Russian Navy Discussions and Updates

[Sandhi Yudha]

JSC Admiralty Shipyards has begun cutting steel for the 3rd and 4th Project 677 Lada Class submarines simultaneously.

The second Project 677 submarine, Kronstadt, was launched in September 2018. The shipyard is currently preparing the submarine for the second stage of factory sea trials.

Russian Shipyard Cuts Steel for 3rd and 4th Lada-class Submarines - Naval News

The first steel for the third and the fourth Lada-class (Project 677) submarines has been cut at Russia's Admiralty Shipyard.

www.navalnews.com

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

Quite optimistic, but according to the Sevmash CEO, the Project 1144 Admiral Nakhimov is planned to be delivered to the Russian Navy in 2022. It will get the projectname 11442M.

Admiral Nakhimov has been under repairs at the Sevmash Shipyard since 1999. Real work on the ship has been carried out since 2013.

Russia's Sevmash Shipyard Says it Will Deliver Admiral Nakhimov in 2022 - Naval News

Sevmash Shipyard is planning to complete the delivery of the Kirov-class cruiser Admiral Nakhimov to the Russian Northern Fleet in 2022.

www.navalnews.com

Shipbuilders to deliver most powerful surface ship to Russian Navy after upgrade

The Shipyard’s specialists will load onto the cruiser and install over 5,000 items of equipment and more than a million of various items

tass.com

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

In October 2021, a defense industry source told TASS on the sidelines of the 9th Sevastopol International Maritime Business Forum (SIMBF) that advanced project 23900 versatile amphibious assault ship the Mitrofan Moskalenko will become the flagship of the Black Sea Fleet after its construction is completed at the Zaliv Shipyard in Crimea’s Kerch.

But now TASS reports that the Admiral Makarov frigate of project 11356 will likely become the flagship of the Black Sea fleet after the Moskva cruiser caught fire and sank.

Admiral Makarov to assume the new flagship of Russian Black Sea fleet - Naval News


The Project 885M (Yasen-M) multi-purpose nuclear-powered submarine Kazan carrying cruise missiles practiced dives to maximum depths during drills in the Barents Sea. The Northern Fleet’s press office reported this on Thursday, but it is unclear when this exercise was hold.

Russian Navy’s cutting-edge sub dives to maximum depth in Arctic drills - Military & Defense - TASS


And here a recent photo of the Admiral Kuznetsov.

Dambiev

Хорошие новости. Сейчас, в эти минуты, проходит докование тяжелого авианесущего крейсера «Адмирал флота Советского Союза Кузнецов» ВМФ России в новый сухой док филиала «35 судоремонтный завод» АО «Центр Судоремонта «Звездочка» в Мурманске. Планируется, что авианосец вернется на большую воду в...

t.me

So the Admiral Kuznetsov is now at the large dock or the 35th Shipyard. Here some interesting pictures of the construction of the large dock.

Russia's Cursed Aircraft Carrier Is Finally In A Drydock That Can't Sink

The carrier Admiral Kuznetsov has been sidelined for more than three years after the floating drydock it was inside accidentally sunk.

www.thedrive.com

 

[hauritz]

So the Admiral Kuznetsov is now at the large dock or the 35th Shipyard. Here some interesting pictures of the construction of the large dock.

Russia's Cursed Aircraft Carrier Is Finally In A Drydock That Can't Sink

The carrier Admiral Kuznetsov has been sidelined for more than three years after the floating drydock it was inside accidentally sunk.

www.thedrive.com

I wonder what value this ship even is to Russia. It seems like a money pit. I am sure the Russian military has other priorities at the moment and into the foreseeable future.

 

[Ananda]

am sure the Russian military has other priorities at the moment and into the foreseeable future.

Personally I'm more interested on see how the progress on this new dry docks. What's the purpose of this new dry docks ? Is it only for maintenance or can be used for new large ship constructions ?

There's much speculations on Pro Russian media and online outlets for Russia taking Nikolayev for "regaining" the yards complex there. However considering the progress of the war, even Russia able to regain wholle Donbas, I do have doubt on their intention after that on Nikolayev.

Yes, the yards complex in Nikolayev is the largest in USSR, as this's where this carrier and it sister build. However those complexs already in long neglected conditions. Better Russia builds large yards on their own. Perhaps this dry docks is the first step on that.

