Indian Navy (IN) News and Discussion

[aaaditya]

Govt. of india has finalized acquisition of USS trenton along with 4 Landing Craft Mechanised (LCMs) for Indian Navy for $48 million. This boost INs ambhib capability big time.
PURCHASE OF TRANSPORT WARSHIP FROM USA

kams did you notice the important part in that article you posted,india has plans to design an indigenous lpd,i believe it will most probably be in the 18000 tons class like the trenton.

No technical know how for the construction of such a ship in India is envisaged under the present acquisition. However, the induction of LPD would help in gaining user experience apart from providing essential design inputs for the indigenous construction of LPD.

 

[contedicavour]

kams did you notice the important part in that article you posted,india has plans to design an indigenous lpd,i believe it will most probably be in the 18000 tons class like the trenton.

No technical know how for the construction of such a ship in India is envisaged under the present acquisition. However, the induction of LPD would help in gaining user experience apart from providing essential design inputs for the indigenous construction of LPD.

A great step forward for the Indian navy, filling the only significant hole in your capabilities

cheers

 

[kams]

AAditya,
Yes I did see the reference to Indigenous LPD. Could some one update me on how difficult is it to build an LPD (as large as 18,000 T). How different is it as compared to building a commercial container ship? I believe Cochin shipyard built a large container vessel recently for a foreign customer.

No word on 6 Sea King Helicopters we were supposed to buy with USS Trenton.

 

[contedicavour]

AAditya,
Yes I did see the reference to Indigenous LPD. Could some one update me on how difficult is it to build an LPD (as large as 18,000 T). How different is it as compared to building a commercial container ship? I believe Cochin shipyard built a large container vessel recently for a foreign customer.

No word on 6 Sea King Helicopters we were supposed to buy with USS Trenton.

If you can build the ADS aircraft carrier with only limited outside help (Italian and Russian), there is no doubt you'll be able to build LPDs, don't worry

cheers

 

[aaaditya]

AAditya,
Yes I did see the reference to Indigenous LPD. Could some one update me on how difficult is it to build an LPD (as large as 18,000 T). How different is it as compared to building a commercial container ship? I believe Cochin shipyard built a large container vessel recently for a foreign customer.

No word on 6 Sea King Helicopters we were supposed to buy with USS Trenton.

i agree with contedicavour,if india can build an aircraft carrier ,then i dont see any problems in their building an 18000 ton lpd or an lhd.

the cochin shipyard has the capability to build vessels of upto 100000 tons displacement(usually bulk carriers),mazagaon docks limited can build between 36000-60000 ton vessels.

recently larsen and toubro has entered shipbuilding using dutch ro-ro vessel technology and have already won orders worth several million dollars for supply of several vessels to a foreign customer(the article has already been posted on this thread),they are focussing on warships,submarines and large transport vessels for the indian navy,i would place their capabilities at around 36000 tons(however they have not yet received any orders from the indian navy as of now).

iam sure larsen and toubro's services can be utilised as they are also heavily involved in the ads project.

 

[contedicavour]

It is also likely that as Italy's Fincantieri should start building around 2012 a 25,000 ton LPH with some light CV characteristics, very similar to the Cavour and the Indian ADS/IAC... then India might find it interesting to build its own adapted version of such a LPH. To summarize, an adapted and scaled down version of ADS/IAC.

Having LPDs is great, though without a LPH (unless you use a carrier as temporary LPH) the Indian Marines will be limited in their operational capabilities.

cheers

 

[aaaditya]

It is also likely that as Italy's Fincantieri should start building around 2012 a 25,000 ton LPH with some light CV characteristics, very similar to the Cavour and the Indian ADS/IAC... then India might find it interesting to build its own adapted version of such a LPH. To summarize, an adapted and scaled down version of ADS/IAC.

