Probably the SpecOPs version with FLIR and a refueling probe.
Osama Bin Laden dead
- Thread starter t68
- Start date
I think this was not a purely US ops. I think some Pakistani intel or informer were involved including some back up units, and its not solely a Seal Team Six ops, its a unified command type ops. The operational protocols and planning and units involved are all secret or highly confidential for future reference and operations. Thats just my experience and opinion.
Twinblade
Member
Not sure about Pakistan but here in India, if you rent out your premises to someone or employ some house helps, you have to inform the police with their details (photographs, copies of ID's). I have to admit it is not done everywhere, but around sensitive locations a database is always maintained . It may not be very thorough but a database exists. Of course nothing is fool proof, but they have managed to nab terrorists from around IMA a couple of times, so i guess it works.
Btw just saw an interview of OBL's neighbours kid, he said if their cricket ball landed in his courtyard, they were not allowed to take the ball, but were payed money instead if they started whining. By this criteria, half my neighborhood could be full of non paying OBL's
: He also said OBL made up for it by gifting him a couple of bunnies :goodbad
StevoJH
The Bunker Group
OBL was playing cricket and the ball went into the neighbours property? Or the neighbours were playing cricket and the ball went into OBL's property?Btw just saw an interview of OBL's neighbours kid, he said if their cricket ball landed in his courtyard, they were not allowed to take the ball, but were payed money instead if they started whining. By this criteria, half my neighborhood could be full of non paying OBL's
If it was the second, they werent allowed to reclaim their ball but instead were given money to stop whining about it? And OBL gave them bunnies to make up for stealing their cricket balls?
LOL
Oh, in addition the house wasnt in OBL's name, on paper it belonged to someone else who also lived there. One of the things that stood out about the place was that they could not find how the owners got the money to pay for it.
StevoJH
The Bunker Group
Care to add any references for that? Preferrably references released within the last 24 hours since apparrently the Pakistan Armed forces have now reversed their statements regarding joint-op.
Technically it not possible for US forces to get success without help of PA/ISI . Defence experts can give better judgement , media and politicians are just guessing like us
t68
Well-Known Member
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #108
Listening to talkback radio 2GB in Sydney on the Ben Fordham show, where he interviewed an ex Commander of Seal team 6 his name was Chuck Pharrer?
This is his own opinion and not the US government line. He believes that ISI was complicit in harbouring OBL as OBL was as the golden goose for Pakistan, with the amount of aid and money pouring into the country they ISI/government did not want the money tree to end.
Radio interview below
2GB Media Player - What does it take to bring down the world's most wanted man?
This is his own opinion and not the US government line. He believes that ISI was complicit in harbouring OBL as OBL was as the golden goose for Pakistan, with the amount of aid and money pouring into the country they ISI/government did not want the money tree to end.
Radio interview below
2GB Media Player - What does it take to bring down the world's most wanted man?
Well, just how much AID/Money POURED in? F-16s? Helicopters? Intelligence/tech gear? Drones?
There are a lot of questions and with time maybe we will see some answers. Both US and Pakistan have changed the story at least once or twice in past 24-48 hours so dust is still settling.
There are a lot of questions and with time maybe we will see some answers. Both US and Pakistan have changed the story at least once or twice in past 24-48 hours so dust is still settling.
The CIA Director has confirmed that Pakistan was not informed due to fears that the info would be passed on.
CIA feared Pakistan would alert Bin Laden - Central & South Asia - Al Jazeera English
CIA feared Pakistan would alert Bin Laden - Central & South Asia - Al Jazeera English
furymonkey
New Member
Even you pointed out nothing is fool proof. As someone mentioned, no way that OBL is stupid enough to use his own name and photo to buy a house. I think it's safe to say that a most wanted mastermind being so evasive for so many years is on a different level than an average terrorist cells that got busted.
I think people underestimate the difficulty for gather good intelligence. As I pointed out, the house was under surveillance for so many month by the US. They know there could be a high value target, and it could be OBL, yet still weren't sure until the seals went in.
The amount of resources that was put into this surveillance are enormous compare to an house owner check up, probably where a guy sitting in an office looking through the registered owner profile for an hour. Unless you started off with a very suspicious viewing lens, things might just appeared very neutral even for an inspector. The reason this house was even in the spotlight from the US, was because their suspect had interaction with the house, nothing to do with the house itself.
I simply think no intelligent organizations would go as far as putting a team doing a 24/7 surveillance on a suspicious houses within area of importance for months, without having outside knowledge leading to the conclusion that particular house is dodgy. It's just not realistic and a waste of resources.
So I still personally think that, being a mile away from a military academy would not give ISI the knowledge that OBL is living there, if we assuming that this is the case, which they publicly denied.
furymonkey
New Member
Very interesting article. It pointed out that ISI has been sharing information about the compound with the US for awhile. This draws out few possibilities that I can think of.
1) ISI truly has no idea OBL is in the compound.
2) ISI knows, but shares false information.
For me, 2nd option doesn't make much sense. Because doing so is technically harbouring him, and if that is the intention, they'd know US already has the eye on the compound, it would make sense to relocate him right? Unless is this 3rd option.
3) ISI knows, but shares false information to maintain leverage, however they have no connection with OBL.
Any other option is welcome, I want to hear your thoughts.
Some other very interesting articles by one my favourite writers. He interviewed OBL twice and after 9/11 was contacted by OBL for another interview.
