Royal New Zealand Navy Discussions and Updates

Sea Toby

New Member
Thinking about names for a minute, how come there has never been an HMNZS Auckland, we have had a lot of other place names used for ships but never one named after the biggest and most important region in NZ, it's really quite insulting. Maybe this could/should be corrected with the ANZAC replacements.
The Anzacs weren't even named after regions, where they? Why do you think the Anzac replacements will?

Appears the RNZN will take delivery of the OPVs, Otago and Wellington by the end of this year. While they are a bit overweight, the navy should be able to watch their weight in the future. I won't look forward to major upgrades with the OPVs outside possible modernizations to their electronics.
 

KiwiRob

Well-Known Member
True the ANZACs have joke names which mean nothing to the vast majority of kiwis, homefully they will correct this mistake on their replacements.
 

mattyem

New Member
True the ANZACs have joke names which mean nothing to the vast majority of kiwis, homefully they will correct this mistake on their replacements.
I wouldn't call their names jokes, I think they are quite appropriate the strong and the prestige. Kaha and mana are fairly well known throughout nz and everyone one ive talked to has an knew or had a fair idea of their translation, but agree with the point that was made earlier on about them not talking on names of previous HMNZS ships! oh and there has been a ship named after auckland HMNZS TAMAKI (but I guess to a "vast majority of kiwi's" that would mean nothing)
 

Sea Toby

New Member
I prefer naming ships after cities and towns, similar to Australia. You don't get the same political support as much with rivers, lakes, mountains, bays, capes, points, etc...

States, regions, or counties have a similar affect, but in my opinion not as effective as cities and towns... I agree, one would think New Zealand would have named a ship Auckland before...
 

Gibbo

Well-Known Member
Thinking about names for a minute, how come there has never been an HMNZS Auckland, we have had a lot of other place names used for ships but never one named after the biggest and most important region in NZ, it's really quite insulting. Maybe this could/should be corrected with the ANZAC replacements.
While not quite named after Auckland, Te Kaha's ceremonial 'home' port is Auckland.
 

StingrayOZ

Super Moderator
Staff member
I prefer naming ships after cities and towns, similar to Australia. You don't get the same political support as much with rivers, lakes, mountains, bays, capes, points, etc...

States, regions, or counties have a similar affect, but in my opinion not as effective as cities and towns... I agree, one would think New Zealand would have named a ship Auckland before...
Cities with the biggest capital ship named after the nation (but only in War time?). Everyone seems pretty happy with that. Any major city (or particularly historic) should have a major surface vessel named after it. We also have some minor (landing craft) named after battles or other places too.

However some of the UK ship names and classes are just classics, HMS Vengance, Terrible etc.
 

Lucasnz

Super Moderator
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
I've just been down to see HMNZS Hawea, opened to the public. I'd just like to say I've GOT TO GET ONE. Most impressed, especially with bridge operations being electronic (I'm still having trouble with the lack of a wheel at the helm) and the remote machinery control. Needless to say as a Leander person, it was like steping onto the bridge of the Star Ship Enterprise, even after being on some of my old mans more recent ships.

A gun on the foscle would be nice - I didn't see any mounting for a 50cal forward of the bridge.
 

Norm

Member
I've just been down to see HMNZS Hawea, opened to the public. I'd just like to say I've GOT TO GET ONE. Most impressed, especially with bridge operations being electronic (I'm still having trouble with the lack of a wheel at the helm) and the remote machinery control. Needless to say as a Leander person, it was like steping onto the bridge of the Star Ship Enterprise, even after being on some of my old mans more recent ships.

A gun on the foscle would be nice - I didn't see any mounting for a 50cal forward of the bridge.

Lucasnz, if you don't already have a copy, the July/August 2009 issue 70 of the Professional Skipper has an excellent article on the new IPC's by Keith Ingram who was invited aboard HMNZS Hawea for its delivery voyage. The web site which will change shortly has a picture of HMNZS Rotoiti on the cover, no free content on the site , useful if you want to buy back copies.

Professional Skipper Magazines - for boats boating maritime transport marine. NZ - New Zealand

Interesting contrast to our IPV's is the Korean Coast Guard's 55m 300 tonne "IPV" , the Korean Coast Guard a big fans of NZ's Hamilton Jet engines. Could'nt find a lot of Info on the web about the boat outside of the Hamilton Jet web site ,also off thread but its NZ technology" at its best!. Web site www.hamiltonjet.co.nz go to news

http://www.hamiltonjet.co.nz/news

Cheers
 
Last edited:

dave_kiwi

New Member
Verified Defense Pro
The web site which will change shortly has a picture of HMNZS Rotoiti on the cover, no free content on the site , useful if you want to buy back copies.

