2nd Australian led Timor Leste intervention

[gf0012-aust]

crikey, it reminds me of the university era during vietnam!

no surprise that a socialist newspaper would be batting for a country thats been prime ministered by one of the last of the marxists - and a mozambique marxist at that.

pity that they have no idea whats going on. I've got a few relatives in ET who would love to shake their hand - NOT

 

[scraw]

I know it's wrong but I'm having a good giggle at the idea of the Kiwis as imperialists.

Of anglo nations they're probably the last one you'd tag and the poor guys still cop a flogging!

Edit: GF, no need for the Vietnam era qualifier, at least in Melbourne. By far the most visible in terms of posters, pamplets, people asking you to donate to this or attend that is the Socialist Alliance (no really, that's their name). Believe me some of the stuff they come up with is from the same fertile field as the above.

 

[abramsteve]

Just another load of rubbish from those left over from the Vietnam era, who were/are quick to preach how open minded and new age they are, yet seem to be living in the past.

The empire of New Zealand hey........ HAHAHAHAHA
Sorry

 

[gf0012-aust]

I know it's wrong but I'm having a good giggle at the idea of the Kiwis as imperialists.

Of anglo nations they're probably the last one you'd tag and the poor guys still cop a flogging!

I almost fell off my perch laughing at the thought of the Kiwis, let alone Helen Clark being the running dog of some neo-colonialist and imperial power belting the micronesians.

That comment alone showed how far detached they were from reality.

 

[Snayke]

I hope it's satire, actually. Someone tell me it's satire... I mean, I didn't know people who thought like this existed. :\

Hell, he doesn't know what it's like to be in East Timor right nor or pre-1999, so I don't think he has a right to comment on how the East Timorese are being colonized even though it's a crock of shit. He doesn't whine about the Indonesians when they were under a military dictatorship.

I suppose under totalitarian regimes, they become socialist right as all aspects of the economy are controlled by the government. Someone correct me on this if I'm wrong.

 

[Big-E]

Your going to enslave the Polynesians for cheap labor? To bad you don't have a border with Mexico... problem solved.:lol3

 

[NZLAV]

The NZ IPV is quite a nice design, it has twice the spped of the old ones, twice the size and 3 times the firepower. There isn't a signficant difference between the NZIPV and the Armidale. It has a different mast and 3 .50cal's instead of a 25mm and it is heavier. Any other differences?

 

[Sea Toby]

I was under the impression the New Zealand IPVs being built by Tenix was of the design Tenix bidded for the Australian patrol boat contract. However, Austral won the Australian contract with their Armidale design and bid. Frankly, one could install the 25-mm gun on the New Zealand IPV easily. Otherwise, the designs are very similar.

And yes, the new IPVs New Zealand is acquiring is a much better ship than the former Australian Freemantles, and a much better ship than what New Zealand had previously. Both nations have shown considerable improvement for their new patrol boats. Frankly, I would like to see a race between the two, Auckland to Sydney, and see which one wins. Hee! Hee!

While I wouldn't consider New Zealand as imperialists, I can see a time in the future an Australia too involved and overwhelmed with deployments abroad where New Zealand may have to go it alone in the South Pacific doing a peacekeeping mission or a humanitarian mission. New Zealand shouldn't count that Australia will always be available, and vice a versa.

 

[Subangite]

Do the Aussies have overall coordinating control and command of the Kiwi, Malaysian and Portuguese troops??

 

[Aussie Digger]

Do the Aussies have overall coordinating control and command of the Kiwi, Malaysian and Portuguese troops??

Yes particularly with the co-ordination role, though each element is under it's own command and control and reports to it's own higher elements.

Australian commanders however delegate taskings for the particular force elements, based on tactical need and the requests of the ET Governement, but each element decide themselves how they will achieve it. A complicated system, but one which seems to be working, so far...

 

[Subangite]

Thanks Aussie Digger, I guess that makes sense, I mean the Aussies deployed the largest number of troops amongst them.

Anyways, I understand why the ET govt. asked for assistance from Australia (near neighbour) and Portugal (colonial masters), I can understand apprehension against inviting Indonesia but why ask assistance from Malaysia and New Zealand?? Any particular unique qualities the Kiwi and Malaysian troops provide for the Australian led intervention and for the ET govt?