Robert Fisk: If this is a US victory, does that mean its forces should go home now? - Robert Fisk, Commentators - The Independent
Robert Fisk: Was he betrayed? Of course. Pakistan knew Bin Laden's hiding place all along - Robert Fisk, Commentators - The Independent
Robert Fisk: My deadliest moment with the world's most dangerous men - Robert Fisk, Commentators - The Independent
furymonkey, my guess - based on what I have read in the past about the ISI and Pakistan's conduct in Afghanistan and the ''War On Terror'' - is that certain elements of the army and ISI, knew he was there but certainly not the Prime Minister and his cabinet. Are we expected to believe that OBL fled from Afghanistan, then probably lived for some time in the tribal areas, then ended up in Pakistan, without anyone in the Pakistan army or ISI catching on?? In the past even Bhutto and Nawar Sahriff weren't completely kept in the loop as to what the 'jihadist' elements in the army and ISI were up to in Kashmir and Afghanistan. When Bhutto first became Prime Minister, she was so distrustful of her generals that she had to bring along the U.S. ambassador for her first few meeting with her generals!!
By the same token, I find it extremely hard to believe, especially given Pakistan's history of propping up Afghan fundamentalist groups like the Heezb Islami and later the Taliban, for geo-political reasons, that Pakistan has completely cut it's ties with the Afghan Taliban and AQ, and that it is cooperating fully with Uncle Sam and holding nothing back. One reason mentioned by Ahmad Rashid [author of the Taliban and Descent Into Darkness] on why elements of the army and ISI have not completely severed ties is because they are hedging their bets, in case they are left in the lurch again after Uncle Sam leaves Afghanistan. People tend to forget that from a Pakistani prespective, there are sound reasons why they would want to play both sides of the fence. Don't forget also that a lot of what's happening in Afghanistan is also related to Kashmir, which is an area of much importance to Pakistan.
Robert Fisk: If this is a US victory, does that mean its forces should go home now? - Robert Fisk, Commentators - The Independent
Robert Fisk: Was he betrayed? Of course. Pakistan knew Bin Laden's hiding place all along - Robert Fisk, Commentators - The Independent
Robert Fisk: My deadliest moment with the world's most dangerous men - Robert Fisk, Commentators - The Independent
furymonkey, my guess - based on what I have read in the past about the ISI and Pakistan's conduct in Afghanistan and the ''War On Terror'' - is that certain elements of the army and ISI, knew he was there but certainly not the Prime Minister and his cabinet. Are we expected to believe that OBL fled from Afghanistan, then probably lived for some time in the tribal areas, then ended up in Pakistan, without anyone in the Pakistan army or ISI catching on?? In the past even Bhutto and Nawar Sahriff weren't completely kept in the loop as to what the 'jihadist' elements in the army and ISI were up to in Kashmir and Afghanistan. When Bhutto first became Prime Minister, she was so distrustful of her generals that she had to bring along the U.S. ambassador for her first few meeting with her generals!!
By the same token, I find it extremely hard to believe, especially given Pakistan's history of propping up Afghan fundamentalist groups like the Heezb Islami and later the Taliban, for geo-political reasons, that Pakistan has completely cut it's ties with the Afghan Taliban and AQ, and that it is cooperating fully with Uncle Sam and holding nothing back. One reason mentioned by Ahmad Rashid [author of the Taliban and Descent Into Darkness] on why elements of the army and ISI have not completely severed ties is because they are hedging their bets, in case they are left in the lurch again after Uncle Sam leaves Afghanistan. People tend to forget that from a Pakistani prespective, there are sound reasons why they would want to play both sides of the fence. Don't forget also that a lot of what's happening in Afghanistan is also related to Kashmir, which is an area of much importance to Pakistan.
I live in Islamabad, studied in a university, which is situated in AHQ (Air Head quaters), i was never required to get a clearence to get admission in that university and also till a year back, anyone could come in the university to meet XYZ n then go have a tour of AHQ. Aaybe situation in bangladesh is different but military establishment is huge in Pakistan and its not very easy to check everyone inside their complexes, let alone in the near vicinity.
there has also been incidents of attacks on army residential areas in quetta with mortars fired from the close vicinity with noone getting caught.
You may draw your own conclusions
Why ISI/PA is still silent ?
OBL was most wanted terrorist of world killed near Miltery Academy in three story home?
His body thrown in sea ?
Every one is confused
Military establishments aren't exactly tiny in my country either, the cantonments in Dhaka can probably rival the size of many huge cantonments in Pakistan.
About the part I bolded- Seriously there is that huge lack of security in Pakistani military installations????????
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All the pictures that we've been seeing are unofficial and not real.
The official picture and should it be released, is being debated and not yet made public. So, there is no OFFICIAL picture of dead OBL.
There is another one going around which is scene taken out of Blackhawk down movie.
The official picture and should it be released, is being debated and not yet made public. So, there is no OFFICIAL picture of dead OBL.
There is another one going around which is scene taken out of Blackhawk down movie.
I didnt say anything about official, an US senator has twitted that she has already seen the photo and that OBL has a shot in the face.All the pictures that we've been seeing are unofficial and not real.
The official picture and should it be released, is being debated and not yet made public. So, there is no OFFICIAL picture of dead OBL.
There is another one going around which is scene taken out of Blackhawk down movie.
Then I ve seen the pic and linked it here so all of you can comment , and I wouldnt say that isnt real that fast...