Indian Navy (IN) News and Discussion

[aaaditya]

hey guys,great news,russians would be test flying the made for india mig29k's next week,these aircrafts are to be delivered this year.

here check out this link and article:

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...ext_week/articleshow/msid-1287441,curpg-2.cms

Just before President Vladimir Putin comes visiting India next week, Russia plans to conduct the "inaugural flight" of the aircraft carrier-borne MiG-29 fighter jets being produced for India.

Through the sonic boom generated by the MiG-29, Russia intends to send a strong message that it's keen to retain the edge over other countries in supplying military hardware and software to India despite deep inroads being made by Israel, France and now increasingly, the US.

India, after all, intends to spend a whopping $30 billion on weapon imports during the 11th Plan (2007-2012) period. By notching up defence deals worth over $20 billion between 1998 and 2005, India has already emerged as the largest arms importer in the developing world.

As part of the $1.6 billion (Rs 6,900 crore) deal signed with Russia in January 2004, the Indian Navy will get 16 MiG-29s along with the 44,570-tonne Admiral Gorshkov aircraft carrier, now rechristened INS Vikramaditya. While 12 of these fighters will be the single-seat 'K' variants, the other four will be twin-seater 'KUB' trainer versions.


"The first test flight of MiG-29KUB is likely to take place on January 22, to be followed by the MiG-29K version later," said a senior officer. Armed with eight types of air-to-air missiles, the MiG-29Ks on board INS Vikramaditya will make the Navy capable of striking deep into enemy territory from the high seas.

"The MiG-29Ks will also be capable of mid-air refuelling from IL-78 tankers, as well as other MiG-29Ks, under 'buddy-tanking'. While INS Vikramaditya will join us towards end-2008 after a full refit, the MiG-29 deliveries will begin this year," he said.

While Putin will be the chief guest at the Republic Day parade, Russian deputy prime minister and defence minister Sergei Borisovich Ivanov will land in India a few days earlier for the sixth meeting of the Inter-Governmental Commission on Military Technical Cooperation with his Indian counterpart A K Antony.

As reported earlier by TOI, Indsia and Russia are likely to come to an agreement on joint ventures for the multi-role transport aircraft, as well as the fifth-generation stealth fighter, during the high-level visits.

 

[aaaditya]

hey guys,great news,it seems that work has started on the submarine launched variant of the brahmos missiles.the brahmos corporation has requested the indian navy to spare one of its new kilo class of submarines for the installation and testing of the brahmos cruise missiles.

here check out this link and article:

http://www.indianexpress.com/story/21610.html

NEW DELHI, JANUARY 23 : Work has begun on a variant of the Indo-Russian BrahMos missile system that would, in the next few years, make India the only country with a submarine-launched supersonic cruise missile capability.

BrahMos, a joint venture between DRDO and Russia’s NPO Mashinostroyenia, has asked the Navy to spare one of its Russian-made Kilo-class submarines as a test platform for the new missile. The request is likely to be shortly addressed. The missile is concurrently being configured for Russia’s Amur-class submarines — boats that will compete for a second-line of submarine construction at Mazagon Docks parallel to the French Scorpene line.

“The missile will be identical in all respects to the vertically launched land or ship launched version. The only modification will be the installation of a 7.65 metre thick cylindrical module to the submarine structure to house the missiles and fire control system,” BrahMos CEO A Sivathanu Pillai told The Indian Express today on a tour of the company’s facility in New Delhi.
The 290 km anti-ship and land attack missile is currently operational in the ship-launched profile on the Navy’s INS Rajput destroyer and shore-based vehicle launched variants. The Army is to induct the missiles this year in multiple regiments. The air-launched version to begin preliminary tests this year, culminating in flight tests from an IAF Su-30MKI fighter next year.
The BrahMos is also likely to create history by becoming the first missile export from India—¿ the Malaysian Navy has expressed a keen interest in the system and is likely to formalise an order during the year. “We expect a bigger market than we analysed initially. We will export in the near future to a few friendly countries. We expect a total of 1,000 missiles to meet the demand of India, Russia and these countries in the foreseeable future. Demand for anti-ship missiles is high,” Dr G Leonov Alexander, first deputy Director General of NPO Mashinostroyenia, said. BrahMos has also set up a team to study the parameters of a parallel programme to create technologies over and above the missile’s current capabilities. “Competition will come, and we have to think of a parallel extension programme to maintain leadership. We have started joint study groups to arrive at the specifics of such an effort,” Pillai said. The three-new Talwar-class frigates on order from Russia, the three Delhi-class destroyers and Godavari-class frigates will soon be fitted with the BrahMos system.

