Indonesia: 'green water navy'

[Ananda]

Indonesian Navy requests two hydrographic rescue vessels in 2020–24 defence spending plan | Jane's 360

Finally..after So many years operating Submarines (from the 60's)..TNI-AL seems will get more infrastructure for submersible rescue operation.
In local media..MinDef spokesman stating this ships will be equipped with submersible vehicle capable for 150-300m depth operation. Now, I don't know if this is miss quote from the local media..but if this submersible is DSRV class , this should be able to operate on deeper range. Still even this depth range is true..it's already significant progress for TNI-AL submersible rescue capabilities.

Lesson from Argentina is clear..having submarine force without proper rescue infrastructure is playing with fire.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

Sea trials and a look inside the ship of KRI Semarang 594.
Although the number is 594, KRI Semarang will become surprisingly the second hospitalship of TNI-AL besides the KRI Soeharso 990.

As a bonus the launch of another ship, the KRI Bontang 907, a new replenishment ship. It has the same capacity as the KRI Tarakan 905 (5500 m3 of fuel), but it is made by another shipyard (PT Betamec Shipyard), and not by PT Dok dan Perkapalan Kodja Bahari. Besides KRI Bontang looks different compared to the KRI Tarakan, with 125,5 meters it is also slightly longer than the 122,4 meter long KRI Tarakan.

The KRI Tarakan 905

And this is the KRI Bontang 907.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

Earlier reports was about a more expensive vessel because of additional communications, command and control facilities and more sensor and weapons systems. But eventually the third LPD built by PAL has become a hospital ship, which is a good decision, looking to the big chance of natural disasters in our country.

Indonesian Navy inducts sixth LPD into Armada I fleet
Ridzwan Rahmat, Singapore - Jane's Navy International
23 January 2019


Key Points

• The Indonesian Navy has commissioned a second landing platform dock-based hospital ship
• The vessel, the sixth-in-class overall, will improve the service's humanitarian assistance and disaster relief capabilities in western Indonesia

The Indonesian Navy (Tentara Nasional Indonesia-Angkatan Laut: TNI-AL) commissioned its sixth landing platform dock (LPD) vessel on 21 January.
Complete article at: Indonesian Navy inducts sixth LPD into Armada I fleet | Jane's 360



ADECS 2019: Indonesia pursues trio of additional submarines
22nd January 2019 - 12:00 GMT | by Gordon Arthur in Christchurch


The Indonesian Navy (TNI-AL) is currently negotiating with South Korea over a possible purchase of a batch of three additional Type 209/1400 (known in South Korea as the Chang Bogo class, pictured) diesel-electric submarines, which will help meet the MoD’s target for a Minimum Essential Force (MEF).

Discussions by Indonesia’s MoD are centred upon PT Pal and Daewoo Shipbuilding and Marine Engineering (DSME) over respective workshare portions and technology transfers.

According to the Committee for Defense Industry Policy (KKIP), Indonesia had considered other submarine types to extend its fleet, but commonality with existing 1,400t Nagapasa-class submarines and ease of maintenance make the most sense.
Complete article at: ADECS 2019: Indonesia pursues trio of additional submarines - NWI - Naval Warfare - Shephard Media

I wonder if these additional three submarines (406, 407, 408) will be stationed at the new submarine base in Palu or somewhere else.

 

[deadlast]

Earlier reports was about a more expensive vessel because of additional communications, command and control facilities and more sensor and weapons systems.

Originally according to Jane's, it's the seventh built LPDs (the one built after KRI Semarang) that supposedly equipped with those systems, not KRI Semarang itself.

Source: Indonesian Navy outlines specifications for seventh LPD | Jane's 360

But, there's another news from RRI that the seventh built LPD will be the purpose built hospital ship to relieve the hospital ship role that currently being taken by KRI Semarang. So far, there is no further info/news that indicate when the LPD equipped with command & control facilities will be built.

But eventually the third LPD built by PAL has become a hospital ship, which is a good decision, looking to the big chance of natural disasters in our country.

It's more of last minutes change to be honest, she wasn't built as a purpose built hospital ship, some of her medical facilities comes in the form of containerized modules for easy change of roles and also her pennant number & naming schemes was the biggest clue.

"Hari ini, keberadaan KRI Semarang yang awalnya landing platform dock (LPD), kami naiknya levelnya menjadi kapal rumah sakit dengan tambahan beberapa kontainer medis," ucapnya.

Untuk kapal (rumah sakit) ketiga, kata dia, pembangunannya akan dimulai pada tahun ini dengan target penyelesaian pada tahun 2021.

"Setelah rampung, keberadaan KRI Semarang akan difungsi(kan) kembali ke LPD," paparnya.

Source: TNI AL Berencana Akan Kembali Pesan Kapal Rumah Sakit

----------------

I wonder if these additional three submarines (406, 407, 408) will be stationed at the new submarine base in Palu or somewhere else.

It's still a long way before that. The current 405 hasn't even been launched for some reason and also the Palu submarine base itself was substantially damaged after the last tsunami anyways.

---------------

Also finally got confirmation that we would only received two unit of fully equipped Panther ASW helicopter.

