Pakistan Air Force [PAF] News and Discussions

[tphuang]

they are not the same size. One has 1 engine, one has 2, how can they be?

For your information, su-30 is not necessarily better than F-16. If it's such a beast, I wonder how it still manages to loose to J-10 everytime in pla's own internal air exercises.

It depends on which versions you are comparing. su-30 isn't that much more seasoned. The first J-10 achieved certification in 2003 and joined service in 2004, when do you think the first su-30mki joined service (no, I'm not talking about su-30k, but mki)? The reliability part is hard to say too. J-10 hasn't had any crash since the prototype crash in the 90s. Compared to the flankers in pla, it's been quite safe.

 

[BilalK]

They use the same type of engine.
J-10 has 10-11 hardpoints as opposed to Su-30's.

And just look at them physically.
http://www.sinodefence.com/airforce/fighter/j10_gallery1.asp

 

[TheDefender]

The J-10 is the first Chinese indigenous fighter aircraft to be equipped with real beyond-vision-range (BVR) combat capability. However, it appears that the aircraft still lacks the extensive air-to-ground weapons found on the Russian-made multirole fighter such as Su-30MKK.
Guys I didnt know that one visit of the President can change the whole situation of the AC deals.Pakistan was running after Russians for the MKI's but how can they give it to Pakistan without the approval from India.Now there are more chances of J-10 then any other western or Russian fighter i.e the Rafales , Gripens or any others which are in PAF's list or not.J-10 is okey but the range of this AC worries me.see its specification mentioned in the
sinodefence.

SPECIFICATIONS

Crew: 1 (basic variant); 2 (fighter-trainer variant)
Dimensions: N/A
Weight: N/A
Max Speed: Mach 1.2 (sea-level) or Mach 2.0 (high altitude)
Range: Combat radius over 550km
Service Ceiling: N/A
Max Climb Rate: N/A
G Limit: N/A

What do you guys is this enough range for a fighter which paf IS acquiring and it would reamin in the Airforce till 2030 and will replace the F-16s.I am putting a big question mark on its range ?????? the Chineese engineers must consider this factor important and should do something for it.There is no harm if you are getting a greater range or rather sit and say its okey... its enough.

By the way the engine problem is still there same as the thunders....

 

[tphuang]

That's the thing, J-10 uses one AL-31FN and su-27 uses two AL-31F. A huge difference in size. su-30 is at least 2.5 times the mass of J-10.

J-10's combat radius should be comparable to flankers (in the 1500 KM range) and probably 3000 KM+ ferry range. Let's put it this, JF-17's combat radius is listed as 1350KM on sinodefense, how can J-10's combat radius be less than that?

 

[TheDefender]

That's the thing, J-10 uses one AL-31FN and su-27 uses two AL-31F. A huge difference in size. su-30 is at least 2.5 times the mass of J-10.

J-10's combat radius should be comparable to flankers (in the 1500 KM range) and probably 3000 KM+ ferry range. Let's put it this, JF-17's combat radius is listed as 1350KM on sinodefense, how can J-10's combat radius be less than that?

Dont forget that there is a huge variety of Russian weapon which J-10 is using if PAF cant get the enignes from russian then how they can allow the weapon to be sold to Pakistan ..... the third AC for PAF is becoming a whirlpool.
And I hope that PAF would lack the midair refueling for its ACs till 2050.

 

[Gaenth]

:coffee This is cool I've learned more about Chinese fighters in this forum than in any other place.

I would strike out Grippens from the list, because of payload and possibly range. So it would be between Typhoon and Rafale, Typhoon is more expensive and if exported to Pakistan I'm not sure it will come with all of its much needed avionics. Rafale has had a hard time selling outside, and there's again the issue of France being partner with India for the avionics of IAF equipment.

Flankers are out for grabs but J-10 has many added benefits: A single engine (less maintanance), maneuverability, newer design, higher potential of development, possibly cheaper per copy and a partnership with China that will be beneficial in the long run in many ways, problem here is how soon can it be delivered? Oh! And guys, can you post the links you visit for Chinese Aircraft?

 

[aaaditya]

aaaditya, where did you read that article? Source of that information?

You've been here long enough to know that you had to post the source of the information along with your claims.

this article was posted on the bharat rakshak forum,but the link was not given(the article was posted in its entirety),i could have have posted the url of the bharat rakshak page,however i was aware of some rule stating that we are not supposed to post from other forums.

 

[mysterious]

Bharat Rakshak? Folks, I suggest we forget about this until it is confirmed by a credible source.

 

[hovercraft]

is there any chance for pak to get su-37?

 

[Scorpius]

nope.don't think so.

 

[TheDefender]

is there any chance for pak to get su-37?

Stupid what a kind of question is this there is no chance that PAF can Su-37 first let Pakistan get those engines which are making trouble for PAF Air Defence requirements.Now there would be another trouble going on with the J-10 same old engine and the Weapon system problem.I dont know when this matters would be solved.
Hope for a miracle to happen.

