New Chinese FAC supposedly in serial production

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armage

New Member
Re: China's FAC Testing

Red aRRow said:
I think it's a total Photoshop doctored image.
I mean who in blazes tests missiles while the ship is moored?? and notice a person standing at the rear of the the craft while the missile is being fired!!!!

Can anybody identify the missile being fired??
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Try clicking HERE :coffee
 
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wp2000

Member
gf0012-aust said:
Actually one of the reasons why I am here as an international moderator is to help in diffusing and de-fusing conflict between Indian/Pakistani/Chinese topics etc.... it provides a balance and allows a different perspective. as for Australian (if you are saying AUS??) faked photos, I've yet to see any faked images ever get shown in Australian military forums - we just don't tolerate that kind of behavior. In some of the Australian military sites where we have had kids start trolling, abusing or posting rubbish, we would evict them straight away. But, be that as it may, any posts or pics that Australians posted purporting to be real equipment would be subject to the same amount of enquiry. After all, thats the role of the moderators, to police the quality and content of info that strikes the board.

As an example, Fighter Jets popping out of the water and presented as actual weapons systems is a good example of how common sense can be abandoned in the quest to have a "scoop".
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And I do believe you've done a great job. But are you confident that you can be the judge on other countries' military issues?

Actually I do respect your knowledge cause I've read your posts. But I just think everybody has limitations on experience and knowledge. For instance, you know a lot on the catamaran design especially Australia's R&D. But do you know China's own R&D effort on this design? Do you really believe China just copied the design from AUS because they bought some ships and had some contacts with the company in TAS? I am not an expert on the design. But because I can read chinese language forums, I saw some articles and pics on their R&Ds in the last 2 decades.

Anyway, all I am saying is, this is just a forum for military fans (please tell me I got it wrong), take it easy. What ever we say here don't change the fact. This is not about who's better or worse. It's about sharing some thoughts. And I just think that we shouldn't be too harsh and confident on judging something that we may not be most familiar with. I enjoy reading other people's posts, I do have doubts about them, but I wouldn't rush to say that something is fake because I think so. There are milion ways to skin a cat, am I right?
 
gf0012-aust

gf0012-aust

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
wp2000 said:
For instance, you know a lot on the catamaran design especially Australia's R&D. But do you know China's own R&D effort on this design? Do you really believe China just copied the design from AUS because they bought some ships and had some contacts with the company in TAS? I am not an expert on the design. But because I can read chinese language forums, I saw some articles and pics on their R&Ds in the last 2 decades.
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The Wave Piercing concept is an Australian registered patent. It's only been legally licensed to the US, UK and Netherlands.

wp2000 said:
Anyway, all I am saying is, this is just a forum for military fans (please tell me I got it wrong),
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Thats true, but we aren't into fairy stories, there are plenty of other forums that can be visited instead for that kind of information. We're trying to be as accurate as possible here.

wp2000 said:
I do have doubts about them, but I wouldn't rush to say that something is fake because I think so. There are milion ways to skin a cat, am I right?
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Sometimes all it does require is common sense, or familiarity with the platform or system. If some of us have experience in the technology or concept, then its important that we set the record straight - and give our reasons as to why.

After all, the picture of the 2208 firing a missile went everywhere with every fan of the ship stating how it was prrof positive etc... It's a pity that some clown PS a US ESSM missile over the top. Somehow I don't think that the PLAN are using ESSM's when there are less than 6 ships in the world that have been cleared to fire them - and all of them on US allies or US ships. Now, do we correct an obvious misrepresentation, or do we let everyone believe in something thats a load of bull??
 