Satu unit Heli AKS yang telah diserahkan kepada TNI AL, akan dikirim kembali ke PTDI untuk pemasangan konfigurasi penuh AKS. Sementara sisanya, satu unit Heli AKS dengan konfigurasi penuh AKS saat ini masih berada di PTDI. Kedua heli selanjutnya akan diserahkan ulang oleh PTDI pada tahun ini.

Source: PTDI Serahkan 5 Helikopter Panther dan 1 CN235 MPA untuk TNI AL

 

[Ananda]

Indonesia selects 62 m vessel from Abeking & Rasmussen for MCMV replacement | Jane's 360

The long plan replacement for two Dutch origin tripartite class MCMV that come from late 80's.

Been reported in local media before on some Indonesian Naval delegation that come to German base on the tour of Frankenthal class MCMV, thus opening speculation that German origin MCMV will be the lead candidate.

 

[foxdemon]

Here’s some more links about TNI-AL mine warfare developments.


TNI-AL UAV assesses ships’ magnetic signature | RANOPS

Naval Mines archivos - SAES

Indonesia, Singapore Conduct Mine Countermeasure Military Drills


I haven’t been able to find any information on what naval mines the TNI-AL has available. Activities seem to be focused on mine clearance.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

Here’s some more links about TNI-AL mine warfare developments.


TNI-AL UAV assesses ships’ magnetic signature | RANOPS

Naval Mines archivos - SAES

Indonesia, Singapore Conduct Mine Countermeasure Military Drills


I haven’t been able to find any information on what naval mines the TNI-AL has available. Activities seem to be focused on mine clearance.

Thanks for sharing.
"TNI-AL UAV assesses ships’ magnetic signature"
So, it seems that TNI-AL was just hiring/renting this STERNA UAV? Unclear is which ships they have analysed...

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

Indonesia selects 62 m vessel from Abeking & Rasmussen for MCMV replacement | Jane's 360

The long plan replacement for two Dutch origin tripartite class MCMV that come from late 80's.

Been reported in local media before on some Indonesian Naval delegation that come to German base on the tour of Frankenthal class MCMV, thus opening speculation that German origin MCMV will be the lead candidate.

Indonesia selects 62 m vessel from Abeking & Rasmussen for MCMV replacement | Jane's 360

The long plan replacement for two Dutch origin tripartite class MCMV that come from late 80's.

Been reported in local media before on some Indonesian Naval delegation that come to German base on the tour of Frankenthal class MCMV, thus opening speculation that German origin MCMV will be the lead candidate.

Many things stay unclear, the Frankenthal Class are 52-54 meters long vessels, built in 1992-1998. The ships that are ordered are 62 meters long.
Looking to their website Abeking & Rasmussen's naval project APEX Protector in Detail. they talk about an all new 85 meter long futuristic looking stealth vessel...

We just wait until more accurate information is available.

 

[ASSAIL]

I think that Mine counter measures are in such a state of flux with the advent of modern UAVs that any replacement decision should be delayed.
If the new tactics dictate that ships will no longer enter minefields but will search by remote means the evolution of these tactics is dynamic and ongoing. I’m not current enough to give an intelligent assessment of the progress or predict a maturity timeline for such tactics but it seems to me that specialised non magnetic MCM vessels have probably had their day.
Comments appreciated.

 

[StingrayOZ]

I don't think there is a huge problem with being non-magnetic, but it shouldn't be the primary consideration, particularly going into the future.

If you had a choice of a larger more capable vessel with space and capability to facilitate UUV and drones and the like, and a smaller non-magnetic platform without those capabilities, going into the future the non-magnetic platform doesn't seem to offer any advantages. For Indonesia I guess the question is can they afford high end dismounted counter-mine technologies to go with the platform, and on how many ships.

Smaller cheaper ROV are more likely, but generally have more limited range, it may be useful to have a non-magnetic platform in that case when operating these shorter range devices. They may only have 1 or 2 ships fitted with ROV while the other ships work with more traditional tactics.

 

[Todjaeger]

I don't think there is a huge problem with being non-magnetic, but it shouldn't be the primary consideration, particularly going into the future.

If you had a choice of a larger more capable vessel with space and capability to facilitate UUV and drones and the like, and a smaller non-magnetic platform without those capabilities, going into the future the non-magnetic platform doesn't seem to offer any advantages. For Indonesia I guess the question is can they afford high end dismounted counter-mine technologies to go with the platform, and on how many ships.

Smaller cheaper ROV are more likely, but generally have more limited range, it may be useful to have a non-magnetic platform in that case when operating these shorter range devices. They may only have 1 or 2 ships fitted with ROV while the other ships work with more traditional tactics.

Another potential consideration is what or where the area of operations is. Larger vessels with longer ranges, available time at sea, and higher transit speeds could certainly be preferable if responding to a distant area. A more traditional MCM vessel might be a better option, with or without onboard ROV's, if the ops are within some of the confined and/or shallow littoral waters around Indonesia, Malaysia, or the Philippines. Especially if the area to be accessed might not have the most accurate or up to date charts of underwater objects.