 

[contedicavour]

A question for our Indian friends :

it appears that Fincantieri is working closely with the Indian Navy on a LHD project and that we aren't for the moment building one because we are trying to find common ground with the IN in order to cut costs.
Since the Trenton isn't exactly a young ship it may make sense the IN is training on it while waiting for a class of LHDs to be built.
Do you have any news on this programme ?

thks

cheers

 

[aaaditya]

A question for our Indian friends :

it appears that Fincantieri is working closely with the Indian Navy on a LHD project and that we aren't for the moment building one because we are trying to find common ground with the IN in order to cut costs.
Since the Trenton isn't exactly a young ship it may make sense the IN is training on it while waiting for a class of LHDs to be built.
Do you have any news on this programme ?

thks

cheers

as far as what i have heard is that italy is helping india with its aircraft carrier project,india is exploring the possiblities of a lhd,with garden reach shyipbuilders and engineers limited studying the french mistral class,this is the first time iam hearing about fincantieri participation,maybe you have confused the aircraft carrier project with the lhd project.

 

[aaaditya]

hey guys ,here is another confirmation regarding the existence of the atv nuclear submarine project,this time from none other than the chief spokesman of the external affairs ministry of the indian governement.

here check out this link and article:

http://www.outlookindia.com/pti_news.asp?gid=73&id=446127


India developing nuclear submarines: Shyam Saran

BANGALORE, JAN 25 (PTI)
India is developing nuclear submarines, a key official said.
"As far as nuclear submarines are concerned, I think certainly my information is that we are engaged in research and development in that area", former Foreign Secretary and India's nuclear envoy Shyam Saran said.
Saran, who is the Interlocutor with the US administration on the nuclear energy deal, was responding to a specific query from a member of audience at the National Institute of Advanced Studies, where he delivered the second annual Raja Ramanna lecture last night.
Speaking on "evolution of India's nuclear policies in the context of changing security perceptions", the Special Envoy of Prime Minister -- responding to Russian President Vladimir Putin's statement -- said Moscow cannot provide nuclear supplies to India unless the guidelines of the Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG) are "adjusted".
Putin said earlier this week that Russia will "directly" help India in construction of atomic energy facilities.
Saran said, "We may enter into agreement for supply of some nuclear power plants but the transfer can take place only once the NSG guidelines have been adjusted".

Saran said inputs from a widespectrum of people are being gathered to put together a "good negotiating brief" as India gets into the negotiation of the "123 agreement" -- the conclusion of which would lead to operationalisation of the nuclear energy cooperation.

There will be "give and take" at the negotiation of the 123 agreement but certain principles and markers would not be compromised, he said.
Saran said India took a decision in 1983 to pursue a weapons programme -- though discreetly --, after it became apparent that not only was China improving its nuclear weapons capability but there were credible reports that this capability was being shared with Pakistan.
"Failure to do so (decision on pursuing a nuclear weapons programme in 1983) may have resulted in India's permanent strategic inferiority", he remarked.
On the nuclear deal with the US, Saran asserted that India's sovereignty has not been compromised. "We have not accepted any kind of limitations on our strategic programme", he repeatedly said. "We are free to continue our strategic programme". Saran also said India has not given any fresh commitment with respect to any limitations, including nuclear testing.

 

[contedicavour]

as far as what i have heard is that italy is helping india with its aircraft carrier project,india is exploring the possiblities of a lhd,with garden reach shyipbuilders and engineers limited studying the french mistral class,this is the first time iam hearing about fincantieri participation,maybe you have confused the aircraft carrier project with the lhd project.