Thus I see this not more than Russia effort to see if they still have capacities to maintain and overhaul complex system like a carrier. After that, perhaps they will see if the facilities can be use for new construction in the more farther time table. By overhauling this carrier, they basically shown any intention for replacement will not come after this decade.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

Zaliv shipyard at Kerch, which is also building the new Project 23900 amphibious assault ships, seems to have a dock of 360×60 meters. But probably this is not wide enough for the Admiral Kuznetsov with a total width of 72 meter.

I wonder what value this ship even is to Russia. It seems like a money pit. I am sure the Russian military has other priorities at the moment and into the foreseeable future.

Hopefully they are doing a heavy overhaul, including new cables, tubing, sanitary system, airconditioning, sensor and weapon systems, electric generation system and a whole new propulsion system. And not just small repairs and a paintjob.

 

[ngatimozart]

Zaliv shipyard at Kerch, which is also building the new Project 23900 amphibious assault ships, seems to have a dock of 360×60 meters. But probably this is not wide enough for the Admiral Kuznetsov with a total width of 72 meter.


Hopefully they are doing a heavy overhaul, including new cables, tubing, sanitary system, airconditioning, sensor and weapon systems, electric generation system and a whole new propulsion system. And not just small repairs and a paintjob.

They'd probably be better off building a new ship. Probably be cheaper. It'll be the rust holding the hull and paintwork together.

 

[Ananda]

Hopefully they are doing a heavy overhaul, including new cables, tubing, sanitary system, airconditioning, sensor and weapon systems, electric generation system and a whole new propulsion system. And not just small repairs and a paintjob.

If they are doing that, practically will be similar with what Chinese done when they are finishing Liaoning. Which's practically a complete rebuild, from that unfinished carrier they got from Ukraine.

They should done that, but honestly I don't think Russia have the money to do that. If they manage to do half the Job that China done when rebuilding Liaoning, perhaps it will be enough to keep this carrier on operational level for another decade.

Keeping this carrier operational already acknowledgement from Russia that they don't have resources to begin work on new carrier program in this decade. So I suspect they need this carrier to work at least until later half of next decade, before they can begin work on the replacement.

Perhaps they should hold their pride and begin work with China to study design based on PLAN Type 003 carrier.

 

[John Fedup]

A US China confrontation involving carriers may very well define the future of this class of ships. Russia should wait before committing scarce resources into a class that may be to vulnerable in a high intensity missile exchange. For Russia, continuing SSN and SSBN construction seems to be a better use of funds. They work better than their carriers and don’t leave smoke trails.

 

[STURM]

A US China confrontation involving carriers may very well define the future of this class of ships.

I doubt any war between both countries would see a carrier engagement. The PLAN [on paper] has other means of neutralising the USN carrier threat and it would not want to play to the USN's strengths by deploying a carrier against it.

 

[John Fedup]

I doubt any war between both countries would see a carrier engagement. The PLAN [on paper] has other means of neutralising the USN carrier threat and it would not want to play to the USN's strengths by deploying a carrier against it.

Sorry, I wasn't clear. It would likely not be China deploying a carrier, it would be the USN. If the Chinese can neutralize a CBG from getting within striking distance by the threat of long range missile attack or actually hit a carrier then their value is diminished given the huge capital outlay for these vessels. Granted there are real questions about how effective Chinese long range missiles are and the effectiveness of current USN defensive systems and pending directed energy defences. The MQ-25 refuelling drone will allow greater fleet separation from Chinese missiles. Time will tell I guess.

 

[Feanor]

They'd probably be better off building a new ship. Probably be cheaper. It'll be the rust holding the hull and paintwork together.

Russia literally can't. The decision to keep the Kuznetsov is driven as much by the desire to sit on the fence without committing to a carrier program and not closing the door either as by actual good planning and cost considerations. In my opinion it should be turned into a training ship if Russia intends to maintain carrier capability and scrapped immediately if not.

 

[ngatimozart]

Russia literally can't. The decision to keep the Kuznetsov is driven as much by the desire to sit on the fence without committing to a carrier program and not closing the door either as by actual good planning and cost considerations. In my opinion it should be turned into a training ship if Russia intends to maintain carrier capability and scrapped immediately if not.

I can see the strategic reasoning for the VMF having a CV or CVN component. It actually makes sound sense from a naval POV to a western, PLAN, Japanese, or Indian naval aficionado. However I sometimes get the hint that the VMF is still perceived by the Russian political class and senior military, as a brown and green water at best navy, rather than a proper blue water navy despite its submarine fleet. That I think is a mistake if its true.

 

[STURM]

I guess it all depends on what the political leadership see its navy doing. During the Cold War the navy was intended to project power; safeguard Soviet interests worldwide; prevent NATO forces from operating in or near Soviet waters, etc. At present the roles have changed a bit.