 

[Ananda]

Currently TNI-AL anti mine operation centered on the two Tripartite MCMV and a few (numbers between 2-4) of ex German Kondor class mine sweeper that still operating.

From what I gather so far from locall media, seems what TNI-AL envision on this new German MCMV will be close to higher end MCMV able to operate independent on larger area.
They will equipped this MCMV besides on UUV and ROV for mine counter measure operation..but also facility for divers hyperbaric Chambers.. indicating they can operate outside litoral/oceanic environment.

Interestingly, there are previous comment from Naval Brass in local media that saying the two new German MCMV will not replacing Tripartite MCMV but the much older East German Kondor minesweeper.

So eventough the Jane's article above indicating this German's MCMV will replace the Tripartite MCMV..however there are possibilities that Tripartite MCMV will be maintain, thus making them more to Litoral/green water mine operation, while the new German's MCMV for longer range operation.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

Currently TNI-AL anti mine operation centered on the two Tripartite MCMV and a few (numbers between 2-4) of ex German Kondor class mine sweeper that still operating.

From what I gather so far from locall media, seems what TNI-AL envision on this new German MCMV will be close to higher end MCMV able to operate independent on larger area.
They will equipped this MCMV besides on UUV and ROV for mine counter measure operation..but also facility for divers hyperbaric Chambers.. indicating they can operate outside litoral/oceanic environment.

Interestingly, there are previous comment from Naval Brass in local media that saying the two new German MCMV will not replacing Tripartite MCMV but the much older East German Kondor minesweeper.

So eventough the Jane's article above indicating this German's MCMV will replace the Tripartite MCMV..however there are possibilities that Tripartite MCMV will be maintain, thus making them more to Litoral/green water mine operation, while the new German's MCMV for longer range operation.

It indeed makes more sense to replace the old obsolete worn out Type 89,2 Kondor II class ships, than the quite new Tripartite class. The Tripartite/Alkmaarklasse ships were one of the most modern minehunters in the '80s with their glassfibre reinforced polyester hulls, stealthy design, advanced sensors and electronics, active rudders, autopilot and the PAPs on board. So these ships can stay active with our navy for many years.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

Great new video of the sea trials of the 124 meter long KRI Semarang 594. Its really a nice one

First steel cutting was in April 2017, so the construction is finished in less than 2 years....really fast!

 

[Ananda]

Indonesia, DSME set to strike deal for submarines

Latest development between DSME and PT. PAL negotiation on 2nd Batch of U209-1400. Eventough report on Jane's and Korean media says that final assembly will be done in DSME yards, but PAL from various sources keep insisting that final assembly will be done in their yards in Surabaya.

Will see on how final agreement on work share conclusion.

 

[Stampede]

Great new video of the sea trials of the 124 meter long KRI Semarang 594. Its really a nice one

First steel cutting was in April 2017, so the construction is finished in less than 2 years....really fast!

I know there is bigger brighter and maybe better but I really like these ships.
A lot of capability for the size.
Value for money and quick to build I think sometimes we get carried away with the bells and whistles and forget what good basic design can offer.
Remembering its what it can do not what it cannot.
For a nation looking for a pacific support ship we would be had pressed to find a better value for money ship of this design.
Customised to our needs?
Something to consider.
Maybe two?

Regards S

 

[swerve]

A lot of capability for the money, I'd say. A good buy for countries with tight budgets, instead of well-used secondhand ships. Bought by Peru & the Philippines so far. But basic, I understand.

 

[Ananda]

The design it self is modular, and PAL already have several design that can be customize based on customer needs.

The largest design so far is for Malaysian MRSS which strech basic design to 163 meter (below is the model that being circulated in local forums).
For Thai's they are offering 140m+ design. In all the designs for Malaysia and Thailand are have different engines modules, more automation, but keep the simmilarly basic design base.

The Korean as the original design holder, from my understanding did not change much on the version build for Peru. However, if from what I read, Peru's version have more automation in places, compared to Indonesian Navy ones.

 

[StingrayOZ]

Malaysia also was looking at buying a bigger one.

Indonesia also operates ships like dr soeharso which was the parent design.
"As a hospital ship, has provided 1 ER room, 6 space polyclinics, and 2 treatment rooms with a capacity of each of the 20 beds. This ship has a crew of 75, 65 medical staff and able to accommodate 40 patients hospitalization. " I assume these have similar facilities. Big floating clincs.

I think partnering with Indonesia on Hospital/Pacific ships would be a good idea.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

Indonesia, DSME set to strike deal for submarines

Latest development between DSME and PT. PAL negotiation on 2nd Batch of U209-1400. Eventough report on Jane's and Korean media says that final assembly will be done in DSME yards, but PAL from various sources keep insisting that final assembly will be done in their yards in Surabaya.

Will see on how final agreement on work share conclusion.

I expect a bigger part of the production will be done by PAL, it will be weird if it will become less compared to the first contract...
Specially if you realize that it means that in total we have ordered 6 boats. The Mazagon shipyard in Mumbai for example, has also built all the six Scorpene class submarines for the Indian Navy.