Indonesia: 'green water navy'

[Ananda]

KSAL: Scorpene kemungkinan dibuat di Perancis dan RI

Kepala Staf TNI Angkatan Laut (KSAL) Laksamana TNI Muhammad Ali menyebut kemungkinan unit pertama kapal selam Scorpene pesanan Indonesia dari Naval Group ...

m.antaranews.com

TNI AL chief talk on potential the two Scorpene being build pararel one in NG facility and other in PAL facility. While PAL CEO so far still confidence that both can be build pararel in PAL facility. I believe what TNI-AL Chief talk, shown more realistic situation. First one should be better build in NG facility, use that as pattern for second one build in PAL. If second batch (rumours submarine #3&4) got contracted later on, then they can build in PAL as PAL already have learning curve.

Perhaps they (TNI-AL) want to make sure faster flows on building management on the submarine project.

KSAL beri sinyal beli alutsista China selepas dampingi RI 1 ke Beijing

Kepala Staf TNI Angkatan Laut (KSAL) Laksamana TNI Muhammad Ali memberi sinyal adanya rencana membeli alutsista buatan China selepas dia mendampingi Presiden ...

www.google.com

At the same occasion, He also give signal on procuring China build equipment. This is actually something that being circulating before, especially Type 52D Destroyer. Eventough China try to bundle it with S26 Submarine, rumours that I heard, TNI-AL only interested with 52D Destroyer.

TNI-AL so far come to 2 batch on each type, they procuring 2 SIGMA 10514, then 2 FMP/Babcock Arrowhead, then 2 Fincantieri PPA, 2 scorpone Evo, now potentially 2 Type 52D. Supposedly those only first batches, but seems this 2 for each type batch not having info on additional batches. There's risk they are going to have multiple types only with one batch of 2 on every procurement practices. Will see how this develop.

 

[Ananda]

PT PAL Percepat Pembangunan Kapal Fregat Ke-2, Dukung Peningkatan Pertahanan Nasional

PT PAL Indonesia bersama Kementerian Pertahanan (Kemhan) RI resmi melaksanakan keel laying atau peletakan lunas kapal Fregat Merah Putih ke-2 di Gedung Divisi Kapal Selam, PT PAL Indonesia, Surabaya, pada Jumat (15/11/2024).

www.google.com

PT PAL Indonesia Gelar Keel Laying Kapal Frigate Merah Putih Kedua, Target Rampung Maret 2025

Acara ini menandai dimulainya tahap konstruksi utama struktur badan kapal, yang sekaligus menjadi penanda awal usia kapal.

surabaya.inews.id

Keel laying for the 2nd FMP conducted today, and it is faster then schedule of March next year. Thus seems PAL able to speed up schedule of FMP program, especially the 2nd one. Now the question remain on the next batch of FMP/Arrowhead Derivative.

It is also not clear whether the SEWACO will be combination of Aselsan/Havelsan and Leonardo as being talk before, or only Aselsan/Havelsan. Seems PAL decide to speed ahead on construction, pararel with final decision on SEWACO.

 

[Ananda]

Indonesia Lays Keel of Second ‘Red White’ Frigate - Naval News

Indonesian state-owned shipbuilder PT PAL Indonesia conducted the keel laying ceremony for the second Red White-class frigate

www.navalnews.com

Naval News contributor put article covering 2nd FMP keel laying that being mentioned above. Thus this is just additional info. However seems he is focusing on the changes of FMP configurations posters from 1st FMP Keel laying, to 2nd ones.



He seems focus on the changes on radars in integrated mast. Seems the previous poster shown Leonardo products and current new one shown Aselsan Product. Personally I still see that the changes on SEWACO is not final yet, thus potential changes toward final configuration still can happen.

 

[Ananda]

http://instagr.am/p/DCrpDLbTi1w/


Indonesian submarine Tjakra (401) and Nagapasa (403), conducting exercises together. Seems the readiness of Nagapasa (DSME 209-1400) improving. Alltough some defense 'insiders' aka Salesman still talk trash on this class in his online accounts and channels.

Photo source from TNI-AL Submarine Command Instagram.

 

[Ananda]

Joint Statement on a new Strategic Partnership between the Republic of Indonesia and the United Kingdom: 21 November 2024

Joint Statement on a new Strategic Partnership between the Republic of Indonesia and the United Kingdom.

www.gov.uk

We also agreed to further our defence industrial partnership, including in the development of Indonesia’s Merah Putih General Purpose Frigate Programme. We anticipate growing this partnership over the coming years, to further strengthen Indonesia’s naval capabilities as well as our respective defence industries, supporting high value jobs and skills in both countries.