With regards to carriers; if the Russians have no long term intentions of expanding their carrier capability; I see no reason why they should keep the Kuznetsov. She's a major drain on resources.

 

[Feanor]

I guess it all depends on what the political leadership see its navy doing. During the Cold War the navy was intended to project power; safeguard Soviet interests worldwide; prevent NATO forces from operating in or near Soviet waters, etc. At present the roles have changed a bit.

With regards to carriers; if the Russians have no long term intentions of expanding their carrier capability; I see no reason why they should keep the Kuznetsov. She's a major drain on resources.

Because admitting that they're giving up on carrier ambitions will be a certain kind of step and send a certain kind of message. But committing to a carrier program is insanely expensive and requires a commensurate investment into infrastructure and industrial capacity. And it's not even clear that Russia would have use for said industrial capacity outside of a carrier program. As is the largest ships Russia has built are the 22350 frigates and the 11711 landing ships. Meanwhile resources were expended on a fleet of 30 small missile ships (some still being built now), 6 22160 patrol boats with an unclear purpose, and a major expansion of GUGI of questionable value (it's not that GUGI doesn't bring value to the table but the proportions are questionable, and the new Status-6 is even more so). Russian naval planning is a mess. There was an original plan, very pretty and neat, that went roughly like this; corvette (20380) frigate (22350) destroyed (OKR Lider) carrier (TBD). The whole thing was then modified by a bunch of sideways requirements including the harebrained idea of destroyers being used for BMD (aped from USN) which contributed to OKR Lider turning into a defacto cruiser program, LHDs being added (in principle not the worst idea, especially when it was a proven design purchased abroad, but much more problematic when it's a domestic program that involves designing your own Mistral with sluts and blackjack), a cruise missile requirement pushed by political leadership leading to an over-investment into Kalibr-capable small missile ships, and a corvette variant that's heavier than even the slow 20380s, modular design experiments that have seen buckets of cash poured down the 20386 money pit, and the list goes on and on. Despite all the issues the original plan is still the most logical one. The 22350 spent a lot of time in development and first ship construction, as a result technology moved ahead and a requirement for an updated 22350 was developed but as always with project creep what was supposed to be a frigate turned into a destroyer (22350M). So now the lineup looks like this; corvette (20380) frigate (22350) destroyed (22350M) cruiser (OKR Lider) BDK (11711) LHD (23900) carrier (TBD?). It's not the worst idea, provided they can safely bury the 20386, and cut the ASAT/BMD requirements from OKR Lider, to leave a nuclear-powered cruise missile/SAM arsenal boat with plenty of helos/UAVs and command facilities as a stretch goal.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

In October 2021, a defense industry source told TASS on the sidelines of the 9th Sevastopol International Maritime Business Forum (SIMBF) that advanced project 23900 versatile amphibious assault ship the Mitrofan Moskalenko will become the flagship of the Black Sea Fleet after its construction is completed at the Zaliv Shipyard in Crimea’s Kerch.

But now TASS reports that the Admiral Makarov frigate of project 11356 will likely become the flagship of the Black Sea fleet after the Moskva cruiser caught fire and sank.

Admiral Makarov to assume the new flagship of Russian Black Sea fleet - Naval News


The Project 885M (Yasen-M) multi-purpose nuclear-powered submarine Kazan carrying cruise missiles practiced dives to maximum depths during drills in the Barents Sea. The Northern Fleet’s press office reported this on Thursday, but it is unclear when this exercise was hold.

Russian Navy’s cutting-edge sub dives to maximum depth in Arctic drills - Military & Defense - TASS


And here a recent photo of the Admiral Kuznetsov.

Dambiev

Хорошие новости. Сейчас, в эти минуты, проходит докование тяжелого авианесущего крейсера «Адмирал флота Советского Союза Кузнецов» ВМФ России в новый сухой док филиала «35 судоремонтный завод» АО «Центр Судоремонта «Звездочка» в Мурманске. Планируется, что авианосец вернется на большую воду в...

t.me

So the Admiral Kuznetsov is now at the large dock or the 35th Shipyard. Here some interesting pictures of the construction of the large dock.

Russia's Cursed Aircraft Carrier Is Finally In A Drydock That Can't Sink

The carrier Admiral Kuznetsov has been sidelined for more than three years after the floating drydock it was inside accidentally sunk.

www.thedrive.com

The Admiral Kuznetsov aircraft carrier of project 1143.5 will rejoin the Russian Navy after an overhaul and upgrade no earlier than 2024. According to TASS the overhaul was delayed for several months because of exposed new defects.