No I'm sure - Fincantieri is trying to ensure joint work on a class of LHDs of which the 2 first in class ships would be built simultaneously in Italy and in India. We could build ours now but apparently we're waiting to receive an official answer from the Indian Ministry of Defence. Fincantieri and the Italian MOD are available to consider design and specs adaptations in order to increase commonality and reduce unitary prices.

cheers

 

[aaaditya]

No I'm sure - Fincantieri is trying to ensure joint work on a class of LHDs of which the 2 first in class ships would be built simultaneously in Italy and in India. We could build ours now but apparently we're waiting to receive an official answer from the Indian Ministry of Defence. Fincantieri and the Italian MOD are available to consider design and specs adaptations in order to increase commonality and reduce unitary prices.

cheers

can you provide any further details on this project,like specifications and images,also is it a new design or an old one?

 

[aaaditya]

hey guys,great news,dcn has been selected to provide rafted transmission sets for the indian navies 4 p28 class stealth missile corvettes.

here check out this link and article:

http://www.dcn.fr/us/medias/popup.php?id=133

Paris, 21 December 2006

Indian naval shipbuilder Garden Reach Shipbuilders & Engineers Ltd. (GRSE*) has awarded DCN a contract to provide a comprehensive engineering package of Propulsion Power Transmission System raft mounted for four anti-submarine warfare Corvettes for the Indian Navy.
DCN won the Contract following an international competition.
The Services will be provided under DCN responsibility with an Indian Company Walchandnagar Industries Ltd. in partnership with DCN.
Each gear unit and the associated engines will be mounted on a common raft. Other components include thrust blocks, and systems auxiliaries. DCN will also provide support to GRSE* for the mechanical integration of the propulsion plant.
*GRSE is a public sector undertaking under India's Ministry of Defence and a major warship builder based in Kolkata (India).

 

[contedicavour]

can you provide any further details on this project,like specifications and images,also is it a new design or an old one?

It's a new design although it leverages learnings from the Cavour carrier class. Overall it's a 20,000 tonne LHD with 2 alternative solutions possible : through-deck with a big island or no thorough-deck and a big superstructure amidships including a hangar for heavy helos, leaving huge helo landing areas ahead and behind the superstructure.
I do have a picture in my computer, I'll find it.

cheers

 

[contedicavour]

Here is the picture I mentioned in the previous post

 

[Rich]

Whatever happened to that IN plan to lease those Akulas?

I am impressed by the continual expansion of the Indian Navy. At the present rate of growth in practically every warship category it seems to me that India is fast heading towards becoming a naval superpower.

If you want to get a good "feel" for the IN then spend some time in Google Earth in India. After awhile you learn good "indicators" for the comparative strengths and weaknesses of a military/Industrial complex. Whats impressive about India isn't just the ships and boats you see in the Sat pictures ; Its the strength of their shipbuilding, repair, and support facilities. Add to that their naval bases appear well ordered and ships look well maintained, "yes you can tell".

Buzzing around in that app one can see enough chicken crap 3rd world navies rusting away with their crummy shore facilities. India isn't one of them. They have also shown the Political will to march towards the eventual aim of a indigenous navy, or close to one.

Overall very impressive I think.

 

[aaaditya]

Here is the picture I mentioned in the previous post

it doesnt look stealthy,by the way does it carry armament of its own?

