Air Force Brat
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Marc the Article also states, "USAF sources say that the Typhoon has good energy and a pretty good first turn, but that they were able to outmanoeuver the Germans due to the Raptor's thrust vectoring". Additionally the Typhoon was not able to match the high angle of attack capability of the F-22. "We ended up with numerous gunshots" another USAF pilot says" so when you read the whole article it makes it quite obvious that someone is exaggerating.Found a quote from some fast jet pilots that I found interesting:
Grune says that the Raptor's advantage lies in its stealth and ability to dominate air-to-air fights from beyond visual range. That is not disputed by USAF sources.
"Its unique capabilities are overwhelming from our first impressions in terms of modern air combat," Pfeiffer says. "But once you get to the merge, which is only a very small spectrum of air combat, in that area the Typhoon doesn't have to fear the F-22 in all aspects."
It was from this article:
IN FOCUS: German Eurofighters impress during Red Flag debut
There is the usual willy waving from both sides obviously, and it did not involve the F-35 for obvious reasons, however it did bring home that the way the VLO F-22 is going to be operated, they believe that the traditional fighter furball is going to represent a only very small part of future air to air engagements. Kinda proves what AD, GF, AD, Spudman et al have been saying all along - it's not about instantaneous turn rates and thrust vectoring and zipping along at Mach 2+. It's about exploiting the LO properties of your airframe and the combat system you are connected to to plug the bad guys before they even see you - let alone get to engage you in a dogfight. That's not to say the F-35 will be a total lame duck, just to point out that the concept of how fighter engagements are fought has changed.
Pfeiffer also notes the Eurofighter has better acceleration and can outclimb the F-22, he also states that the Raptor sinks when using its TVC, although one USAF source says he is skeptical of the German claims. Rather than sink, I would say the Raptor squats and pushes the tail down when using TVC to increase pitch.
The whole purpose of this excercise was to get the German pilots up to Nato standard and into the same league as the RAF boys, in fact the eight birds in this excercise had software upgrades to bring them up to standards, the last bird received its upgrade on the flight line in Alaska, the other German birds had not yet been upgraded when this excersise was performed.
The Typhoon is good, but I doubt it is on the level of the F-22 without TVC, which does remain an option for all the Eurofighters as an upgrade.
Thanks again Marc for linking the article, it is indeed interesting, and I would suggest that everyone give it a once over.