Looking at this joint statement, on defence seems UK hope to enlarge FMP program. It is been rumours that 2nd batch of FMP, PAL wants enlarge design from present Arrowhead 140 base batch 1.

This statement perhaps indicating further batches of FMP in future will still include Babcock participation.

 

[Ananda]

Kerja Sama Pertahanan Indonesia-Turkiye: Hal yang Perlu Dipertimbangkan

Fokus saat ini pada sistem darat dan UAV merupakan langkah strategis yang logis, mengingat tingkat kematangan kedua industri dalam DTIB Turkiye.

www.kompas.com

One of Local Defense Analysts company (I still personally refuse to call them Think Tank, as they are more sales agents), put seminar talking about Turkiye as suppliers to Indonesian Defense projects. This is the company where Frenchie Salesman coming from.

Thus it is predictable the article by one of their 'analysts' aka Salesman also talking trash on Turkiye involvement toward Indonesian Defense projects. I don't mind on 'analysts' that talk negative in media (whether online or printed ones), but this guys clearly "mask" their agenda by pretending to be 'impartial' Defense think tank. Masking their agenda as actual Salesman to gullible public even media.

Anyway the slide I want to point above is coming from one of the representatives of MinDef in that seminar clearly shown how Turkiye become increasingly main partner for some Indonesian naval projects. From FMP Frigate, Refurbishment of existing fleet and UAV. Clearly something that hit the nerve of those analysts.

Still Indonesian Defense procurement is erratic and can change until effective contract payment happen. I got the points on Turkiye Defense products are not havimg long proven track records yet. However don't mask yourselves as impartial Defense analysts. I have more respects foe those Defense insiders that clearly shown whose they are represent from beginning.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

Thank you for sharing.
The FPB-57 and Parchim class fleet combined, together thats more than 20 vessels, indeed a waste if you just retire them. An upgrade/refurbishent/modernization is indeed the best and most cost effective solution in my opinion. With this they can hopefully extend the service life with 15-20 years.

I also hope that with the involvement of TUSAS, IPTN and LEN will receive enough knowledge and expertise to develop the Elang Hitam UAV succesfully.

You have to admit that your friend is a good salesman, but it is indeed not really ethical correct to pretend to be an objective and neutral expert/journalist, while in fact he is just lobbying and brainwashing people for financial profit.

 

[koxinga]

I guess our French salesman is very happy to pitch this to TNI-AL's brass. It's getting silly, every model buy 2 each.

Original source/credits:

x.com

x.com

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

I guess our French salesman is very happy to pitch this to TNI-AL's brass. It's getting silly, every model buy 2 each.

Original source/credits:

x.com

x.com

So with this we will probably get a fleet of 2 SIGMA 10514, 2 Iver Huidfeldts, 2 PPA and 4 FTI Belharras --> 2+2+2+4.

Well, it could always be worse, like ordering a single unit from each frigate class on the market now...

 

[x100 XKR]

Whatever happened with the 2 PPA? I thought they are built already and ready to be commissioned come October, and we are at the end of November with only names of the boats being made available, but no clear service entry dates and no final configs yet?

 

[spoz]

I guess our French salesman is very happy to pitch this to TNI-AL's brass. It's getting silly, every model buy 2 each.

Original source/credits:

x.com

x.com

I wonder what his “Other Frigate” was; obviously not one fitted with Mark 41 and SM2 or SM6 missiles! Or Turkish Siper for that matter.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

Whatever happened with the 2 PPA? I thought they are built already and ready to be commissioned come October, and we are at the end of November with only names of the boats being made available, but no clear service entry dates and no final configs yet?

In this article
New Details on Fincantieri’s 'PPA frigates' programme for Indonesia - Naval News
they are talking about summer 2025.

And here an article from this month about the new names.
Indonesia secures facility to fund acquisition of Italian PPAs

 

[Ananda]

we will probably get a fleet of 2 SIGMA 10514, 2 Iver Huidfeldts, 2 PPA and 4 FTI Belharras --> 2+2+2+4.