 

[aaaditya]

hey guys,interesting article,this is the first that there is a mention of a sub surface ballistic nuclear (ssbn) in the naval circles,i wonder if there are any plans to develop a small number of such sub surface ballistic nuclears(ssbn's) for the indian navy.

here check out this link and article:

http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/holnus/001200701281230.htm

"Work on nuke deterrence for Navy underway"

New Delhi, Jan. 28 (PTI): Noting that India's strategic forces already possessed land and aircraft-based nuclear deterrence capabilities, a former Navy chief has said work on such an option for the naval forces has already begun.
"India's Nuclear Doctrine clearly envisages a deterrent in the form of a triad with land-based, aircraft-borne and submarine-launched legs. Of these, we possess only the first two at the moment," Admiral (Retd) Arun Prakash said in an article in the forthcoming issue of Indian Defence Review.
Maintaining that the "only platform" which could achieve deterrence was the nuclear-propelled, ballistic-missile-armed submarines (SSBNs), he said to complete the triad of the strategic forces, "we must have a small number of SSBNs."
"Development work is reported to be underway, and when this platform becomes operationally available, we will need suitable areas in the distant reaches of the Indian Ocean from where it can be safely deployed to pose deterrence to our adversaries," the erstwhile Navy chief said in an article entitled 'A Vision for Maritime India: 2020'. Observing that nuclear weapons were not meant for fighting wars but acted as a deterrent, he said it convinced the enemy of the "futility of contemplating a nuclear first strike", as retaliatory action would be horrific and have a devastating impact on the adversary to make such a strike pointless.

 

[contedicavour]

it doesnt look stealthy,by the way does it carry armament of its own?

Well bulky LHDs aren't easily made stealthy... for the moment there is no armament planned but it can easily mount CIWS, all the more if the variant with a big superstructure is retained.
Btw it can transport a whole regiment of Marines.

cheers

 

[aaaditya]

hey guys,great news,usa has offered india its aegis missile system.

here check out this link and article:

http://www.hindustantimes.com/news/181_1914076,0008.htm

The US is offering India one of the world's most formidable shipboard missile systems that has the potential of being integrated with the country's indigenous missiles.
There was "some interest" in the Indian defence establishment in the Aegis system but neither has the US made an offer nor has India made any formal request for it, says Royce Caplinger, managing director of Lockheed Martin India, whose US parent manufactures the system.
"I am sure though that if you ask for it, you will get it," India Strategic defence magazine quotes him as saying.
The feelers to sell the Aegis are obviously part of the US government's agenda to help India become what the State Department called in its May 2005 policy statement "a global power."
Apparently, it is also part of the steps that are systematically being taken - like the civil nuclear deal - to draw New Delhi closer to Washington.
Aegis is named after the shield of mythological Greek god Zeus. Its sale, like of most military systems, is governed through government-to-government deals under Foreign Military Sales (FMS) or other US programmes. It appears, though, that Lockheed Martin, the world's biggest military vendor, has informal clearance to showcase the system to India.
The integrated combat system can track more than 100 missiles through its supercomputers and engage them according to priority, depending upon their velocity and height, including the sea-skimming attackers.
It is designed for multi-pronged, simultaneous warfare to engage and strike targets in the air, on sea, on the surface, as also sub-surface. Aegis has also been successful in half a dozen tests to intercept ballistic missile targets outside the earth's atmosphere.
Caplinger said Aegis had been successively modified and upgraded in technology over the years and that it was "the most advanced shipboard system" in the world to counter a variety of threats, including from aircraft and ballistic missiles.
Asked if it could be integrated with India's indigenous missiles, including the India-Russian BrahMos, he replied: "Theoretically yes." It could even be matched with the new anti-missile missile that India recently tested, "but that would depend entirely on the Indian scientists and India's requirements."
"The MK 41 Vertical Launching System (that is integrated into the Aegis system) is not currently configured to integrate the BrahMos or Agni, but it can be adapted," Caplinger added.
The fact that the Aegis system could manage vertical launch of missiles was important, particularly as the Indian Navy had a long-term plan to build several ships equipped with the facility to meet its projected requirements.
Its sophisticated SPY-I phased array radar and high-speed supercomputers read each oncoming threat 360 degrees, prioritise them according to their threat value, and then automatically launch appropriate missiles to neutralise them.
The latest version of the system is called Aegis BMD 3.6. In June 2006, it successfully intercepted even the separating warhead of a target missile in a test at the Pacific Missile Range Facility.
The system's command and decision-making core is notable. Its computers differentiate between missiles, debris, and friendly aerial vehicles - and attack only what needs to be attacked.
Thus far, Aegis has only been sold to close US allies, Spain, Japan, South Korea, Norway and Australia. It is deployed on 69 US destroyers and cruisers and is being added on 17 more destroyers.
Thus, it is the mainstay "total weapon system" of the US Navy. According to Caplinger, Aegis was a very powerful system and would give an edge like no other to the Indian Navy.
The Aegis programme was launched in 1969 due to the changing nature of warfare that required transition from guns to missiles.
In 1967, a Soviet-built missile had sunk an Israeli destroyer in the Arab-Israeli war while in 1982, Argentina successfully used an Exocet missile to sink a Royal Navy frigate during the Falklands conflict. In 1988, when two Iranian vessels fired on US ships, the US Navy had used Harpoon missiles to neutralise them.

