Eurofighter Typhoon Discussion Thread

[stigmata]

It shouldn't be any problem to shoot in the direction provided by IRST and let the missile seeker pick up when close enough, would be up to the pilots judgement if its worth it. Tho the missile would probably need an mid cource update and so possibly give away rough location anyway, tho that holds true if the enemy aircraft has MAWS too.

USA was also doin some reasearch into nuclear powered aircraft, fortunately they both dropped it before something nasty happened.
http://www.aviation-history.com/articles/nuke-american.htm

 

[swerve]

Even the AIM-9A/B could lock on to a target several million kilometers away, if it is bright enough.

About 150 million km lock-on range was demonstrated on several occasions, IIRC.

 

[aayiliam]

please bear with me if this doubt seems silly. but is it not that the JSF and typhoon are in direct contention and since the price of JSF is roughly the same then JSF will come forward and Typhoon will go on backburner.

or are there any plans to make a seperate 5th gen plane along the lines of tornado and typhoon(complete european plane)

 

[Vivendi]

please bear with me if this doubt seems silly. but is it not that the JSF and typhoon are in direct contention and since the price of JSF is roughly the same then JSF will come forward and Typhoon will go on backburner.

To my knowledge F-35 and Typhoon are actually not in competition in any country at the moment: Typhoon was competing against the F-35 in Denmark and Norway but pulled out; Typhoon was in Brazil and F-35 was invited but could not join presumably because of issues with ToT.

Typhoon is competing in India, Switzerland, Romania, and probably some other countries but to my knowledge F-35 is not a contender for any of those. Typhoon is typically competing against Rafale, SuperHornet, Gripen NG, SU-35 and F-16 block 60-70.

Japan has asked for F-22 and will not get it. So we might see a competition between Typhoon and F-35 in Japan. Or maybe they will do something else.

or are there any plans to make a seperate 5th gen plane along the lines of tornado and typhoon(complete european plane)

There are some extremely vague rumors, but nothing more.

What is more likely is development of European UCAVs. Several European countries are looking into that at the moment.

V

 

[METEORSWARM]

RAND Admin: text deleted. Read the forum rules, the official document leaves hung before the first paragraph that you spoke of a passive system where Admin: text deleted. Read the forum rulesis said as the role irst's aAdmin: text deleted. Read the forum rules, both on land and air targets, the Link 16 data communication between fighters where every game discover that they know the others Admin: text deleted. Read the forum rules, the laser is only used to attack ..... but not to detect and depending on the target range, one aircraft 90km to need a bvraam misils with active head x-band radar /IR and do not need laser for look-on target.

misil mach 4+=1400meters +

90km=64 seconds for impact or less

In this sequence launch 1 misile bvraam wait 3 second,launch 2 misile Bvraam,wait 3 seconds,launch 3 misile Bvraam,¡target down!

EADS talk irst 2º generation can detect f-15 to head on subsonic 90km and 160 km to the nozzles of a mig 29.

EADS comercial

http://rapidshare.de/files/40918028/2_Eurofighter_capabi_89302a_1_.pdf.html


Admin: text deleted. Read the forum rules

 

[Grand Danois]

[/quote]

The guy who presented this (it was not his own material, it's APAs) is now out of work.

The soundbite "It's Not Your Fathers Flanker" is so APA.

Analyzing a passive system as if it was an active sensor - also off the mark and reveals the heritage of whoever carried it out.

:D

 

[aayiliam]

To my knowledge F-35 and Typhoon are actually not in competition in any country at the moment: Typhoon was competing against the F-35 in Denmark and Norway but pulled out; Typhoon was in Brazil and F-35 was invited but could not join presumably because of issues with ToT.

Typhoon is competing in India, Switzerland, Romania, and probably some other countries but to my knowledge F-35 is not a contender for any of those. Typhoon is typically competing against Rafale, SuperHornet, Gripen NG, SU-35 and F-16 block 60-70.

Japan has asked for F-22 and will not get it. So we might see a competition between Typhoon and F-35 in Japan. Or maybe they will do something else.

There are some extremely vague rumors, but nothing more.

What is more likely is development of European UCAVs. Several European countries are looking into that at the moment.