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wp2000

Member
gf0012-aust said:
The Wave Piercing concept is an Australian registered patent. It's only been legally licensed to the US, UK and Netherlands.
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Sorry, chinese don't care about patent. They do R&D as they want. Registering something in AUS means nothing in China.



gf0012-aust said:
Thats true, but we aren't into fairy stories, there are plenty of other forums that can be visited instead for that kind of information. We're trying to be as accurate as possible here.
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I have no problem with that.



gf0012-aust said:
After all, the picture of the 2208 firing a missile went everywhere with every fan of the ship stating how it was prrof positive etc... It's a pity that some clown PS a US ESSM missile over the top. Somehow I don't think that the PLAN are using ESSM's when there are less than 6 ships in the world that have been cleared to fire them - and all of them on US allies or US ships. Now, do we correct an obvious misrepresentation, or do we let everyone believe in something thats a load of bull??
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I see. Maybe I didn't pay enough attension to this fake picture. Because even on all the chinese forums I visited, this fake picture had not generated more than 10 replies in total. Compared to other PS works, this one is really among the worst, cause the response is so little in china, people did not even bother to say nasty words to it.

I didn't realised that this fake pic is so important in English forums. I thought even a school kid can tell the difference.

Anyway, looks like we are talking about different pics. As far as I remember, the type 22xx has 2 fake pics. This is one of them. All the others are real ones.
 
gf0012-aust

gf0012-aust

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
wp2000 said:
Sorry, chinese don't care about patent. They do R&D as they want. Registering something in AUS means nothing in China.
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The problem is that if you are a signatory to the IPO, then you have an obligation to enforce it yourself. That was one of the conditions to join the WTO as well. Once you demonstrate a willingness to not protect the rights of the patentee as per your IPO obligations - then other countries will lose confidence in expected international IP behaviour


wp2000 said:
I see. Maybe I didn't pay enough attension to this fake picture. Because even on all the chinese forums I visited, this fake picture had not generated more than 10 replies in total. Compared to other PS works, this one is really among the worst, cause the response is so little in china, people did not even bother to say nasty words to it.

I didn't realised that this fake pic is so important in English forums. I thought even a school kid can tell the difference.

Anyway, looks like we are talking about different pics. As far as I remember, the type 22xx has 2 fake pics. This is one of them. All the others are real ones.
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Fake pics on any language forum is ok for kids - its not OK when you are wanting to have a serious forum and discuss serious issues. If sites keep on displaying fakes without robust assessment and proper diligence - then they start to lose credibility.
 
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wp2000

Member
gf0012-aust said:
The problem is that if you are a signatory to the IPO, then you have an obligation to enforce it yourself. That was one of the conditions to join the WTO as well. Once you demonstrate a willingness to not protect the rights of the patentee as per your IPO obligations - then other countries will lose confidence in expected international IP behaviour
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Fine. But China started the R&D 20 years ago before they joined WTO. Also, I don't think any countries' military R&D departments will care about other countries' patents. I just don't believe they will, even AUSSIES.




Fake pics on any language forum is ok for kids - its not OK when you are wanting to have a serious forum and discuss serious issues. If sites keep on displaying fakes without robust assessment and proper diligence - then they start to lose credibility.
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I agree completely. The only reason I start to comment is because we were spending too much time on the couple of fake pictures while lots of real ones can be discussed to find out more interesting things.

I think you need to face it, this is a public forum, you don't want fake ones to dominate it and you've done it very well. But to keep all fake ones out would require too much work and it will result in a forum too restricted to participate. I admit it's a tough balance to maintane. But it is an important factor to a forum's success. Some old forums are dieing because of this.
 
gf0012-aust

gf0012-aust

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
wp2000 said:
Also, I don't think any countries' military R&D departments will care about other countries' patents. I just don't believe they will, even AUSSIES.
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au contraire - we do take it seriously. it's a matter of integrity and honesty. otherwise you're no better than a thief in the night.

I worked in an area involved with weapons research for approx 4 years - we were incredibly diligent and persistent in checking to make sure that everything we did was "above board".

In australias case we not only exhaustively check with IPO for uniqueness, but we have a standing arrangement with our allies (incl NATO) to check with them. This has been in place since 1962.

By the way, the international patents office was established well before the design claims lodged for these hulls.
 
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