Professional Skipper Magazines - for boats boating maritime transport marine. NZ - New Zealand
Actually there is free content, click on the cover, and there is a list of selected articles. I have just read the IPV one -- and explains very nicely about the forecastle (?) 50 cal -- seems the wing 50 cals have a nice arc of coverage :).

Seems that every article I read about these craft is impressed with them. Pity am up here in Singapore - would be nice to get a good look.
 

Gibbo

Well-Known Member
Actually there is free content, click on the cover, and there is a list of selected articles. I have just read the IPV one -- and explains very nicely about the forecastle (?) 50 cal -- seems the wing 50 cals have a nice arc of coverage :).

Seems that every article I read about these craft is impressed with them. Pity am up here in Singapore - would be nice to get a good look.
Thanks for posting that - good spotting! Very interesting article! I visted Devonport with the kids sea-cubs group recently & while 2.5 hours on Te Mana was great - I was desperate to run across & look at the IPV's as all 4 were sitting there. Thought I better not run amok on base though! :rolleyes:

Man you should have seen the kids eyes light-up when they let them handle the small-arms!!! :shudder:shudder:shudder (9m pistol; Steyr; C9; remington pump action shotty; batons; metal-dectors; flare-guns - unfortunately the .5 HMG was just TOO heavy for the kids!!! :eek:nfloorl:) Mind you we Dads were damned keen to have a hold too!!!

Anyway back to the IPV's - they are damned fine looking vessels! I know we all (including me) bleat about them being 'sheep in wolf's clothing' but they were built for a specific purpose & they'll prove very good in that role too!

I wondered about the for'ard gun stand not being in place (doesn't seem as if Canterbury has it's 2 x bridge-top HMG stands installed either) :confused: However I can see now that the side .5 cal's will do the job anyway - but yes I still say a .5 cal or 25mm RWS is needed (call me old fashioned).
 

KiwiRob

Well-Known Member
What peeked my interest in the skipper article was the paragraph about painting them up as Coastguard vessels, this in my opinion would have been a good idea, same as the OPV's, these are not war fighting ships, they are patrol ships, both classes shouldn't be in navy grey. From the sounds of it they will be good vessels and a major asset to NZ.
 

KiwiRob

Well-Known Member
Whilst not quite a naval matter the new Auckland Police boat Deodar III is a very impressive craft, I see Wellington will also be getting one of the same class. I have read that up to five of these boats will be built, so apart from Auckland and Wellington where would the other 3 go?
 

Gibbo

Well-Known Member
What peeked my interest in the skipper article was the paragraph about painting them up as Coastguard vessels, this in my opinion would have been a good idea, same as the OPV's, these are not war fighting ships, they are patrol ships, both classes shouldn't be in navy grey. From the sounds of it they will be good vessels and a major asset to NZ.
I know some say paint them other than grey but often those comments seem to be quoted by someone who has a chip on their shoulder about these vessels. Now I'm in no way suggesting you do but the article quoted an 'old salt' who obviously felt that way! Not that I completely disagree with some of that sentiment I guess!

Navies around the world use all nature of vessels for various non-combative roles & no-one has a problem with them being grey. Take the RN River class - they're only slightly better armed (although better spec'd) than our OPV's, and our OPV's (will) have more flexibility than the Rivers with the ability to fully deploy a chopper - but we don't see calls to paint the Rivers anythng other than Grey (or do we?)

Navy owned & operated = the right to wear grey in my book.

Painted grey they are immediately recognisable by everyone as a naval vessel - the grey carries an immediate air of authority, regardless of what firepower there is behind it. Foreign commercial / civvy vessel crews will be in no doubt that the IPV's represent the NZ Govt and will be prepared to employ a degree of force if required. :nutkick

If the IPV's were any other colour then it could be argued there is likely to be an element of 'what authority does this vessel represent & what power do they have?' - especially by foreign crews who won't be as familiar with our vessels. Unlike a number of other places foreign crews sail, our coastguard is a voluntary SAR organisation only. Imagine a foerign vessel crew doing a runner & trying the excuse - 'well it didn't look like a Naval vessel your honour'.:unknown

Grey removes the doubt (unless you want to see the word 'NAVY' in large letters on the side (yuck!) :eek:nfloorl:

Also remember that the IPV's could fill a limited military role - the key one I see would be to provide protection for Naval vessels moored in our harbours - not only providing their own presence but acting as mother-ship for RHIB teams as they remain close in around the moored vessels to prevent swimmers, small craft etc. They would be excellent for such a role - which is effectively an extension of the patrol role. I wonder if being grey could possibly be helpful in this sort of role? :unknown

Manawanui, Reslution, even Kahu are all grey - and they are less armed! Reckon the should stay grey too!
 
