Pakistan Air Force [PAF] News and Discussions

[aaaditya]

Re: Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

will they review the performance or the cost aspects of the saab surveillance planes?

is this review being carried out because of the earthquake?

by the way i remember someone posting on this forum that pakistan was shown the hawkeye ,if pakistan is interested in the hawkeye ,then maybe they can acquire them at a concessional rate from the usa instead of the erieye.

 

[SABRE]

Re: Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

will they review the performance or the cost aspects of the saab surveillance planes?

is this review being carried out because of the earthquake?

Yes its being carried out because of the EQ & its based on Cost. Senet wants the purchase to be delayed till the promissed international aid is delivered.

by the way i remember someone posting on this forum that pakistan was shown the hawkeye ,if pakistan is interested in the hawkeye ,then maybe they can acquire them at a concessional rate from the usa instead of the erieye.

One aspect of Pakistan being MNNA is that US has allowed any thing 2nd hand to be handed over for free to Pakistan. All Pakistan has to pay is for MLU & other upgrades. Hence its not going to be concessional price but total free of cost (unless Pakistan chooses MLU).

If navy wants E2C they can go for it but they are waiting for ERIEYEs of PAF first. If they are happy they would just end up sharing ERIEYEs with PAF. ERIEYE has both Land & Sea support systems.

 

[fieldmarshal]

Re: Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

Senate body reverses decision on VVIP planes​

By our correspondent
link http://jang.com.pk/thenews/​

ISLAMABAD: The Senate Standing Committee on Defence reversed on Tuesday its decision to recommend to the government cancellation of the deal on buying two VVIP planes. It unanimously supported the government proposals about the purchase of a SAAB Surveillance System and two planes for the VVIPs.
The meeting requisitioned by four senators of the treasury benches – Kamil Ali Agha, Naeem Hussain Chatta, Asif Jatoi and Muhammad Akram – was chaired by the chairman of the committee, Senator Nisar A Memon.
Opposition senators, Rukhsana Zuberi, Sardar Mahtab Khan, Kamran Murtaza and Farhatullah Babar, did not attend the meeting. According to a press release issued by the Senate Secretariat, Senator Memon invited the members to express their views on purchase of the VVIP planes and the SAAB Surveillance System and all the members expressed their support for the government proposals.

 

[Elite-Pilot]

Re: Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

Since the announcement by Riyadh of buying new Eurofighter T. has finally come up, will we be able to purchase the planes they are phasing out (Tornade ADV). I really think it can serve us well, i mean they are good bombers and not only that but these planes are also good for Air Defence. They have swept wings, similiar to those you can find on the F-14, forcing it to have sharp maneuverability. The weapons playload is also great and the 2 engines help make it a fast plane, i believe its maximum speed is around mach 2.2 . I dont think the Saudi's would really mind lending us those birds.

I am not sure about the exact price of the EX-Saudi tornado ADV but i would say it would be around 25-35 million, any more than that and we should leave them in the dust. Around 24-27 tornados could do alot for us, and you guys know it. Maybe this could be another thing to replace the old Mirages that have only a few hours left in them.

 

[SABRE]

Re: Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

Since the announcement by Riyadh of buying new Eurofighter T. has finally come up, will we be able to purchase the planes they are phasing out (Tornade ADV).

Now we will not be purchasing their Tornadoes & they are not going to retire them very soon. They will go for MLU. Besides PAF wouldnt want to waste money on Tornadoes & also pay for training & other ficilities & formalities.

I really think it can serve us well, i mean they are good bombers and not only that but these planes are also good for Air Defence. They have swept wings, similiar to those you can find on the F-14, forcing it to have sharp maneuverability. The weapons playload is also great and the 2 engines help make it a fast plane, i believe its maximum speed is around mach 2.2 . I dont think the Saudi's would really mind lending us those birds.

It does not have swept wings, it has swing wings & just because they are swing wing does not mean they are good & nor is it a reason for PAF to induct them. BTW Swing Wings are big PITA (high cost of maintainance etc) & many nations around the world are grounding their swing wing fighters. USNavy no longer operates F-14s.

Talk sensible stuff.

