Indonesian Aero News

[Ananda]

Indonesia have use bespoke Boeing platform before as MPA. However have to workout to include Boeing. Thus the question if this DI and Havelsan working out for AEW&C, will that also involved platform builder ?

With Boeing already invest heavily on E7, the most potential work out I can think off is build bespoke E7 derivative like the one Boeing did with India. Question always the budget availability. Can they afford E7 derivative if most budget has to share with F-15EX? Which is why I still doubt they can afford E7 derivative on that condition.

However using Business Jet platform, can be more workable if F-15EX still in calculation. Off course it is different thing if the allocation of overseas procurement increase from USD 25 Bio to USD 35 bio on 25-29 term. However I have big doubt they can allocated that considering regional-global economy situation. They are too much economics stability reserve needed, considering the market situation now.

 

[ChestnutTree]

What I meant by an E7 derivative is taking the Havelsan equipment and placing it onto an Airbus airframe. AIUI Airbus is currently willing to do more business with Indonesia, and having an A330 based platform would benefit considering it's ubiquity in Indonesian state and commercial services.

 

[Ananda]

Ahh, I see what you mean. Still using Airbus platform can be more expensive then using Business Jet like Bombardier platform. Besides Bombardier or Embrear business jets platform I believe, has been used more as specialized platform then Airbus Airliners.

I do believe that means they (Bombardier or Embrear) has more exposure then Airbus on working out their Jet Airliners toward military specialized platform. Airbus military more often use their turboprop platform (like CN 235 or 295) as specialized platforms.

For me, even though in theory workable, however using A320 or A330 as platform for AEW&C can potentially be much more expensive, as no one has been used that before. Thus the changes and integration costs can be more expensive, as Airbus has to get involved with designing the bespoke configuration. If want to use bespoke configuration, then better use Business Jets that has been turned before as platform for AEW&C. That's means either Bombardier or Embrear business jets.

Using new platform that's has not been used before for AEW&C, usually means the platform builder need also prepared new adjustments. That's usually means more costs relative to platform that has been design with that kind adjustment before.

 

[swerve]

I honestly think something like an E7 derivative could work, bonus points if they can convince Airbus to supply an A330 airframe to integrate it.

A330 is very big for an AEW aircraft. E-7 is the biggest current western production or development AEW aircraft, & it's based on the Boeing 737. Globaleye is built on the Bombardier Global 6000 or 6500, & the G550 CAEW is just about in production, despite the G550 no longer being made, with a couple of new ones being built for Italy using G550s Italy bought a couple of years ago.

The E-7's systems may be too big & heavy for a bizjet, needing a 737 or A320, but I think that's about the biggest that would be sensible. Next step down is Globaleye - though Erieye could be on other aircraft. SAAB has shown itself to be very good at fitting Erieye to multiple platforms. I can imagine a Gulfstream 650 to G800 being modified for AEW, perhaps by the Israelis. Then comes the latest E-2, & the smallest currently offered western AEW type I know of is the IAI P600 AEW, with the ELTA ELW-2096 on an Embraer Praetor 600 bizjet.

 

[Ananda]

https://amp.kontan.co.id/news/perusahaan-setiawan-djodi-borong-5-pesawat-n219-dari-pt-dirgantara-indonesia-ptdi

Indonesian Trading company sign agreement for 5 N219 which aim to be use by Congo Government. Another deal with Belgium based trading company for 2 CN235 for Congo AF. I don't know the detail of the contract, but using trading company usually done as 'quasy' trade financing agreement.

The trading company usually can provide lease or installment scheme to the end users. Usually it is against end users with low or even zero credit rating. Either way it is part of export financing scheme, although can be considered as indirect scheme.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

A330 is very big for an AEW aircraft. E-7 is the biggest current western production or development AEW aircraft, & it's based on the Boeing 737. Globaleye is built on the Bombardier Global 6000 or 6500, & the G550 CAEW is just about in production, despite the G550 no longer being made, with a couple of new ones being built for Italy using G550s Italy bought a couple of years ago.

The E-7's systems may be too big & heavy for a bizjet, needing a 737 or A320, but I think that's about the biggest that would be sensible. Next step down is Globaleye - though Erieye could be on other aircraft. SAAB has shown itself to be very good at fitting Erieye to multiple platforms. I can imagine a Gulfstream 650 to G800 being modified for AEW, perhaps by the Israelis. Then comes the latest E-2, & the smallest currently offered western AEW type I know of is the IAI P600 AEW, with the ELTA ELW-2096 on an Embraer Praetor 600 bizjet.

Dassault offers the Falcon 2000 for Maritime Reconnaissance Aircraft tasks, and soon Dassault will deliver the Falcon 8X Archange to the Armée de l'air et de l'espace for SIGINT/EW. Combined with the fact that Saab could fit the Ericsson Erieye on the smaller Saab 340, i think it should be possible for Dassault to modify the Falcon 8X into an AEW&C version.


And here a nice video for the C-130 Hercules lovers.
Hercules TNI AU di SGS24 (youtube.com)

 

[swerve]

The only possible problem with the Falcon 8X that I can think of is that it's a trijet, & maybe having a radar mounted above the fuselage, directly in front of one engine, might cause problems. Or maybe not - I don't know. If it is a problem then the Falcon 6X is available. American engines, though. Any of them would be easily big enough, though a bigger aircraft still should allow more on-board operators & longer endurance & range.

But if someone wants more & isn't in a hurry, the Falcon 10X is under development.

 

[Ananda]

Frenchie Salesman Channel talk about his latest update on Rafale order. As he is after all the salesman, off course on the case of Indonesian Rafale package he got inside news.

Thus basically he say all 42 Rafale will be in F4 configuration with 30 single seat and 12 tandem seat, and confirmation that the package also include 2 Falcon 8X as VIP fleet.

Later part on his video he is bragging why Rafale and Dasault better choice then F-16 and LM. He even talk and spread rumours (something that I heard from other sources), the plan upgrade for all 34 F-16 toward V standard will be in doubt due to LM less supportive on providing acceptable deals. He also brag that Falcon 8X will be better choice as VIP plane then Boeing BBJ that already choose from SBY era as Presidential plane.

There're rumours that I heard from other sources on potential simplification on asset procurement types, due to Finance People assessment for better financing packages. Either way so far Frenchie Salesman still working hard to make that simplification choices will benefit French or only one or two Partner.

That's why he spreading talks in media, on negativity of Turkification. He is fighting on public perspective and lobbying behind door for slice of pies that rumours being insisted by finance people to be simplified but with larger allotment for better financing costs.

Still it is Indonesia procurement process, which are chaotics and full lobbying. So the results can be sanity check or just simply sanity loose.