Admiral Kuznetsov won't return to service before 2024 - Naval News

The Russian Navy's aircraft carrier Admiral Kuznetsov, which is under maintenance since 2017, is not expected to enter service before 2024.

www.navalnews.com

 

[Feanor]

A whole bunch of new vessels have been laid down recently. Laid down were;

Two more 677 subs, the Vologda and Yaroslavl' (4-5th of the type out of 6th contracted),
A new 20385 corvette laid down in the Amur Yard, the Razumniy, part of a new run of 6 such ships at Amur,
Another 12700 trawler, 10th of the type. Note that the series was supposed to get an upgrade in size and mine trawling unmanned systems after the 9th ship, meaning this may really be a a new trawler under the old project name.
Two new "scientific" ships, really reconnassance ships of a new 03182r project, they apparently share a hull with the 03182 small tanker ship.

Заложены подводные лодки «Вологда» и «Ярославль» проекта 677

В День России 12 июня 2022 года в Санкт-Петербурге на АО Адмиралтейские верфи (входит в АО Объединенная судостроительная корпорация - ОСК) состоялась торжественная церемония закладки для Военно-морского флота Российской Федерации двух больших дизель-электрических…

bmpd.livejournal.com

На Амурском судостроительном заводе заложен корвет «Разумный» проекта 20385

В День России 12 июня 2022 года на АО Амурский судостроительный завод (АСЗ, входит в состав АО Объединенная судостроительная корпорация - ОСК) в Комсомольске-на-Амуре состоялась церемония закладки для ВМФ России корвета Разумный (заводской номер 2108)…

bmpd.livejournal.com

Заложен тральщик «Полярный» проекта 12700

В День России 12 июня 2022 года на АО Средне-Невский судостроительный завод (СНСЗ, входит в АО Объединенная судостроительная корпорация - ОСК) в Санкт-Петербурге состоялась церемония закладки для Военно-морского флота Российской Федерации корабля противоминной обороны…

bmpd.livejournal.com

Заложены средние разведывательные корабли «Леонид Бекренев» и «Борис Бобков» нового проекта 03182р

В День России 12 июня 2022 года в Зеленодольске на АО Зеленодольский завод имени А.М. Горького, входящем в состав АО Судостроительная Корпорация Ак Барс (группа компаний АО Холдинговая компания Ак Барс) состоялась церемония закладки для…

bmpd.livejournal.com

 

[StobieWan]

Zaliv shipyard at Kerch, which is also building the new Project 23900 amphibious assault ships, seems to have a dock of 360×60 meters. But probably this is not wide enough for the Admiral Kuznetsov with a total width of 72 meter.


Hopefully they are doing a heavy overhaul, including new cables, tubing, sanitary system, airconditioning, sensor and weapon systems, electric generation system and a whole new propulsion system. And not just small repairs and a paintjob.

Well, she'd have been a total constructive loss after the fire, the dock sinking and a crane landing on her - so, logically, her overhaul would have to touch on most of the ship.

Will it be worth it ? No - they should have replaced her with a GT powered class decades ago.

 

[swerve]

Zaliv shipyard at Kerch, which is also building the new Project 23900 amphibious assault ships, seems to have a dock of 360×60 meters. But probably this is not wide enough for the Admiral Kuznetsov with a total width of 72 meter.

Aircraft carriers tend to have a significant deck overhang, so can potentially get into docks narrower than the deck. There are pictures of USN carriers with their decks overhanging dock sides.

 

[Sandhi Yudha]

According to this article, the Russian Navy initially planned to order 6 additional ships on top of the first 6 ordered ships, but because the navy isn't satisfied about the characteristics and performance of this class, these plans are abandoned. Flaws include insufficient seaworthiness, insufficient armour, and a lack of adequate air defence systems.

Rusland is niet tevreden over patrouilleschepen

Bykovklasse is te zwak, zo blijkt nu

marineschepen.nl

Maybe the Project 22160 patrolboats are capable OPVs for peacetime patrols and anti-piracy operations, but after the war with Ukraine, the navy found out that they have to focus on the construction of warships for more serious tasks.



The satellite photo below seems to be from sea trials of the two largest submarines on this planet, taken on 25 June. It is understandable that the new Project 09852 needs a lot of trials, but i don't know why the Project 941 also participates in the sea trial.

Source:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1540945575205543936