships
2032> 3 Hobart, 3 GPF, 2 Anzac = 8 ships
2035> 3 Hobart, 4 GPF, 1 Hunter, 0 Anzacs = 8 ships
StevoJH
The Bunker Group
Sure there is, accelerate Hunter and order GPF ASAP.
It all comes down to money and workforce.
https://www.defence.gov.au/defence-activities/projects/hunter-class-frigate
The above shows the first Hunter should have been accepted by 2032 (so operational and under the control of the RAN) and the second by 2034.
I haven't seen anything on the decommissioning plan for the ANZACs outside of the first two. I'm assuming Reptillia your numbers above are estimates? There is the potential to slow this down a fraction. Even a two year delay on the above would have a profound effect on the fleet size. I know it is driven by ship condition and crew availability, but there is time to manage this.
"One lesson learned is the ultimate reality that despite air warfare commanders and guided missile destroyers, each ship is responsible for its own self defense. As part of the ongoing COMPTUEX, the U.S. Navy is preparing the Gerald R. Ford‘s crew for the eventuality that it may need to use its own Close In Weapon Systems (CIWS) to engage incoming missiles or drones. This includes both the Phalanx 20mm and the Mk-49 Guided Missile Launching System (GMLS)." (Source: Navalnews.com)
USN has realised the fantasy of 100% protection of capital ships by their escorts... when will the RAN provide some credible self defence to the LHDs?
USN has realised the fantasy of 100% protection of capital ships by their escorts... when will the RAN provide some credible self defence to the LHDs?
You cant accelerate the first Hunter build and the GPF selection was always 2025 for 2026 steel cutting. Even if they selected the winner right now, you could not speed up the delivery time.
Mitsubishi begins the build of 2 upgraded Mogamis this year and then 3 in 2026. If they gave us the 1st or 2nd, it would be late 2028 delivery. Ship 3, 4 or 5 2029 delivery. (Articles have stated ship 3 or even 2 could be the 1st delivered to the RAN.) = 1x2028 or 2029, 1x2029 or 2030, 1x2030 or 2031 at the earliest.
TKMS build an A200 in about 2.5-3 years so if steel is cut in mid 2026, the first would be delivered in 2029, the 2nd could be delivered in 2029/2030 and the 3rd in 2030 at the earliest.
Last edited:
StevoJH
The Bunker Group
1) Hunter class can be accelerated as long as all the long lead items have been ordered, it just requires throwing more equipment and workers at the problem.
2) If the GoD is truly concerned about fleet numbers, they can just order 3-4 each of A200 (ideally configured as close to a current ANZAC as possible) AND upgraded Mogami from overseas and then move the build of whichever is the preferred to either Perth or Adelaide for later units.
The workforce at Osborne has to be built up again, that takes time.
The planned GPF build starts 2029/2030 at Henderson. Osborne is building the Hunter, no room to build GPF simultaneously.
Ordering both Upgraded Mogamis and MEKO A200s ain’t gonna happen…
downunderblue
Active Member
If I said that, I'd immediately get "ok boomer".
I assume your comments didn't come out right? You're not assuming that a decision on whether or not to study sciences is dictated on intellect or resilience/ strength?
Two out of three of my kids are not in the sciences yet I'm more optimistic of their future impact on the world than ever. Quite often sciences are good for linear thinking, but I've found that in life it's anything but linear.
From a recruitment pov, should we only recruit science graduates into ADFA as the rest are soft?
I met Keith Woolahan before he was elected to parliament. He served three tours in Afghanistan, the last as a Captain in the Commandos working with the SASR. He holds university qualifications in Arts, Commerce and later Law and later left the Army to work at Mallesons, before seeking preselection. We talked about tfamily, our country, the impact of trauma, service and honour and I came away sensing someone who was anything but soft, and someone likely to have a positive impact on our society.
We all have our bias, which are often valid assumptions formed by our experiences, bu in holding them we apply blinkers not enabling us to see what's truely out there. I've found in life it's best to listen more and assume less, but again I here your opinion and assume from your experience it makes perfect sense. I can respect that but again from my experience find there is more to life than black and white.
That's correct at this stage.And two will never have NSM grace their decks
iambuzzard
Well-Known Member
Thanks Pusser01
Going Boeing
Well-Known Member
Although it’s desirable to have those two Anzacs kept as a “Reserve fleet”, I suspect that HMAS Anzac is being stripped of usable parts to keep the remainder of the fleet going with a similar fate awaiting HMAS Arunta.