Having LPDs is great, though without a LPH (unless you use a carrier as temporary LPH) the Indian Marines will be limited in their operational capabilities.

cheers

actually there have been reports that india is actively considering acquiring and manufacturing the french mistral class of landing helicopter docks,they may most probably be built at garden reach shipbuilders and engineers limited at kolkatta.

 

[contedicavour]

actually there have been reports that india is actively considering acquiring and manufacturing the french mistral class of landing helicopter docks,they may most probably be built at garden reach shipbuilders and engineers limited at kolkatta.

The Mistrals are good LPHs. Though they have different machinery (Wartsila diesel generators instead of the LM2500s on the ADS/IAC) and very different hull configurations. Since your shipyards are getting familiar with the Cavour's design, it may be easier and cheaper to duplicate this knowledge on a LPH version.
Anyway, Wartsila is an affiliate of Fincantieri, so fine with me

cheers

 

[aaaditya]

The Mistrals are good LPHs. Though they have different machinery (Wartsila diesel generators instead of the LM2500s on the ADS/IAC) and very different hull configurations. Since your shipyards are getting familiar with the Cavour's design, it may be easier and cheaper to duplicate this knowledge on a LPH version.
Anyway, Wartsila is an affiliate of Fincantieri, so fine with me

cheers

italy seems to be getting a lot of buisness from india these days,italian lerici class of mine counter measure vessels are currently the front runners for an indian navy order for 8 vessels to be built by the goa shipyards limited.by the way the ads being based on the cavour design will have the lpd capability ,i believe the cavour can carry a battalion of troops.

 

[contedicavour]

italy seems to be getting a lot of buisness from india these days,italian lerici class of mine counter measure vessels are currently the front runners for an indian navy order for 8 vessels to be built by the goa shipyards limited.by the way the ads being based on the cavour design will have the lpd capability ,i believe the cavour can carry a battalion of troops.

I didn't know about the MCM competition in India ! Thanks for the news.
The Cavour can embark MBTs up to 60tonnes from a ramp on its port side below the superstructure ; the hangar can carry vehicles and material for 600 Marines approx. However I wouldn't really call it a LPD because it doesn't have a floodable well dock for LCACs, LCUs, etc. At one time this capability was considered, but rejected.

cheers

 

[aaaditya]

hey guys great news indian navy is inducting the dhanush missile ,the dhanush is a solid fuelled variant of the prithvi short range surface to surface ballistic missile having a range of 350kms and capable of carrying a 750-1000 kgs warhead.these missiles can be fired from the two patrol vessels ins subhadra (around 1650 tons displacement)and ins sukanya,a submarine launched variant is currently under development known as the k-15.

here check out this link and article:

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/1914005.cms

NEW DELHI: There is finally some good news on the missile front after the 3,500-km Agni-III failure on July 9. The IAF and Navy are now operationalising Prithvi surface-to-surface ballistic missiles in their armoury.

Though meant for conventional battlefield use, these missiles are also capable of carrying nuclear warheads.

Though Army has had its 150-km Prithvi-I missiles for some years, it's only now that IAF and Navy have begun operationalising the longer-range variants of the same missile.

The IAF, for instance, has recently moved one of its Prithvi-II missile squadrons from Hyderabad to the Palam-based Western Air Command in New Delhi for swifter deployment on the battle-front in times of emergency, say sources.

The Navy, in turn, is weaponising its Sukanya-class large patrol crafts with Prithvi's "Dhanush" variant, which has a strike range of 250-km to 350-km. "The fitment of Dhanush on INS Survarna and INS Subhadra, for instance, is well underway," said an official.

"The missile stabilisation platform on the warships enables Dhanush, which can carry both conventional and non-conventional warheads, to be fired even in stormy weather," he added.

Interestingly, Defence and Research Development Organisation is also working on a Prithvi variant, being developed under the project name K-15, capable of being launched from a submarine.

This project, if successful, will go a long way towards giving Navy the desperately-needed SLBM (Submarine-Launched Ballistic Missile) capability.

