Russia wants French Helicopter Carriers...

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nevidimka

New Member
So far the US has been really quiet about this. It would be interesting to know what the US take on this? Perhaps they thought the whole thing was very much impossible. But if the French does go ahead, then they might have some opinions on it.
 
S

Salty Dog

Defense Professional
Verified Defense Pro
nevidimka said:
So far the US has been really quiet about this. It would be interesting to know what the US take on this? Perhaps they thought the whole thing was very much impossible. But if the French does go ahead, then they might have some opinions on it.
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If there are any US source systems on the Mistral class to be sold, then the US Gov't will need to grant permission for their sale and transfer.
 
Feanor

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
Ozzy Blizzard said:
Well considering the Baltic fleet’s current sea lift capacity this would represent a significant increase in the threat it poses to the Estonians.

I would assume they ARE worried about missile deployments in their neck of the woods.

In any case Estonia's security relies on the commitment of the major European powers, perhaps they view any arms deal between France and Russia as a negative outcome.
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Excellent point. The significance is not the deal itself, but what deal implies about Russian relations with the west.
 
Feanor

Feanor

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Staff member
It seems the deal is practically decided on. The Mistral is visint St. Peters, will take part in Baltic Fleet exercises including practicing a Ka-52 landing on the Mistral, and meanwhile Putin is meeting with unnamed French officials in Paris to talk about the purchase. In addition to one ship purchased in France, 4 more are to be built under license.

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Feanor

Feanor

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The weapon systems are allegedly to be replaced with Russian equivalents. I don't know about the radar or anything else.
 
W

Wall83

Member
No final decision yet.

Russia yet to decide on French warship deal - Putin | Top Russian news and analysis online | 'RIA Novosti' newswire

"Asked whether he could guarantee the warships in question would not be used against Georgia, Putin said it was up to Russia to decide where or how to use its own weapons."

I must say that Im suprised by this move by the Russians, basicly nothing big has been launched in russia in 10 years now and suddenly four Mistrals can join the navy in just a few years.

First the 50 new Sukhoi fightes and now this, has the red bear woke up?
 
Feanor

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
ÀÐÌÑ-ÒÀÑÑ

French sources say that the negotiations are almost complete. The rumored price tag is 900 mln Euro.

As for defense purchases, there's been a few big ones. The Borei project, with the first one completed and 3 more in the works. The T-90A program, which has reached deliveries of ~120 units to the Army annually. BTR production is at 150-200 units for the Army annually. The Su-34 contract has been signed for iirc 56 aircraft. The Nakhimov is to be returned to service. The Mi-28N deliveries have been coming to the NCMD. Some of these programs are more successful then others. And I have my suspicions about Russian shipyards putting together the other 4 Mistrals. But at least the one purchased from France will be good to go.
 
T

the road runner

Active Member
Wall83 said:
900 mIn Euro for one ship? I thought one Mistral cost about 4-500 Milions.
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Thats pretty steep isnt it 900 million Euros?:confused:that must include spares/ training ect?

Australia is paying $2billion Australian for 2 Canberra classes

Money and politics aside,it would be great for Russian ship building to get some follow on orders for Mistrals.............

Regards
 
D

DarthAmerica

Defense Professional
Verified Defense Pro
Feanor said:
Excellent point. The significance is not the deal itself, but what deal implies about Russian relations with the west.
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Russia has made it clear it intends to defend it's periphery. By force when necessary. The stated policy is to rely on smaller more mobile forces and of course to back them up with a nuclear deterrent. A ship like this will reduce deployment time for Russian ground forces from days to hours anywhere in the Baltics or Georgia. This ship is designed for extended duration operations and could will enhance Russia's capability to conduct vertical envelopment operations from the sea.

This isn't something most NATO countries will have to fear but for others who are not protected by the treaty it will certainly cause concern. I think it's also a message to the Russian ship building industry as well to shape up or business will "ship" out. There are some politics behind this as well but I'd rather not go beyond the scope of the thread/forum.

-DA
 
Feanor

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
The 900 mln allegedly will be for licensing, technology transfers, etc. in addition to the actual ship.
 
S

Sea Toby

New Member
Wall83 said:
900 mIn Euro for one ship? I thought one Mistral cost about 4-500 Milions.
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When did France buy the first one, several years ago. Using budget figures from nearly ten years ago isn't exactly current, is it? Plus Russia is buying a license to build more.
 
Feanor

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
It depends. Sevmash would be an obvious choice. It has the facilities, and the experience (at least in theory). Baltiyskiy Zavod might be another choice. Iirc they also have the drydocks for it. And it might go to Baltiyskiy, given how much trouble Sevmash has been in lately.
 
K

KiwiRob

Well-Known Member
I was also thinking Baltisky along with Admirality. Admioralty is probably the best large ship builder in Russia, It's a pity Nikolayev is no longer Russia as the Black Sea Yard would be a shoe in for this job.
 
W

Wall83

Member
Nice reading about the Mistral deal.

What kind of ship do the Russian naval infantry need? | Top Russian news and analysis online | 'RIA Novosti' newswire

Acording to the article Ka-52 helos landed on the ship while it visited St. Petersburg.

In the opinion of military expert Mikhail Barabanov, the editor-in-chief of Moscow Defense Brief magazine, who personally inspected the ship, the Mistral is a "considered and balanced ship design that meets specific French requirements - an expeditionary ship for prolonged operations in remote waters, including use as a command ship, with minimal requirements for its own 'tactical component.'"

The ship's designation is determined by its design - to keep costs down, it was built with commercial technology, with significantly lower requirements for durability and is reminiscent of a civilian cruise ship. The Mistral's weaponry is limited to two short-range missile launchers, two 30mm anti-aircraft guns and four heavy machine guns. Consequently, the ship needs a strong escort.

The Mistral's landing potential is not extensive primarily because of its high standards of crew and troop comfort, which are based on the requirements of prolonged deployment.

Nevertheless, the Mistral does have considerable capabilities for use as a command ship, floating hospital, base for peacekeeping operations and to provide aid in emergency situations.

In general, the Mistral design would require extensive modification for Russian Navy use. It would need to provide for the deployment of Russian-made helicopters and to have its landing and air defense capabilities increased, taking into account the high probability that the ship would be used in serious armed conflicts (as compared with the French Navy's the missions).
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