They are cutting it very fine. It wont be until mid 2025 that all five are delivered and how long will FOC be in play after that. Honestly four years the way the world is going pear shaped it is increasingly looking like a game of blackjack.
At least the review did force the government to not back track on the prior decisions and lock in the P-8 and C-130J-30.
Maybe it's a good time to look at four of those Pommy C-130J up for grabs.
I know the pommy J's may be old & worn and there's all the arguments about systems integration & combability etc etc and all the reasons that makes them too risky on paper, but yes aren't we now getting to a point that we're so desperate that maybe we should take them up? You and I know that won't be given a 2nd thought tho!
Anybody up for a persistent emailing campaign?I know the pommy J's may be old & worn and there's all the arguments about systems integration & combability etc etc and all the reasons that makes them too risky on paper, but yes aren't we now getting to a point that we're so desperate that maybe we should take them up? You and I know that won't be given a 2nd thought tho!
The way NZDF platforms get replaced these days it seems they welcome the wind-down of one before the replacement gets delivered (let alone FOC) as it saves money & probably helps cope with skills shortages... all related to our poor level of defence spending. We're saw this with RNZN's Tanker, and now with C130H & P3-K2 replacements... mind you I was astounded when the RAF lost the Nimrods and with it effectively all meaningful MPA capability for an entire decade!
I'm sure this lull between retirement & replacement of platforms is a conscious thing the NZDF likely does to give temporary relief to budget pressures. You can guarantee Govt will be telling NZD they're damned lucky to be getting new gear at all so they'll need to just suck it up! If Govt weasel out of the EMAC project then we'll have a real problem on our hands...the EMAC project actually does have good potential to please the Aussies.
One thing the Aussie sub deal & all the chatter has done is not only start to show the public our defence shortcomings, but it's compounding pressure on the political parties to deal with the rising threats in our region... we all know we won't be hearing half the back-room chatter! I still wouldn't expect the Govt to do a turnaround, but it will likely mean Govt now start to realise they need to be cautious just what & how much they kick the can down the road and what doing so would men for implications to our foreign policy settings.
Jeesuuus we now have 2-3 operational transport aircraft (both C130H & B757) most of the time... we can barely do HADR! How the farken heck can anyone put their hand on their heart in NZ, look you in the eye, and say 'we pull our weight...we punch above our weight'
Just remember = The MOD office orobablry has a "For Lease" or "Do not disturb" sign on the door. Maybe if you address your emails to Lost MOD c/. Ministry for Health you might have some success. cheers
I'm wonder if we should set up a give a little page and fund for the poor RNZAF the politicians sure don't seem to give a crap in the short term. A strong defence force is like insurance you hate paying the bill but boy when your house burns down you thank your maker that you have it . As a kiwi im ashamed at the continued decline ,I sure do hope that the average kiwi will wake up to where we as a country are heading, we are being led by very poor politicians from both sides of the house. My father who gave six years of his life in the service of this country during WW2 would be turning in has grave......I know the pommy J's may be old & worn and there's all the arguments about systems integration & combability etc etc and all the reasons that makes them too risky on paper, but yes aren't we now getting to a point that we're so desperate that maybe we should take them up? You and I know that won't be given a 2nd thought tho!
The way NZDF platforms get replaced these days it seems they welcome the wind-down of one before the replacement gets delivered (let alone FOC) as it saves money & probably helps cope with skills shortages... all related to our poor level of defence spending. We're saw this with RNZN's Tanker, and now with C130H & P3-K2 replacements... mind you I was astounded when the RAF lost the Nimrods and with it effectively all meaningful MPA capability for an entire decade!
I'm sure this lull between retirement & replacement of platforms is a conscious thing the NZDF likely does to give temporary relief to budget pressures. You can guarantee Govt will be telling NZD they're damned lucky to be getting new gear at all so they'll need to just suck it up! If Govt weasel out of the EMAC project then we'll have a real problem on our hands...the EMAC project actually does have good potential to please the Aussies.
One thing the Aussie sub deal & all the chatter has done is not only start to show the public our defence shortcomings, but it's compounding pressure on the political parties to deal with the rising threats in our region... we all know we won't be hearing half the back-room chatter! I still wouldn't expect the Govt to do a turnaround, but it will likely mean Govt now start to realise they need to be cautious just what & how much they kick the can down the road and what doing so would men for implications to our foreign policy settings.
Jeesuuus we now have 2-3 operational transport aircraft (both C130H & B757) most of the time... we can barely do HADR! How the farken heck can anyone put their hand on their heart in NZ, look you in the eye, and say 'we pull our weight...we punch above our weight'
We have not come close to pulling or weight for the last 20-30 years, but it is a good political statement that the pollies love to drag out to fool the uneducated (defence wise) public to cover there tracks. In other words just another piece of political BS.Jeesuuus we now have 2-3 operational transport aircraft (both C130H & B757) most of the time... we can barely do HADR! How the farken heck can anyone put their hand on their heart in NZ, look you in the eye, and say 'we pull our weight...we punch above our weight'
It is sad to see indeed, across the whole of the NZDF.
Don't know about now...
Well there you have it from the horse's mouth as the saying goes... still seems a bit early ... but
Hmmm, what just like the RAF did 10 years ago you mean?
I think the RAF at the time had better grammer...
I know I sound like a broken record but the EMAC project is about that & Ron Mark & DCP stated 4 P8 wouldn't be enough. Think the question might be more...will Govt realise they need to deliver in full on the EMAC project?
You might not have noticed but Ron Mark isn't in Parliament anymore and to date there doesn't appear to be any movement on the EMAC project. It really wouldn't surprise me if 4 P8's is it. The DCP also signalled more A109's were required, they're cheap, they still haven't been ordered.
Rob. Please refrain from making snide and patronising comments to other posters. It adds zero value to the thread. We just don't need anymore of it. There was no connection between what Gibbo said in reference to Ron Marks views as a MP and Defence Minister last term and the current DCP with him no longer being in parliament now. It completely undermines the relevant follow up comments you made.