V

After the JSF comes out then wont England Germany and Italy reduce their orders and then go for more JSF. Even in the export market this will face lots of problems because of its price

 

[ASFC]

Nope. Typhoon production/delivery to the partner nations who designed and built it will wind down towards the end of the next decade, when F-35 is only just coming online (i.e. the RAF/RN are looking at 2018 before the 1st F-35 sqn is operational). It must also be remembered that alot of these Air Forces have more than one fighter type. So in the RAF Typhoon replaces Jaguar and the F.3, and F-35 will replace the Harrier (and possibly) the Tornado GR.4/4A. I would expect the situations in Germany and Italy are similar. It avoids having an Air Force of obsolete Fighters if you replace your Air Force in this way.

 

[kato]

Germany will not buy F-35 assuredly. The only aircraft remaining after the Eurofighter is introduced will be two squadrons of Tornado ECR SEAD aircraft, not unlikely to be replaced by UCAV, and one squadron of remaining Tornado IDS Recce, likely to be replaced by additional UAV HALE/MALE. Only role remaining other than that is the nuclear strike role, but most people expect NATO Nuclear Sharing to die away quietly anyway.

In Italy, the F-35 replaces Harrier and AMX nominally.

 

[METEORSWARM]

In Spain the F-35 replaces Harrier.

Mix Efa,f35b for marine ship and helicopter Tiger,upgrades Efa and stop.

Efa centric neurons and ucavs.

 

[FluffyThoughts]

Typhoon versus Lightening II

After the JSF comes out then wont England Germany and Italy reduce their orders and then go for more JSF. Even in the export market this will face lots of problems because of its price

Unlike others here, I have to agree with you. What is the role of the Typhoon?

Whilst we all await news on Tranche III, it is clear that the Royal Navy and Air-Force have a more capable fighter available in the form of the Lightening II. It is designed from scratch to be VLO and has an AESA radar. The suspicion I have is that Typhoon will not get many of these features. Thrust-vectoring also comes as standard in the LII.

So could the Typhoon live up to it's name-sake and evolve into a very good ground-attack system? Probably. The only question I have is will the Navy get enough LII (say 24 + 24 for active wings, plus a share of 36 for OCU) to justify the CVF...? :shudder

 

[Ozzy Blizzard]

Unlike others here, I have to agree with you. What is the role of the Typhoon?

Whilst we all await news on Tranche III, it is clear that the Royal Navy and Air-Force have a more capable fighter available in the form of the Lightening II. It is designed from scratch to be VLO and has an AESA radar. The suspicion I have is that Typhoon will not get many of these features. Thrust-vectoring also comes as standard in the LII.

So could the Typhoon live up to it's name-sake and evolve into a very good ground-attack system? Probably. The only question I have is will the Navy get enough LII (say 24 + 24 for active wings, plus a share of 36 for OCU) to justify the CVF...? :shudder

I agree with you as far as aggregate capability goes. The information dominance and survivability 5th gen platforms provide is far superior to the Typhoon. However the UK would not have achieved any of the industrial benefits by buying off the shelf F-35's that they did during the design, construction and export of Typhoon, even if the system does provide more aggregate capability. There are plenty of things to consider when you buy or develop a weapons system, more than just which one is better at doing the job.

BTW the F-35 does not have TVC standard on any variant, or as an option. There are no plans to introduce such a system on the platform AFAIK. The F-35B has some form of vectored thrust to aid in the STOVL capability, but it's not the Super Flanker esk, super-maneuverability enabling TVC your thinking of.

 

[gf0012-aust]

BTW the F-35 does not have TVC standard on any variant, or as an option. There are no plans to introduce such a system on the platform AFAIK.

AFAWK, TVC is out altogether. There are other systems that negate the "then" performance advantages.

again, as an example . a TVC manned jet might get to 9.5g's screaming "frame stress alert" - a missile will turn at 35g's and not give two hoots. A TVC missile adds a whole other layer.

TVC's were a good idea years ago, a great idea for air shows - but in light of other weapons and systems advances - it's an expense and weight liability that is hard to justify.

 

[FluffyThoughts]

I agree with you as far as aggregate capability goes. The information dominance and survivability 5th gen platforms provide is far superior to the Typhoon. However the UK would not have achieved any of the industrial benefits by buying off the shelf F-35's that they did during the design, construction and export of Typhoon, even if the system does provide more aggregate capability. There are plenty of things to consider when you buy or develop a weapons system, more than just which one is better at doing the job.