 

[P.A.F]

Re: Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

http://www.pakistanlink.com/Headlines/Dec05/21/04.htm

Pakistan to purchase more F-16 next year; Kasuri

ISLAMABAD: Pakistan. Foreign minister Khurshid Mehmood Kasuri said Pakistan would be in a position by next year to place orders for purchase of F-16 after carrying out estimates and after overcoming earthquake disaster next year.
President General Pervez Musharraf thanked Dick Cheney during the meeting for delivery of two F-16 planes to Pakistan, Kasuri told that a range of issues including bilateral relations between Pakistan and US, Kashmir and other regional issues came under discussion in the meeting between President Musharraf and Dick Cheney.
Prevailing situation in Iraq and Afghanistan was also discussed. They also held talks on supply of F-16 planes, Kasuri said adding that Pakistan made it clear that after overcoming the disaster of earthquake, Pakistan would be in a position by next year to place orders for purchase of F-16 after carrying out estimates.
.
US Vice President Dick Cheney has left for home on the conclusion of his one-day visit to Pakistan. Foreign minister Khurshid Mehmood Kasuri and US ambassador Ryan C Crocker talked to the journalists at Chaklala airbase Tuesday following the departure of US vice president.
Khurshid Mehmood Kasuri described Dick Cheney's visit to Pakistan very productive saying US vice president met President General Pervez Musharraf during his visit to Pakistan and expressed his sympathies on the colossal loss of life and property caused by October 8 killer quake in the parts of Pakistan.
Courtesy Geo

________________________________________________________

good stuff

 

[kashifshahzad]

Re: Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

Good news for Pakistan I think this is a good policy of Govt that it should continue the rehebilitation of the quake affectees and to also continue the improvement of its defence forces

 

[SABRE]

Re: Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

This is a part of artical from yahoo. One half is based on Pakistan while the other is on India regarding the arms sales by USA to both countries. Since this is Pakistani thread I am only posting Pakistani half.

WASHINGTON (Reuters);

In the past week, U.S. Vice President Dick Cheney and Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld have made separate visits, not announced in advance, to Pakistan, a key ally in the U.S.-declared war on terrorism.

Islamabad will make up its mind in the coming year on a U.S. offer to resume F-16 fighter aircraft sales after a 16-year break, Foreign Minister Khursheed Kasuri was quoted by the Associated Press of Pakistan as saying after Cheney left.

Earlier this month, Air Force Lt. Gen. Jeffrey Kohler, head of the Pentagon's Defense Security Cooperation Agency, said he expected Pakistan to modify buying plans because of the October 8 earthquake that killed more than 73,000 people.

"I think that what we were ready to do right before the earthquake is probably going to have to change," Kohler said in a December 7 interview with Reuters in Washington.

"We'll get back with Pakistan early in the new year and see what they want to do," he added. Before the temblor, Pakistan had asked about buying as many as 75 new F-16C/D models and 11 refurbished F-16s, Kohler said in May.

The single-engine multi-role F-16 is built by Bethesda, Maryland-based Lockheed Martin Corp.. New purchases would boost a fleet of about 32 F-16s acquired before Congress cut off sales in 1990 over Pakistan's nuclear program.

In May, the Pentagon told Congress it was proposing to let Pakistan buy 300 AIM-9M-1/2 "Sidewinder" heat-seeking, air-to-air missiles and 60 Harpoon missiles with a combined value of up to $226 million.

Source: Yahoo News / Reuters
Link: http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20051225/pl_nm/arms_india_pakistan_dc

There you go from the official word it is 75 new (C/D) + 11 refurbished (A/B) + 2 refurbished rechieved (A/B) + 35 operational (not 32 -- A/B) = 123 F-16s. Thats quite a fleet.

 

[P.A.F]

Re: Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

This is a part of artical from yahoo. One half is based on Pakistan while the other is on India regarding the arms sales by USA to both countries. Since this is Pakistani thread I am only posting Pakistani half.



There you go from the official word it is 75 new (C/D) + 11 refurbished (A/B) + 2 refurbished rechieved (A/B) + 35 operational (not 32 -- A/B) = 123 F-16s. Thats quite a fleet.

that should be a great force if brought. but i seriously doubt that that number would stay the same. i predict that it will go down to about 60-70 excluding our current fleet. but it would be better if we get all 123 Falcons. the more the better:nutkick

 

[WAR]

Re: Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

that should be a great force if brought. but i seriously doubt that that number would stay the same. i predict that it will go down to about 60-70 excluding our current fleet. but it would be better if we get all 123 Falcons. the more the better:nutkick

The figure of 123 F16 would go a long way for PAF. It would reduce operational costs by way of "uniformity of system", which otherwise incurred on having different Aircraft Squadrons of different make.