Prabowo's joint statement in UK talk about more development with Babcock on FMP/Arrowhead 140 Frigate. Fincantieri already offer domestic build for next PPA batch. So potentially they can be 4 FMP and 4 PPA. Off course it is depends on budget, but Prabowo's already talk in one of his presentation on having at least 12 Frigates.

The FDI face competition from Istanbul Class, which's why Frenchie Salesman spreading negative 'assessment' on Turkiye defense products and 'Turkification' of FMP and refurbished fleet SEWACO to public. In the end NG FDI/FTI still has to face Turkiye lobby for the deal and even Babcock for more FMP batches.

So if they still going for 12 Frigates target, potentially can be 4 FMP, 4 PPA and 4 FDI or Istanbul class. However still could be 6 FMP and 6 PPA, and this is personally what I hope for. Sigma 10514 from what I gather potentially will be relegate as Corvette/Light Frigates catagory, similar with OPV-90.

It's getting silly, every model buy 2 each.

Don't forget potential 2 Type 52D Destroyer. China has to be given some defense program, especially if Boeing got projects. Well at least that's some political factions talks on balancing defense suppliers.

There're talks and rumours for AAW Destroyer Type 52D face Turkiye TF-2000. However the last one still in paper and potentially has to wait Turkiye own order.

In the end those are candidates that circulating now for Frigates and AAW Destroyers program. All back to budget, which's why I'm bit sceptical that FDI can win against Istanbul offer let alone Fincantieri ones. NG offer from what I heard is not going to be more economical then Fincantieri PPA offer, while PPA offer bigger range and capability.

 

[koxinga]

China has to be given some defense program, especially if Boeing got projects. Well at least that's some political factions talks on balancing defense suppliers.

I am seeing this as very likely, if recent missteps by Prabowo is any guide.

His statements on China's position on SCS apparently disregarded policy / position advice from Indon MOFA and heard that policy folks in MOFA was very very upset.

 

[Ananda]

It will depends also on his bargain with Trump. His people and Trump people that able to arrange that phone call with Trump. The tone both of them using shown opening for bargain. In the end his and Trump's circles full of business peoples.

His appointment for Foreign Minister shown he don't want to be dictate by present diplomats at MOFA. Yes I already heard some frustration from seniors ones, but younger ones seems waiting for the new foreign minister moves and Prabowo's brother Hashim which some call unofficial foreign minister. He is also the ones that have connection with Trump's circles

 

[Ananda]

x.com

x.com

Video from Kompas TV and Local enthusiasts X account shown TNI-AL fires their Exocet MM-40 Blk3, toward land target. This seems as exercise trial on their latest Exocet toward limited land attack capabilities. Something that MBDA already claim Blk3 has it.

 

[Ananda]

Keris FB account put this photo yesterday. They claim they got it from someone (means Indonesian personal) that visit Fincantieri facility. This photo become some talks yesterday in Indonesian forums as quite many believe the name is Photoshop.

While Keris admin claim it is not, and shown the gray paints base just being spray to close the previous Italian name with Indonesian ones.

Well for me as always, will see when the process already underway to finish all the deals. As from info that I got from Finance People, they still finalising the overall payment schemes.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

x.com

x.com

Video from Kompas TV and Local enthusiasts X account shown TNI-AL fires their Exocet MM-40 Blk3, toward land target. This seems as exercise trial on their latest Exocet toward limited land attack capabilities. Something that MBDA already claim Blk3 has it.

Here more details....

Indonesia Fires Exocet at Land Target for the First Time - Naval News

In a historic first, the Indonesian Navy (TNI AL) successfully used Exocet MM40 Block 3 Anti-Ship Missile in a land-attack mode...

www.navalnews.com

It is really good to have the MM40 Block 3 in TNI-AL's arsenal, much further range and capable to attack land targets, but also to do live fire exercises and tests.
A very satisfying test result btw.

 

[Ananda]

In the tradition of Indonesian defence procurement, then they decided to mix SSM not two but more the merrier.

1. Exocet MM40 Blk3,
2. Exocet SM39 Blk2,
3. Teseo MK2,
4. NSM,
5. Atmaca.
6. C705 Reverse Engineering program

The reason ? Why not.

 

[Ananda]

An Indonesian Enthusiasts site call Industry Made In Indonesia,put photos from Abeking-Rasmussen facility on Hydrografi Vessels that's previously being manufacture in Palindo Batam. Palindo act as subcontractor for Abeking-Rasmussen for hull.

Seems with fitting in begin by end of this year, the schedule for finish project by end of next year still in line.