BTW the F-35 does not have TVC standard on any variant, or as an option. There are no plans to introduce such a system on the platform AFAIK. The F-35B has some form of vectored thrust to aid in the STOVL capability, but it's not the Super Flanker esk, super-maneuverability enabling TVC your thinking of.

True, but that is my point. Whether Viffing ever worked is beyond me. However, as many people - probably yourself included - have pointed out VTC is great up to 9G's, but when a missile can turn at 64G's you (as a pilot) have nothing else to rely upon other then Martin-Baker (or derivatives thereof)...!

 

[FluffyThoughts]

AFAWK, TVC is out altogether. There are other systems that negate the "then" performance advantages.

again, as an example . a TVC manned jet might get to 9.5g's screaming "frame stress alert" - a missile will turn at 35g's and not give two hoots. A TVC missile adds a whole other layer.

TVC's were a good idea years ago, a great idea for air shows - but in light of other weapons and systems advances - it's an expense and weight liability that is hard to justify.

Do'h, you beat me!

O/T, but is there a session-problem? Keep getting requests to log-in....

 

[swerve]

After the JSF comes out then wont England Germany and Italy reduce their orders and then go for more JSF. Even in the export market this will face lots of problems because of its price

No. Germany won't buy F-35 (it's not even being discussed as a possibility there), & is committed to buying all its Eurofighters. It cut numbers to the bone in the 1980s, & won't cut again. Spain also seems committed to taking its full planned number, & has no plans to buy land based F-35.

Italy & the UK can't cut orders without paying huge compensation to Germany & Spain, which makes it financially pointless. The UK seems to be trying to get round this by selling on 24 earlier Typhoons to Oman, which is allowed.

Here in the UK, there's talk of cutting F-35B numbers. A reduction of 24 Typhoon, plus a similar cut in F-35B numbers, would probably be enough for the bean counters. It should leave enough F-35B for the carriers, which I've been concerned about.There's not much point in having two carriers unless you have enough aircraft to fill them.

 

[Ozzy Blizzard]

True, but that is my point. Whether Viffing ever worked is beyond me. However, as many people - probably yourself included - have pointed out VTC is great up to 9G's, but when a missile can turn at 64G's you (as a pilot) have nothing else to rely upon other then Martin-Baker (or derivatives thereof)...!

Agreed. HOBS heaters, HMCS and 360 degree sensor packages (i.e. EO DAS) rendered the technology redundant in many ways. The only practical benefit i can see is better handling at extreme altitude, and as GF pointed out the drag, cost and maintenance penalties (i hear the MKI's TVC is a bitch to maintain) is hard to justify.

 

[gf0012-aust]

O/T, but is there a session-problem? Keep getting requests to log-in....

I used to have it when I was "lurking" - ie viewing without logging on. once I logged off it always sessioned me out no matter if I logged on again. ie, change threads and I would get knocked off.

Staying logged on and protecting the session cookies is the wayto fix it

 

[METEORSWARM]

Caesar

http://translate.google.com/transla...or-e/index.html&langpair=de|en&hl=de&ie=UTF-8



http://rapidshare.de/files/40996955/Roulston_1_.pdf.html

Mod edit: One-liner posts and/or linking to articles without providing ones own input or thoughts are against the forum rules. There have been recents posts where this has occurred. If this continues, Warnings will be issued.
-Preceptor

 

[Sintra]

Now, that´s what i call extreme optimism from EUROFIGHTER GMBH!

28 November 2008 - Australia to change its mind about JSF?
We were aware of the Australian Defence Minister Joel Fitzgibbon touring Europe and visiting Spain, getting briefed on Eurofighter by our friends of EADS CASA in Getafe. But now Australian media start to report about it. The Australian Government has not finally decided yet, if they want to buy the export version of the F-35. It is being said that also the Australian Strategic Policy Institute looks at Eurofighter Typhoon “at the head of the pack of current-generation fighters”.

http://www.eurofighter.com/po_bl.asp?id=95

Australia was seen as a strong potential Typhoon operator a decade ago... Not now.