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Pakistan Air Force [PAF] News and Discussions
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How do you figure?
PAF jet crashes, pilot killed
Here are the details.
WAR
Link:http://www.thenews.com.pk/updates.asp#19319
PAF jet crashes, pilot killed
Updated at 1300 PST
ISLAMABAD: Pakistan Air Force F-7 aircraft of Pakistan Air Force during a routine operational training mission crashed on Tuesday near Quetta.
According to PAF spokesman, one of the pilots Flight Lt. Gulfam Soomro embraced shahadat while another ejected safely.
Meanwhile, an enquiry has been ordered by the Air Headquarters into the incident.
Here are the details.
WAR
Link:http://www.thenews.com.pk/updates.asp#19319
PAF jet crashes, pilot killed
Updated at 1300 PST
ISLAMABAD: Pakistan Air Force F-7 aircraft of Pakistan Air Force during a routine operational training mission crashed on Tuesday near Quetta.
According to PAF spokesman, one of the pilots Flight Lt. Gulfam Soomro embraced shahadat while another ejected safely.
Meanwhile, an enquiry has been ordered by the Air Headquarters into the incident.
DragonKing786
New Member
Making absurd claims without any proof, it has been commissioned in PAF and we are expecting 8-12 by the end of this year, and the next batch will come in 3 months. According to Pakistani media (All of them). As we knew before engines willn't be a problem, they are here to stay in Pakistan. :nutkick
Conrats EVERY one WE got 2 Birds
Conragts to every **** that we got 2 JF 17 commisioned in PAF in just 8 years of resarch and coopration with China and Pakistan .. Can any one let me know what is the out put of current prodction line how many they make in 1 Month or in how many days 1 JF17 will be completed:nutkick
A good time for Russian Chiness and Pakistani relations this is Just the Door is opening
... and one thing more ..... Can any INDIAN tells me...
If you want to talk about JF-17 or Chinese Pakistan cooperation then it fine but your post seems like an attempt to start a pissing contest. That is not acceptable. Please refrain from such comments
Conragts to every **** that we got 2 JF 17 commisioned in PAF in just 8 years of resarch and coopration with China and Pakistan .. Can any one let me know what is the out put of current prodction line how many they make in 1 Month or in how many days 1 JF17 will be completed:nutkick
A good time for Russian Chiness and Pakistani relations this is Just the Door is opening
... and one thing more ..... Can any INDIAN tells me...
If you want to talk about JF-17 or Chinese Pakistan cooperation then it fine but your post seems like an attempt to start a pissing contest. That is not acceptable. Please refrain from such comments
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I would suggest that China is simply calling Russia's bluff. (If there was actually even one there) After what will happen now? Will Russia demand inspection of the engines for the JF-17's? will they angrily cancel all their deals and walk away from the billions of dollars? Or possibly certain countries over estimated their influence in this matter?
Will India now cancel all their agreements with Russia for all their ships,submarines,planes and all the spare parts for the huge fleet of Russian aircraft that India operates?
Or possibly Nothing will happen at all.
I think what will happen is that it will be quietly brushed under the carpet and ignored with phrases such as "There are no Russian engines in Pakistan and if we had evidence of such activities we will take a very dim view of it" or even
"The engines in the JF-17 contains only parts manufactured in China"
Everyone wins.....
depending on how many RD-93s have been delivered already. We know that at least 10 were delivered last year (when the original term of contract stipulated for 15 last year and 20 each year from 2007 to 2010). So, more may have been delivered. Again, the issue here is the quality of the Russians engines is terrible. 33% rejection rate is really not good. But anyhow, I suspect prototype 06 and possibly 05 might have been using Rd-93 delivered last year. So, that means they would have at least 8 left. That's enough for the commitment they made of delivering 8 JF-17s this year. I suspect they can deliver a few more and get more money (remember, China has only paid for the ones that got delivered) before Indian complaints get load enough for rest of the contract to be cancelled. If WS-13 project is progressing as well as recently reported (In February, it was mentionned that it had started the long duration test), then it could achieve IOC by the beginning of next year. Meaning, no more need for RD-93s. But that's just a rough guess at this.