With a declared no-first use nuclear doctrine, India urgently requires the capability to fire nuclear-tipped SLBMs for secure and effective second-strike capabilities.

Incidentally, production facilities at Hyderabad-based Bharat Dynamics Limited have been enhanced for manufacturing at least three dozen Prithvi missiles every year.

 

[contedicavour]

hey guys great news indian navy is inducting the dhanush missile ,the dhanush is a solid fuelled variant of the prithvi short range surface to surface ballistic missile having a range of 350kms and capable of carrying a 750-1000 kgs warhead.these missiles can be fired from the two patrol vessels ins subhadra (around 1650 tons displacement)and ins sukanya,a submarine launched variant is currently under development known as the k-15.

here check out this link and article:

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/1914005.cms

NEW DELHI: There is finally some good news on the missile front after the 3,500-km Agni-III failure on July 9. The IAF and Navy are now operationalising Prithvi surface-to-surface ballistic missiles in their armoury.

Though meant for conventional battlefield use, these missiles are also capable of carrying nuclear warheads.

Though Army has had its 150-km Prithvi-I missiles for some years, it's only now that IAF and Navy have begun operationalising the longer-range variants of the same missile.

The IAF, for instance, has recently moved one of its Prithvi-II missile squadrons from Hyderabad to the Palam-based Western Air Command in New Delhi for swifter deployment on the battle-front in times of emergency, say sources.

The Navy, in turn, is weaponising its Sukanya-class large patrol crafts with Prithvi's "Dhanush" variant, which has a strike range of 250-km to 350-km. "The fitment of Dhanush on INS Survarna and INS Subhadra, for instance, is well underway," said an official.

"The missile stabilisation platform on the warships enables Dhanush, which can carry both conventional and non-conventional warheads, to be fired even in stormy weather," he added.

Interestingly, Defence and Research Development Organisation is also working on a Prithvi variant, being developed under the project name K-15, capable of being launched from a submarine.

This project, if successful, will go a long way towards giving Navy the desperately-needed SLBM (Submarine-Launched Ballistic Missile) capability.

With a declared no-first use nuclear doctrine, India urgently requires the capability to fire nuclear-tipped SLBMs for secure and effective second-strike capabilities.

Incidentally, production facilities at Hyderabad-based Bharat Dynamics Limited have been enhanced for manufacturing at least three dozen Prithvi missiles every year.

I'm a bit lost here : is this yet another cruise missile, after Klub and Brahmos ? How many cruise missiles are you developing ???

cheeres

 

[ajaybhutani]

I'm a bit lost here : is this yet another cruise missile, after Klub and Brahmos ? How many cruise missiles are you developing ???

cheeres

prithvi is not a cruise missile.. its a ballistic one

 

[aaaditya]

I didn't know about the MCM competition in India ! Thanks for the news.
The Cavour can embark MBTs up to 60tonnes from a ramp on its port side below the superstructure ; the hangar can carry vehicles and material for 600 Marines approx. However I wouldn't really call it a LPD because it doesn't have a floodable well dock for LCACs, LCUs, etc. At one time this capability was considered, but rejected.

cheers

by the way do you have any information on the mcmv's used by the italian navy or any future mcmv projects of italian navy,iam realy interested in getting their specifications and their intended roles,their weapon systems and range and speed ,any website you can recommend besides naval-technology would be very helpfull.

 

[aaaditya]

I'm a bit lost here : is this yet another cruise missile, after Klub and Brahmos ? How many cruise missiles are you developing ???

cheeres

dhanush is the solid fuelled version of the prithvi missile,earlier there were two variants of prithvi missiles the prithvi ss150(range 150kms ,1000 warhead) and prithvi ss250(range 250kms,500kg warhead),both these variants were liquid fuelled and hence very cumbersome and not suitable for naval use,hence prithvi ss350 (named as dhanush which means bow) was developed having a range of 350kms while carrying a 750-1000 kgs warhead,being solid fuelled it is highly mobile and versatile and can be used by the army,navy and the airforce.the k-15 is expected to be a variant of prithvi having a range of 1000kms while carrying a 1000 kgs warhead and is expected to be an early generation submarine launched ballistic missile.