 

[RubiconNZ]

Togetherness

As far as Malaysia goes it could be good relations exercise but more as they are asking 3 western powers for help one of whom was a ex colonial master, by asking an asian country for assistance it doesn't look so much as like that East Timor is looking for a new one under Australia as has been mentioned fringe groups already call this intervention imperialist, as for New Zealand they were with Australia from the get go and have excellent relations with Timor and still have Kiwi officers stationed as UN advisors, again by asking more than just Australia it looks like a concerted Multi-National effort to help East Timor break through its growing pains.

 

[gf0012-aust]

Do the Aussies have overall coordinating control and command of the Kiwi, Malaysian and Portuguese troops??

Yes and No.

Aust has military control of Australian, New Zealand and Malaysian forces. Australia also has management control of ANZAC and Malaysian police forces. The UN is also happy with an Australian command because it was signed off to and agreed to by all 3 levels of the Timor Leste executive - so its a legal and binding condition that was determined by the local Govt.

The Portuguese don't have a military presence - they have a Police presence and their forces answer to the President.

 

[Supe]

The Portugese contingent won't be under Australian command. Idiotic really. They'd be better off not going to East Timor if they don't want to integrate into a unified force structure.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200606/s1654401.htm

 

[Snayke]

Last I heard the Australians did not want to command the police force in East Timor, whatever nationality.

Those Portuguese military police seem to be going there to act as police, not military. :\

 

[Big-E]

Last I heard the Australians did not want to command the police force in East Timor, whatever nationality.

Those Portuguese military police seem to be going there to act as police, not military. :\

In E. Timor I would like to know what the difference b/w military and police really are.

 

[Subangite]

Portugal's foreign minister accused Australia of interfering in East Timor's internal affairs after Australian Prime Minister John Howard said in a television interview that the Asian country had not been governed well over the past few years.

Lets all admit it, ET hasn't been governed well, if it was, there wouldn't be a need for an Australian led intervention force in the first place.

 

[Cootamundra]

Last I heard the Australians did not want to command the police force in East Timor, whatever nationality.

Those Portuguese military police seem to be going there to act as police, not military. :\

Not idiotic from Portugal's point of view.

IMHO Portugal is one of the reasons why Timor Lieste is in such a bad way. Portugal stuffed up the administration of the territory before and after WW2. They deserted their old colony in the 1970s and then left them high and dry when the Indo's invaded. Australia stood back because we knew that Uncle Sam and the British were not interested in a war with Indonesia and at the time placating the Indonesians was high on everyones list as countering the threat of communisim was considered much more important. Since then Portugal's efforts in aiding the developing nation of East Timor have been haphazzard at best. Their flawed constitution has its origins in the Portugese constitution and their Prime Minister spent a lot of time over ther. Perhaps Portugal has other (unstated) interests?! Maybe not, as GF pointed out the paramilitary police unit is meant to report to the ET President.

 

[marxist_command]

Not idiotic from Portugal's point of view.

IMHO Portugal is one of the reasons why Timor Lieste is in such a bad way. Portugal stuffed up the administration of the territory before and after WW2. They deserted their old colony in the 1970s and then left them high and dry when the Indo's invaded. Australia stood back because we knew that Uncle Sam and the British were not interested in a war with Indonesia and at the time placating the Indonesians was high on everyones list as countering the threat of communisim was considered much more important. Since then Portugal's efforts in aiding the developing nation of East Timor have been haphazzard at best. Their flawed constitution has its origins in the Portugese constitution and their Prime Minister spent a lot of time over ther. Perhaps Portugal has other (unstated) interests?! Maybe not, as GF pointed out the paramilitary police unit is meant to report to the ET President.

Indo's Invade?

C'mon guys, read your history book once more
Indo never invade Timor Lest.
It's their own decision to join Us

 

[RubiconNZ]

I say... You say..

Well invasion then annexation if you will but no they didn't choose, nine days after declared a independant nation from Portugal after its withdrawl '75 if I'm not mistaken, no offence Mr Command but your history books would most likely be a bit different to the rest of the world, they were allowed by the rest of world because of communist fears, but this may nearly be to political so I'll end it there
:wave