However, as history tells us, US is not a trustworthy ally. What's the guarantee that in future PAF would receive spare parts uninterruptedly?

The Pak-US honeymoon is primarily based on coalition on war on terror. Some says that China and Afghanistan factor is also there. But whatever it be, the PAF and Pakistan Government must take soverign guarantees for after sale support. Else, other options be taken into account.

 

[pshamim]

Re: Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

Some news on JF-17 in Janes of December 7, 2005. Please click the thumbnail to read.

 

[SABRE]

Re: Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

Some news on JF-17 in Janes of December 7, 2005. Please click the thumbnail to read.

I dont think this is December 7th artical cause it was posted on DT news by webs almost couple a months ago.

 

[pshamim]

Re: Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

I dont think this is December 7th artical cause it was posted on DT news by webs almost couple a months ago.

Picture is dated as December 7, 2005 on the left top.

 

[Elite-Pilot]

Re: Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

Hello guys, long time no----post

Some of you are eventually gonna ask if PAF is gonna purchase the Typhoon EF-2000 well here is the story. Currently Pakistan is evaluating/eyeing Typhoon's. They are probably thinking twice about if it would meet the requirements or how many will be needed. Also which postions it could fill up you dont believe me?

Islamabad, Oct 20, IRNA -- Pakistan has claimed it can counter the
Airborne Warning and Control System (AWACS) India is poised to receive
from Israel, local press reported Monday.
According to the daily The News, China has agreed to support
Pakistan in dealing with the strategic challenge posed by the
Indo-Israeli military deal.
The newspaper maintained that Chinese `AWACS killers` will play a
key role in countering Indo-Israeli Falcon under a US dollar 1
billion deal.
FT-2000 commonly known as AWACS killers, surface-to-air missiles
(SAM), designed by Chinese experts are considered to be the most
appropriate option, if the US refuses to provide the same kind of
AWACS to Pakistan, which are being sold to India by Israel under the
approval of Washington, the daily said.
The Dawn wrote that Pakistan was eyeing Euro-fighter, which has
`outsmarted` F-16 and other contemporary planes in various roles.

the rest of the news was just related to F-16's, JF-17's

The problem now is that even if we do purchase the Euro-Typhoon, we wont be able to buy more than 50 (seriously). 1 single Typhoon costs roughly 58 million American Dollars. So, lets do the math here.

58 (the cost of Typhoon) x 50 (quantity) = 2900

thats exactly 2.9 billion dollars for 50 , but its obvious that the weaponry would increase the price to more than 3 billion. Now we are stuck unless we pay 3 billion+ dollars for 50 Typhoons. This is pretty bad considering the JSF will be around 50 million. In this situation we really cant do alot. Gripen, despite its data-linking and maneuverability abilities...should not be an option for Pakistan. It would be a big mistake. If we go for Gripens then we have a fighter that can be eaten alive by the SU-30 MKI and not only that but we wont have enough money for another fighter in time for when it is needed.

The best option is the Euro fighter, But the price tag will force us to only purchase roughly 50 unless ofcourse Pakistan starts to really get in that offensive stage.

 

[gf0012-aust]

Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

Hello guys, long time no----post

Some of you are eventually gonna ask if PAF is gonna purchase the Typhoon EF-2000 well here is the story. Currently Pakistan is evaluating/eyeing Typhoon's. ....................................The best option is the Euro fighter, But the price tag will force us to only purchase roughly 50 unless ofcourse Pakistan starts to really get in that offensive stage.

The principle problem is that the Saudi purchase blows out the waiting period. The UK has pulled it off with the Saudis due to the sheer volume of units being bought. That means that someone else in the delivery chain (if not the UK itself) has to stall on getting their own units delivered at the prev expected rate.

The issue is, which EU buyers are willing to forego their own delivery schedules to fast track an external buyers requirement. ie, eg Pakistan.

the issue is delivery, availability and willingness on existing tracked buyers to go further down the queue.

the only way that I can see this being successful is if pakistan manages to secure volume from the saudis as an interim delivery process. the saudis would have to incraese their initial buy, or be willing to reduce their own committment to poss share units with pakistan. either way, an increase in saudi units also affects the existing and expected delivery schedule for current buyers.