 

[contedicavour]

by the way do you have any information on the mcmv's used by the italian navy or any future mcmv projects of italian navy,iam realy interested in getting their specifications and their intended roles,their weapon systems and range and speed ,any website you can recommend besides naval-technology would be very helpfull.

Well the Italian navy site has a lot of information, but unfortunately no translation in English. You will however find design and specifications.

http://www.marina.difesa.it/unita/cacciamine.htm

Tonnage: 503 t.pc. (I serie); 672 t.pc. (II serie)
Dimensions: 49,9 x 9,6 x 2,6 (4,2) m (I serie);
52,5 x 9,6 x 2,6 (4,2) m (II serie)
Personnel: 4 + 43
Engines : 1 D Grandi Motori Trieste BL-230.8M; 3 D (for minehunting) Isotta Fraschini ID-36-SS6V; (1 electrical)
Power: 1.985 HP (1.460 kW)
Speed : 14 kn; 6 kn (in minehunting)
Autonomy: 2.500 miles / 12 kn
Weapons: 1 ÷ 2-20/70 mm or 2-25/90 mm

The hull is made of reinforced synthetic glass fiber, with max 12 cm thick so as to enhance resistance to underwater explosions. The diesel engine is suspended in a special system independent of the hull itself, while auxiliary power is above water to reduce acoustic and magnetic readings. Engines and systems are de-magnetized and isolated acoustically. The whole engine and propulsion system is designed for silent propulsion with no vibrations. There are 3 auxiliary propellers to manoeuvre in silence in any direction.
Equipment includes Motorola MRS III/GPS, tracking radar Datamat SSN-714, search & underwater hunting sonars for sweeping & hunting plus hunting drones Pluto and MIN Mk2.
So far, this class has been sold to USN (12), Australia (6), Malaysia (4), Thailand (2), Nigeria (2). Besides the 12 in Italian service.

cheers

 

[contedicavour]

dhanush is the solid fuelled version of the prithvi missile,earlier there were two variants of prithvi missiles the prithvi ss150(range 150kms ,1000 warhead) and prithvi ss250(range 250kms,500kg warhead),both these variants were liquid fuelled and hence very cumbersome and not suitable for naval use,hence prithvi ss350 (named as dhanush which means bow) was developed having a range of 350kms while carrying a 750-1000 kgs warhead,being solid fuelled it is highly mobile and versatile and can be used by the army,navy and the airforce.the k-15 is expected to be a variant of prithvi having a range of 1000kms while carrying a 1000 kgs warhead and is expected to be an early generation submarine launched ballistic missile.

Thks for the explanations. Other than for nuclear warheads, what use would the K15 have that Brahmos does not fulfill already ? What sort of satellite guidance the Indian Navy has to guide missiles beyond the range of embarked helos/aircrafts ?

cheers

 

[kams]

Thks for the explanations. Other than for nuclear warheads, what use would the K15 have that Brahmos does not fulfill already ? What sort of satellite guidance the Indian Navy has to guide missiles beyond the range of embarked helos/aircrafts ?

cheers

GLONAS, GPS?

 

[contedicavour]

GLONAS, GPS?

You know that GPS can be shut down anytime by the US ; especially if the missile has a nuclear warhead ) , that's why I'd rely more on national satellite (or Galileo alternative to GPS). What is Glonas ?

cheers

 

[kams]

You know that GPS can be shut down anytime by the US ; especially if the missile has a nuclear warhead ) , that's why I'd rely more on national satellite (or Galileo alternative to GPS). What is Glonas ?

cheers

Russian equivalent of GPS . here is the link

GLONAS

By the way these are Ballistic missiles, why do you need terminal guidence? especially with a nuclear Tip? Do ballistic missiles have that kind of guidence?