French,Russian,Indian and Us...some with Isreali Avionics...sounds like a logistical nightmare. To make it worth while, the F18 E/F buy would have to be pretty big, 126? With Tech support and weopons package? Whats that add up to? I think they will go Russian again.
Your are right it could end up as blessing in disguise
And it will further strengthen ties b/w China and Pak as well as Russia u know. If Russia doesn’t have any objections on RD-93 than mats I think J-11 can come in picture as well......
What do you think and especially to Umair I want to ask about future of J-10 as well J-11 (or might be SU Series) in PAF as Russia doesn’t have any objection on RD-93 for JF-17 probably the overall scenario can change in near future...
Cheers
And it will give Russia an excuse to sell SU-30/37 or PAK-FA to Pakistan which Pakistan probably is looking for after America used sanction as a diplomatic tool.
J-10 , JF-17 , F-16 , SU-30 MKK (with no sanctions at all) with Erieye - Airborne Early Warning as well of Chinese AWACS buddy it seems to be cool combination too
True and If India shall go for American planes than it would be a shift of policy in long-term (as she will have to makes changes in logistic cell as well as to maintain em) which Russians knows very well and it would be a signal to look for new markets as well ... you guyz got what I meant ?? erm
I don't think Russia is going to call for inspection for a product which has already been delivered to Pakistan. That would be virtually out of Chinese domain & authorization. There may be a little fuss here & there though.
On the India thing. If Russians were calling bluff than so was India. India just cant cancel every deal & jump on American & French products. This would be total waste of time for India - their waiting period would be prolonged. Plus the experience - Taking the Indian Air force for example; most of their quantitative fleet is based on Soviet/Russian fighters & weapon system (Su-30, MiG-29, MiG-21, & some others). They are well experienced with those fighters & turning away from them & going for something American (I wont say French cause they are well experienced on Mirage2000) would be a headache - plus Russia might carry its threat out & open doors for Pakistan to buy weapons from them & perhaps also bar logistic support & spare parts of products that India already has in service.
Too much of a risk involved for India. Its just a big bluff.
keyersoze your simply exxegerating things, the world has changed move on!
Rd93's was supposed to power their Jets right from 98 so whats wrong with it now?
Even if is Rd 93 renamed as ws-13 you wont know one is socialist country another communist, press hardly makes it
(sinosat 1 comes to mind)
So cool down and let each country do their homework, We are well on our way of indigenision, I've never supported this MRCA thing myself.
Aviation is like a industry just like any other..
Rd93's was supposed to power their Jets right from 98 so whats wrong with it now?
Even if is Rd 93 renamed as ws-13 you wont know one is socialist country another communist, press hardly makes it
(sinosat 1 comes to mind)So cool down and let each country do their homework, We are well on our way of indigenision, I've never supported this MRCA thing myself.
Aviation is like a industry just like any other..
China threatening Russia to withdraw arms purchase from them?
Where would China go? US? Europe? EU has a weapons sale restriction to China. Don't they? I know they want to sell to China. But the US has pressured EU not to open that flood gate.
India atleast has some choices...Ofcourse that creates its own headaches. But that headache is better than the one China has. A single vendor dependence
Manny
Where would China go? US? Europe? EU has a weapons sale restriction to China. Don't they? I know they want to sell to China. But the US has pressured EU not to open that flood gate.
India atleast has some choices...Ofcourse that creates its own headaches. But that headache is better than the one China has. A single vendor dependence
Manny
No comments.
Flood gate off doesnt mean something isnt flowing, think a bit if you dont know stuffs dear
Indeed, and you know what more choices brings more headeaches?, more kickbacks, some green cards and oh i absolutely forgot another like Mr singh in the making
I really dont know who you are but i'm not liking your views,
This is PAF thread, isnt it better to stick to the topic.
I repeat, Aviation is a industry like any other.
A question out of context and you should avoid it in future but let me tell you China is developing so fast in terms of techanlogy they wont be needing Russia in near future.
keyersoze your simply exxegerating things, the world has changed move on!
Rd93's was supposed to power their Jets right from 98 so whats wrong with it now?
Even if is Rd 93 renamed as ws-13 you wont know one is socialist country another communist, press hardly makes it
So cool down and let each country do their homework, We are well on our way of indigenision, I've never supported this MRCA thing myself.
Aviation is like a industry just like any other..