 

[hovercraft]

Re: Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

is JF-17 is going to be steath?
any information please.

 

[kashifshahzad]

Re: Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

is JF-17 is going to be steath?
any information please.

I dont think that the first batch of thunder is going to be stealthy.If JXX can be stealthy which is a concept for now but the tech could be in the chineese hands and this tech can be applied on the thunders and also on the J-10 which is Chineese basic fighter they are really giveing time to it.

As far as Typhoon is considered,the countries which manufacture this AC will surely try to get some batches not much but some and they will also try to give this fighter to those countires which have closer ties with them.Why dont Pakistan consider Rafale,Pakistan can get this fighter easily it has 14 hardpoint and also has a lot of payload capebility but price

 

[pshamim]

Re: Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

Hello guys, long time no----post

Some of you are eventually gonna ask if PAF is gonna purchase the Typhoon EF-2000 well here is the story. Currently Pakistan is evaluating/eyeing Typhoon's. They are probably thinking twice about if it would meet the requirements or how many will be needed. Also which postions it could fill up you dont believe me?

Elite-Pilot,
What you posted is a piece of very old news which came out in October 2003. Current situation is totally different. Pakistan does not intend to go for Typhoon. It just will not happen.
Let us not waste time on this any more.

 

[gf0012-aust]

Re: Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

I dont think that the first batch of thunder is going to be stealthy.If JXX can be stealthy which is a concept for now but the tech could be in the chineese hands and this tech can be applied on the thunders and also on the J-10 which is Chineese basic fighter they are really giveing time to it.

It's not a stealthy design. and you cannot "retro-apply" stealth concepts to an airframe.

the improvements in RCS have to be based on a sound initial design.

As far as Typhoon is considered,the countries which manufacture this AC will surely try to get some batches not much but some and they will also try to give this fighter to those countires which have closer ties with them.

In light of pshamin's comment. but further to the above. Countries sitting in a queue with an already blown out delivery date are not going to forsake their own delivery schedules just to be "nice". Any countries that enter into a post contractual buy up are dependant on queued countries forsaking their own numbers - nobody does that unless they already have substantial stocks in place and it doesn't effect their own procurement and production schedules.

I can't think of any countries outside of the US and USSR who have done that - and that was only because a "hot" war was then in place with their "client states" and they were determined to prop them up come hell or high water.

 

[aaaditya]

Re: Pakistan Airforce News and Discussions

Hello guys, long time no----post

Some of you are eventually gonna ask if PAF is gonna purchase the Typhoon EF-2000 well here is the story. Currently Pakistan is evaluating/eyeing Typhoon's. They are probably thinking twice about if it would meet the requirements or how many will be needed. Also which postions it could fill up you dont believe me?



the rest of the news was just related to F-16's, JF-17's

The problem now is that even if we do purchase the Euro-Typhoon, we wont be able to buy more than 50 (seriously). 1 single Typhoon costs roughly 58 million American Dollars. So, lets do the math here.

58 (the cost of Typhoon) x 50 (quantity) = 2900

thats exactly 2.9 billion dollars for 50 , but its obvious that the weaponry would increase the price to more than 3 billion. Now we are stuck unless we pay 3 billion+ dollars for 50 Typhoons. This is pretty bad considering the JSF will be around 50 million. In this situation we really cant do alot. Gripen, despite its data-linking and maneuverability abilities...should not be an option for Pakistan. It would be a big mistake. If we go for Gripens then we have a fighter that can be eaten alive by the SU-30 MKI and not only that but we wont have enough money for another fighter in time for when it is needed.

The best option is the Euro fighter, But the price tag will force us to only purchase roughly 50 unless ofcourse Pakistan starts to really get in that offensive stage.

the eurofighter costs around 75million dollars per aircraft add to that the cost of the spares,training etc,besides pakistan has no experience in operating a eads aircraft,it will be as much of a problem for them to operate the ef2000 as it would be for a country operating the russian migs to suddenly change to the f-18 or the f-16.

there are several ways of countering awacs ,one of them is a ground based awacs jammer, a system has been developed by russia ,maybe china has acquired it and reverse engineered it.