 

[aaaditya]

hey guys,great news,larsen and toubro has now officially entered indian shipbuilding industry ,by laying down the keel of its first vessel at its hazira shipyard,thus opening a new chapter in indian naval and maritime history.

here check out this link and article:

http://www.businessstandard.com/common/storypage_c_online.php?leftnm=11&bKeyFlag=IN&autono=20051

L&T starts ship-building at HaziraOur Web Bureau / Mumbai January 27, 2007Larsen & Toubro (L&T) has laid the keel for the first ship within 17 weeks of commencing operations at its ship-building yard at Hazira near Surat, Gujarat.

The 180-tonne keel block - the heaviest-ever by an Indian shipyard - was placed on the erection bay by Meindert Van Genderen, director, Rolldock, Netherlands in the presence of A M Naik, chairman & managing director, L&T.

According to a release issued by L&T to the BSE today, keel laying - an important milestone in ship-building - represents the joining of the modular components of the ship and signals the commencement of assembling the hull.

Genderen reiterated their trust and confidence in L&T's capabilities and commitment to the project.

Naik said ship-building represented a major thrust area for the company with the Hazira shipyard marking the beginning of the strategic initiative. Detailed expansion plans for the Hazira shipyard involve expanding capacity to construct eight vessels up to 20,000 dwt per annum.

L&T had marked its entry into the field in April 2006 by securing an order from the Netherlands-based Rolldock (earlier Zadeko Ship Management) for four heavy lift semi-submersible cargo ships.

 

[contedicavour]

hey guys,great news,usa has offered india its aegis missile system.

here check out this link and article:

http://www.hindustantimes.com/news/181_1914076,0008.htm

The US is offering India one of the world's most formidable shipboard missile systems that has the potential of being integrated with the country's indigenous missiles.
There was "some interest" in the Indian defence establishment in the Aegis system but neither has the US made an offer nor has India made any formal request for it, says Royce Caplinger, managing director of Lockheed Martin India, whose US parent manufactures the system.
"I am sure though that if you ask for it, you will get it," India Strategic defence magazine quotes him as saying.
The feelers to sell the Aegis are obviously part of the US government's agenda to help India become what the State Department called in its May 2005 policy statement "a global power."
Apparently, it is also part of the steps that are systematically being taken - like the civil nuclear deal - to draw New Delhi closer to Washington.
Aegis is named after the shield of mythological Greek god Zeus. Its sale, like of most military systems, is governed through government-to-government deals under Foreign Military Sales (FMS) or other US programmes. It appears, though, that Lockheed Martin, the world's biggest military vendor, has informal clearance to showcase the system to India.
The integrated combat system can track more than 100 missiles through its supercomputers and engage them according to priority, depending upon their velocity and height, including the sea-skimming attackers.
It is designed for multi-pronged, simultaneous warfare to engage and strike targets in the air, on sea, on the surface, as also sub-surface. Aegis has also been successful in half a dozen tests to intercept ballistic missile targets outside the earth's atmosphere.
Caplinger said Aegis had been successively modified and upgraded in technology over the years and that it was "the most advanced shipboard system" in the world to counter a variety of threats, including from aircraft and ballistic missiles.
Asked if it could be integrated with India's indigenous missiles, including the India-Russian BrahMos, he replied: "Theoretically yes." It could even be matched with the new anti-missile missile that India recently tested, "but that would depend entirely on the Indian scientists and India's requirements."
"The MK 41 Vertical Launching System (that is integrated into the Aegis system) is not currently configured to integrate the BrahMos or Agni, but it can be adapted," Caplinger added.
The fact that the Aegis system could manage vertical launch of missiles was important, particularly as the Indian Navy had a long-term plan to build several ships equipped with the facility to meet its projected requirements.
Its sophisticated SPY-I phased array radar and high-speed supercomputers read each oncoming threat 360 degrees, prioritise them according to their threat value, and then automatically launch appropriate missiles to neutralise them.
The latest version of the system is called Aegis BMD 3.6. In June 2006, it successfully intercepted even the separating warhead of a target missile in a test at the Pacific Missile Range Facility.
The system's command and decision-making core is notable. Its computers differentiate between missiles, debris, and friendly aerial vehicles - and attack only what needs to be attacked.
Thus far, Aegis has only been sold to close US allies, Spain, Japan, South Korea, Norway and Australia. It is deployed on 69 US destroyers and cruisers and is being added on 17 more destroyers.
Thus, it is the mainstay "total weapon system" of the US Navy. According to Caplinger, Aegis was a very powerful system and would give an edge like no other to the Indian Navy.
The Aegis programme was launched in 1969 due to the changing nature of warfare that required transition from guns to missiles.
In 1967, a Soviet-built missile had sunk an Israeli destroyer in the Arab-Israeli war while in 1982, Argentina successfully used an Exocet missile to sink a Royal Navy frigate during the Falklands conflict. In 1988, when two Iranian vessels fired on US ships, the US Navy had used Harpoon missiles to neutralise them.

Oh ho this would change a lot of scenarios !
An Aegis & SM2-equipped Indian Navy would fill its only real major weakness, its limited AAW (unless a carrier is nearby). Forget Barak-II and new Elta radars. Shame though this would kill chances of exporting Aster missiles and EMPAR/Herakles radars.

cheers

 

[aaaditya]

Oh ho this would change a lot of scenarios !
An Aegis & SM2-equipped Indian Navy would fill its only real major weakness, its limited AAW (unless a carrier is nearby). Forget Barak-II and new Elta radars. Shame though this would kill chances of exporting Aster missiles and EMPAR/Herakles radars.

cheers

i believe that the aster or the barak2 missiles can be integrated with the aegis system,in which case india may acquire the aegis system minus the sm missiles and integrate them with the barak2 or aster missiles.

 

[contedicavour]

i believe that the aster or the barak2 missiles can be integrated with the aegis system,in which case india may acquire the aegis system minus the sm missiles and integrate them with the barak2 or aster missiles.

Probably. Though if you can get your hands on SM2-III with their range of 167km why even bother buying lower ranged missiles - besides the fact that integration with Aegis software must carry costs since I doubt the USN (or Lockheed or GD) ran that type of tests.

cheers

 

[aaaditya]

hey guys,great news,india has invited boeing to conduct field trials of its p8mma aircraft on offer for the indian navy.

here check out this link and article:

http://www.financialexpress.com/fe_full_story.php?content_id=153110

US aircraft manufacturer Boeing has been invited by the Indian Navy for field trials of the $133-million P-8I multi-mission maritime reconnaissance aircraft.
The trials of the P-8I aircraft, to be taken place in Goa and Vizag soon, are expected to replace the navy's 8-10 TU-142 Bear aircraft that are being phased out after negotiations with Russia and Israel to retrofit them were called off.

Successful procurement of these aircraft will certainly contribute to India's capabilities, as its naval responsibilities undergo rapid growth.

Boeing has been urging India to broaden rules of its offset policy relating to the deal to allow companies to look across the nation's aviation business, including its defence and commercial aircraft activities. During a recent visit to India, Boeing Integrated Defense Systems' president Jim Albaugh had said, “The policy should be opened to the entire aero-space segment, and if done right, offsets will introduce more complex technology and processes that India doesn't currently enjoy.”