European Armour

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Waylander

Defense Professional
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@Wooki
Ah, ok. I understand what you wanted to say.
I didn't want to sound like a smart ass. :)
 
G

Grand Danois

Entertainer
The Canadians are discussing sending up to 20 Leopard C2's to Afghanistan. This made have a look into what kinda MBT it is. I found this passage which made me curious:

The Leopard C2 was designed so it can be fitted with add-on armour and all of the new battlefield sensing and communication systems the Army plans to introduce over the next few years. There are 114 in service.

Leopard C2 Tank
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Does anyone know what kind of add-on armour they could use?
 
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kams

New Member
Grand Danois said:
The Canadians are discussing sending up to 20 Leopard C2's to Afghanistan. This made have a look into what kinda MBT it is. I found this passage which made me curious:



Does anyone know what kind of add-on armour they could use?
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Could be any of the systems mentioned in this link.

armour add on

Make sure that you read the next page on the link too.
 
W

Waylander

Defense Professional
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Nice to see but not usefull in combat.
But you are right this needs a good crew.
Sad to say that I never made it to Shilo. I heard nice storys about this from older comrades. :)
 
G

Grand Danois

Entertainer
kams said:
Could be any of the systems mentioned in this link.

armour add on

Make sure that you read the next page on the link too.
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Whoah! A lot of posts since I followed your link! Thanks (all)!

I now do realize it is MEXAS they can use, did so on 5 tanks in Yugoslavia.

Looks awesome on those Imageshack pics! ;)

Found an article regarding their deployment.

Ottawa Citizen
 
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G

Grand Danois

Entertainer
robsta83 said:
Fwooh thats some mighty fine handling, cant be to upset with that gunnery either, good for Canada giving its Armour Corp some combat experience re any Afghanastani deployment.
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A new form of air support! ;)
 
R

rattmuff

Lurk-loader?
Is there any conclusions of this thread?

Might somebody count everything... shit the same, I'll give it a try.

I have also found out that Sweden have 700(!!!) CV90s. 509 are in Swedish Armed Forces service, while the rest must to be assigned to FMV(Swedish Defence Materiel Administration) and FOI(Swedish Defence Research Agency).

Another thing is that the 160 Leopard 2A4 is placed in mech. infantry and the 120 Strv. 122(Leopard 2S) is placed in armor.
 
G

Grand Danois

Entertainer
rattmuff said:
Is there any conclusions of this thread?

Might somebody count everything... shit the same, I'll give it a try.

I have also found out that Sweden have 700(!!!) CV90s. 509 are in Swedish Armed Forces service, while the rest must to be assigned to FMV(Swedish Defence Materiel Administration) and FOI(Swedish Defence Research Agency).

Another thing is that the 160 Leopard 2A4 is placed in mech. infantry and the 120 Strv. 122(Leopard 2S) is placed in armor.
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From post # 128 from this thread.

Alright, time for a MBT tally
I have only counted those that seemed to be assigned for operational use. So I tried to leave out mothballed/warstock/reserves etc. I have also not counted those that are about to be taken out of service.

"1st line"
LEO2A5/2A5S/2A6/2A6(M)/2E/2A6HEL + Leclerc + Challenger 2 + Ariete = 2027

"2nd line"
LEO2A4/2A4NO = 822

"3rd line"
LEO1A5/1A5NO/A3GR/1V + M60A3/A3TTS/TTS + M48A5 + T72M1 = 1804

If you disagree on the partition of a 1/2/3 line, then input is welcome.

EDIT: Just remembered Poland has 128 LEO2A4. These have now been added to the tally.

http://www.defencetalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=70102&postcount=128
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But there is plenty of other armoured vehicles to count in this thread. ;)
 
R

rrrtx

New Member
TrangleC said:
Real democracies need their money for more important things - at least if they are that unlikely to be attacked by another army as european countries are.

Looking at the USA with their almost non existant social funding or public health care system and the stupendous military budget on the other hand that doesn't really leave enough to deal with catastrophies like the one in New Orleans, they rather fit in with other rougue states as North Korea and all those other ugly little dictatorships and military runned nations where the public is left to it's own (what often means starvation in the third world and needing 3 jobs and still not being able to live a decent life in the USA) to have enough money for weapons.
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I thought we had some sort of restriction on nasty political comments at this site. Is this considered acceptable?
 
E

eckherl

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
rrrtx said:
I thought we had some sort of restriction on nasty political comments at this site. Is this considered acceptable?
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Don`t let people like this get at you, the irony of it all is the country that he is from, he is one that forgets what our country did for his after WW2 and during the Cold War.
 
F

FutureTank

Banned Member
The scenario?

Interesting exercise in accounting, but as I understand the purpose of the thread was to explore utility of a 'European Army' in a scenario.

I have worked on such a hypothetical scenario at the end of 2000, and if anyone is interested I can run it by the forum.
 
G

Grand Danois

Entertainer
FutureTank said:
Interesting exercise in accounting, but as I understand the purpose of the thread was to explore utility of a 'European Army' in a scenario.

I have worked on such a hypothetical scenario at the end of 2000, and if anyone is interested I can run it by the forum.
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The initiating post was about counting amour...

But if you do have a 'ready made' scenario, I would be very curious to see it.

In a new thread, of course. :)
 
F

FutureTank

Banned Member
Grand Danois said:
The initiating post was about counting amour...

But if you do have a 'ready made' scenario, I would be very curious to see it.

In a new thread, of course. :)
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Well, this is why I asked first, because my (edited) reading below is quite different :)

if we could conceive a European Army, composed of the Armies of the nations now belonging to the European Union,...etc, in terms of armoured vehicles,...etc,
A) what could we conclude on the strength of such combined forces and operationality, in 2006
B) and in the years to come (almost all UE nations are cuting defense expenditures),
c) and is it even possible, even partially to compare with other major armies, such as, the US Army?
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The question of the thread was therefore not only about dscussion of the equipment, its accounting and existing OOBs, but also operational use of these forces now and in future, and comparative doctrine, since forces ar there to be used.

If the moderators agree with this, then I would prefer to continue in this thread because of all the information on the forces already provided here in previous posts.
 
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