 

[WAR]

Tanvir made new Chief of Air Staff

Link:
http://www.nation.com.pk/daily/feb-2006/28/index3.php



Tanvir made new Chief of Air Staff

From OUR correspondent
ISLAMABAD - The Government of Pakistan has designated Vice Chief of Air Staff Air Marshal Tanvir Mehmood Ahmed as next Chief of Air Staff.

He will assume the command of Pakistan Air Force on March 20, 2006 on the retirement of Air Chief Marshal Kaleem Saadat, the current Chief of Air Staff, said an official statement here on Monday.

Currently, he is serving as the Vice Chief of Air Staff for over two years, it added.

Air Marshal Tanvir Mahmood Ahmed was born in 1952 and got his initial education in Lahore. Subsequently after doing his FSc from PAF Public School, Sargodha, he joined PAF.

He graduated from PAF Academy, Risalpur, in April 1972 and went on to do Fighter and Operational Conversion courses. He first flew on the American F-86 (Sabre) and then flew all types of Chinese and French fighter aircraft on PAF inventory.

He is a qualified flying instructor (QFI) and Combat Commander on Fighter Aircraft. He commanded an elite fighter squadron the choicest F-16s Flg Wing, PAF Base Sargodha and the PAF Academy Risalpur.

In staff jobs Air Marshal has served as Deputy Director in Operations Branch, Personal Staff Officer to two Air Chiefs, Chief Project Director of F-16 Project, Senior Air Staff Officer at northern Air Command Peshawar and DG of Air Weapons Complex, Wah.

At senior staff assignments, Air Marshal Tanvir Mahmood Ahmed has the unique distinction of having served as Deputy Chief of Air Staff (Admin) and then Operations.

The Air Marshal has also served in UAE Air Force as a fighter instructor pilot. He is a graduate of Turkish Air War College, Turkey.

==================

I suppose, Air Marshal Aurengzeb Khan, the head of PAC Kamra would have been the better choice for the Chief of Air Staff, Pakistan Air Force. Superceding of officers in such sort of promotions is not a new phenomenon in the Pakistan Armed Forces. But then, this depends on the whims and wishes of the President !!!

 

[XEROX]

If it's such a beast, I wonder how it still manages to loose to J-10 everytime in pla's own internal air exercises.

I dont think you understood what i was sying, its a beast becouse its so huge compared with the J-10/Lavi/F-16

http://www.airliners.net/photos/small/8/5/7/906758.jpg

 

[SATAN]

Any recent news about the F-16s? From recent development it seems as if Musharaf has changed his mind about buying anymore falcons and going for the J-10 and a European Fighter. I wouldnt rule out a small purchase of used F-16s under the MNNA program to augment the current fleet.

 

[adsH]

And I hope that PAF would lack the midair refueling for its ACs till 2050.

I wouldn't be too sure about that, they should have that sorted by the end of there current procurement plan which is 2015.

 

[SABRE]

mid air refueling aircrafts are on the list PAF gave to PM (the 2k15 plan). No confirmation but i herd PAF will take some 2nd hand US mid air refueling aircrafts before 2010 once abt 20-30 (I am guessing the number) new F-16s capable of in air refueling join the force., while for the new ones i cant say when the deal would be signed nor when they will touch the Pakistani soil, but its going to be before 2015.

(hope every one knws the '2nd hand goes free' deal between Pakistan and USA).

 

[BilalK]

There was a Flight International Article/Interview back in 2004 with ACM Kaleem Sadaat; it said that the PAF had a requirement for "high altitude recon" helicopters. While there are a lot of reports circling about the PA requiring another attack helicopter in addition to the AH-F/S its already procuring.

Something else to note may be that the PAF currently possesses the infrastructure and capability to maintain and operate 100 active F-16A/B; currently there are 34 in service, and I assume it would be a financially (since they're free/very cheap) good decision to buy 66 more used F-16s. 55-75 F-16 Block-52/52+, 100 F-16A/B MLU, 150 JF-17 and 25-30 Plus One by 2015 would be a pretty strong force.

 

[umair]

According to a well conected member at pakdef, the first Saab-2000 for the PAF has either been fitted with or is in the process of being fitted with the ERIEYE. Now I have not heard anything about this bit from anyone of my sources, but going by that poster's record, I consider this to be solid info.

 

[aaaditya]

so does anyone have any idea of what is the endurance of the erieye mounted on the saab2000 platform and how many operator consoles it has ,also how many crew members it carriers?

 

[SABRE]

According to a well conected member at pakdef, the first Saab-2000 for the PAF has either been fitted with or is in the process of being fitted with the ERIEYE. Now I have not heard anything about this bit from anyone of my sources, but going by that poster's record, I consider this to be solid info.

Nothing on this by my source. And I wont place my bet on PakDef members, although some of them seem to have good sources and knowledge.

On the other hand if the 1st ERIEYE has been mounted and the whole aircraft+radar-system is ready than that 1st system would be sent to Pakistan. If its true, it would be on the news with in due time.