Sorry what are you replying to? I am discussing a current issue so it's a little hard to "move on"
The whole RD-93 saga that has been a major sticking point, however a lot of people are forgetting Realpolitik.
Err no since what we are discussing is Russia canceling deals worth billions over a few engines merely to placate a third party.
And it will give Russia an excuse to sell SU-30/37 or PAK-FA to Pakistan which Pakistan probably is looking for after America used sanction as a diplomatic tool.
J-10 , JF-17 , F-16 , SU-30 MKK (with no sanctions at all) with Erieye - Airborne Early Warning as well of Chinese AWACS buddy it seems to be cool combination too
True and If India shall go for American planes than it would be a shift of policy in long-term (as she will have to makes changes in logistic cell as well as to maintain em) which Russians knows very well and it would be a signal to look for new markets as well ... you guyz got what I meant ?? erm
I Like your quote but this is going to be difficult for the indians to shift towards US its very easy for PAK to go in the Russian camp because our all system are compatible with Chinees French and US systems .. While in the Indian case they have to Risk evry thing if they decide the Shift ...
and remember Russia will never losse them so easily its a huge market for the miltitary equipments almost around 10 Billion US Dollars a year,,,
Can any one wana losse such a bug amount.
India would not be willing to lose such a big amount...but it might not give all its deals to russia...for example it might contiue with PAK-FA but might opt out of MIG-35 and for F-18/eurofighter instead...my question is can pakistan afford to spend enuf to negate russia's loss with india?? because if russia is now selling pakistan advanced weapons, india will certainly not buy the same weapons and pakistan will have to but similar numbers to those which inida would otherwise have bought.
himeed, what guarentee is there that india will buy Mig. As far as story goes, indian airforce wanted Mirage 2000 while most of the politicians are in favour of US system. If india wants to make sure no rd-93 engine is supplied to Pakistan, they will have to commit to Russian toy, Mig 35, really soon. even then it will atmost delay not stall JF-17 as WS-13 is coming out really soon not to add influence with US will be lost considerably.
commiting to some system on the basis of pure politics wont take IAF or india as whole really far.
i dont think ,that india will go for russian mig35's despite it being an impressive aircraft, i also dont think india would be going for the super hornet unless if usa gives a very irresistible offer,nor for gripen,india may go for the french rafale or the eurofighter typhoon,this should keep russia slightly happy since it would not be losing its market to usa,india would be happy since it already has experience operating western aircrafts manufactured by france and uk,usa will be disappointed,but there is nothing that they can do about it.
to satisfy russia india has recently signed a deal for the purchase of 40 sukhoi 30mki's ,to supplement the 180 already ordered,india may also purchase 36 additional mig29k's to supplement the 24 already ordered,that is 76 additional aircrafts from russia.
also russia has a lot to lose it it turns completely to pakistan,for example india and russia have a defence agreement for anti ballistic missile development worth 10 billion dollars ,acquissition of defence equipment for the army and navy worth 10 billion dollars and joint development of defence technology,there is also provision in this agreement for india to shop abroad if russia is not able to provide technology to india's requirements,also the indo-russian trade which is growing ,though slowly and the indian investements in russia which are quite substantial.
selling of helicopters and a few engines to pakistan is not likely to affect the indo-russian trade , offcourse india will express its displeasure,but if russia sells pakistan fighters or if india acquires fighter from usa(in particular) then it would be an equation changing issue.
to satisfy russia india has recently signed a deal for the purchase of 40 sukhoi 30mki's ,to supplement the 180 already ordered,india may also purchase 36 additional mig29k's to supplement the 24 already ordered,that is 76 additional aircrafts from russia.
also russia has a lot to lose it it turns completely to pakistan,for example india and russia have a defence agreement for anti ballistic missile development worth 10 billion dollars ,acquissition of defence equipment for the army and navy worth 10 billion dollars and joint development of defence technology,there is also provision in this agreement for india to shop abroad if russia is not able to provide technology to india's requirements,also the indo-russian trade which is growing ,though slowly and the indian investements in russia which are quite substantial.
selling of helicopters and a few engines to pakistan is not likely to affect the indo-russian trade , offcourse india will express its displeasure,but if russia sells pakistan fighters or if india acquires fighter from usa(in particular) then it would be an equation changing issue.