Last edited:

Gibbo

Well-Known Member
Whilst not quite a naval matter the new Auckland Police boat Deodar III is a very impressive craft, I see Wellington will also be getting one of the same class. I have read that up to five of these boats will be built, so apart from Auckland and Wellington where would the other 3 go?
Not sure about the 3 extras but here's the website of the yard that built the Deodar & is to build the new Wellington craft.

Q-West - Home

There's quite a lot of info on the Police boats - follow the 'recently completed' ; 'new build' & 'news' tags.
 

MrConservative

Super Moderator
Staff member
Not sure about the 3 extras but here's the website of the yard that built the Deodar & is to build the new Wellington craft.

Q-West - Home

There's quite a lot of info on the Police boats - follow the 'recently completed' ; 'new build' & 'news' tags.
I understood that 2 other Q-West Patrol Vessels were go to Customs. Possibly it is now three for Customs or that MFish want one also. I remember reading somewhere that each vessel will cost around $2 million.
 

KiwiRob

Well-Known Member
Thinking about it Auckland is probably a big enough to require 2 Police boats. So possibly a second hull for Auckland and a couple for Customs.
 

Gibbo

Well-Known Member
Thinking about it Auckland is probably a big enough to require 2 Police boats. So possibly a second hull for Auckland and a couple for Customs.
This article (Professional Skipper March/April 2008) might be what you saw...

"...the Deodar III is intended to be the first of a
series of coastal patrol class vessels to be built for multi-agency
use, including Customs, Fisheries and other marine police units.
The intention is that when New Zealand Customs and Police
eventually replace their other craft, the new vessels will be
identical. “This will enable crews to mix and match from boat to
boat and role to role, without reorientation or training."

http://www.skipper.co.nz/ISSUES/S62 Police Boat p12-13.pdf

That was written pre-Govt change & pre-recession. With Police budget apparently being cut it may no longer be the case!?!
 

Sea Toby

New Member
Possibly a minor warship design suitable for New Zealand. Could this be the end of New Zealand frigages? The Irish were taken aback with the number of different ships for their OPV/EPV program. One of the offers included this which BMT is also working on for the Royal Navy minor ship program. An modular OPV useful for hydrographic, oceanographic, mine countermeasures, and close in missile defense. The Venator could replace all of the New Zealand navy minor warships minus the replenishment oiler and the sealift ship:

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_m81ede8b9g]YouTube - Ship fires missile[/ame]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i14CeDEq-e8&feature=related]YouTube - BMT Venator ® MCM Configuration[/ame]
 

Todjaeger

Potstirrer
As mentioned elsewhere, the HMNZS Endeavour is due for replacement some time in the 2011-2013 timeframe. While mention has been made in some quarters for some form of JSS that can do sealift to a degree, in addition to replenishment, there has not seemed to be an RFP or RFT. With that having not occurred, and given the time it can take to chose a design, have construction commence and then do a workup for commissioning, I have my doubts as to whether or not Endeavour could be replaced with the desired sort of ship.

It occurred to me that it might be sensible for the RNZN to do something similar to what the RAN did when replacing HMAS Westralia. The RAN had purchased a Korean-built commercial tanker and then leased it for a few years until it was time to begin decommissioning the Westralia. The lease was then ended and the MV Delos underwent refit and was recommissioned as the HMAS Sirius (with a really ugly addition to her stern BTW:mad:). IIRC The HMAS Sirius is also intended to be replaced in the roughly 2020 timeframe with a purpose built naval oiler/replenishment vessel, after HMAS Success is replaced between 2015-2017. It might be sensible for the RNZN to join with the RAN in ordering whatever sort of vessel will be replacing either HMAS Success or HMAS Sirius. This seems particularly sensible if some form of joint unit is created which would be supported by both the ADF and NZDF.

Given that the RNZN appears to have too small a window to order a dedicated vessel before Endeavour needs replacing and she might not be able to continue in service long enough for the replacement of HMAS Success and HMAS Sirius other options would seem appropriate. What the RNZN might be able to do is purchase a new (or used) double-hulled tanker and have it fitted out to temporarily provide the needed fleet oiler. Then once the desired replenishment vessel is entering service, offer the temporary oiler for sale or lease.

Conducting the Endeavour replacement in this fashion might not be the least expensive option, but IMO would give the RNZN the best chance of getting the type of vessel it wants and needs without suffering a capability shortfall while the replacement is acquired.

-Cheers
 
Top