best special forces
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did you know that the sas train in multiple combat areas and terrain starting in the jungle for the first 4 weeks of training then first aid training, escape and evasion, para shuting night and day, desert...snow and sand, and counter terrorism
for you to be even considered for selection you have to have a minimum of 3 months feild experience in your regiment and must pass the battle fitness test with flying colours.
they start with around 150 students in 2 training recrutment sessions a year which are picked from the british army
lol this is probably why they have a training motto of
""We don't try to fail you, we try to kill you."
for you to be even considered for selection you have to have a minimum of 3 months feild experience in your regiment and must pass the battle fitness test with flying colours.
they start with around 150 students in 2 training recrutment sessions a year which are picked from the british army
lol this is probably why they have a training motto of
""We don't try to fail you, we try to kill you."
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I'm not even going to mention their performance at Beslan.1john2004 said:
that's no different to any other Western style SF unit, go down to the French jungle warfare school in Guyana and you'd meet half a dozen different sf unit's there at a time the same with the Swedish arctic and harsh climate combat school, just because a unit is less publicised then the SAS does not mean it's inferiorkarlh said:
I think folks are confusing "best" with "favorite". National pride aside there's the best, and then there's the rest ... period. Yeah some units might perform better than others in certain scenario's, but that's really irrelevant in the overall scheme of things.
Something not discussed which should not be overlooked is the individuals involved. Irrespective of what their national origins are, in most cases members of elite units share many common attributes. Intelligence, intestinal fortitude and patriotism. On that basis we can all agree that the individuals that comprise most SF units are in and of themselves unique and worthy of respect from at least their fellow countryman if not from the global military community at large. All of those things aside, despite the individual high quality of team members there are definitive differences in the actual capabilites of the various SF units in the world. As I believe I mentioned earlier in this post, there's a pretty good reason why SAS, Delta and the like are often used as comparitive qualifiers and it's not because they have been "glamorized".
Something not discussed which should not be overlooked is the individuals involved. Irrespective of what their national origins are, in most cases members of elite units share many common attributes. Intelligence, intestinal fortitude and patriotism. On that basis we can all agree that the individuals that comprise most SF units are in and of themselves unique and worthy of respect from at least their fellow countryman if not from the global military community at large. All of those things aside, despite the individual high quality of team members there are definitive differences in the actual capabilites of the various SF units in the world. As I believe I mentioned earlier in this post, there's a pretty good reason why SAS, Delta and the like are often used as comparitive qualifiers and it's not because they have been "glamorized".
if it was not for the sas, 1st Special Forces Operational Detachment-Delta or delta force as it is known would not have been formed.Delta Force was created by U.S. Army colonel Charles Beckwith in 1977 due to a year long exchange between british and american special forces (american high ranking officer visits british sf and british visits american) they did this so that british and american forces could patch up the gaps that they left in their armed forces. after the tour col beckwith went to the us goverment to fill a huge gap in the american army. the us had no counter terrorist team so col beckwith formed delta force. he did this with the help of sas soldiers so he could train his new recruits to the standards needed. delta force was then formed into three operating squadrons, all of which (A, B, and C) are subdivided into small groups known as troops. It is rumored that each troop, as the case with the sas, specializes in HALO, SCUBA, or other skill groups.
so if your trying to say that no special forces are alike why do delta force run under exactly the same training and regiment formation as the sas. you could say that the sas and delta force are the same. they are used in the same way as each other so they use he same skills.
These skills are enhanced by the unit's participation in an ongoing exchange and training programs with foreign counterterrorist units, such as (as might be expected) Britain's 22 SAS, France's GIGN, Germany's GSG-9, Israel's Sayeret Matkal/Unit 269, and Australia's own Special Air Service Regiment.
so basically most special forces units exchange their skills to help pick up on the parts they missed out on... thats what makes the special forces the best.
so if your trying to say that no special forces are alike why do delta force run under exactly the same training and regiment formation as the sas. you could say that the sas and delta force are the same. they are used in the same way as each other so they use he same skills.
These skills are enhanced by the unit's participation in an ongoing exchange and training programs with foreign counterterrorist units, such as (as might be expected) Britain's 22 SAS, France's GIGN, Germany's GSG-9, Israel's Sayeret Matkal/Unit 269, and Australia's own Special Air Service Regiment.
so basically most special forces units exchange their skills to help pick up on the parts they missed out on... thats what makes the special forces the best.
I went to Jordan recently for an expedition and I met a guy from Counter-Terrorism. He was to train us and be our guide. He told me they trained for fitness by running a minimum of 20 km and if anyone stopped, they had to do 50 press-ups. The guy was very well trained. 10 of us tried to jump him from the back and pin him down for fun and he made sure all of us 10 were on the ground for fun. I must say he set a very good precedent and made it look to us that the Jordanian army was very well-trained, which they quite were !!!
The Jordanians are generally regarded as the most profiicient and better trained of the Arabic special forces. They actually do a fair bit of training with the US, UK, French and German specforces. There is an active training exchange programme especially with the HRT side of the buisness.vrus said:
A
Aussie Digger
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Just to keep this thread ticking over, does anyone know anything about the recently announced "Special Reconaissance Regiment" that is being from by Great Britain to support 22nd SAS?
I've read all sorts of rumours, that it's going to be formed by the remains of the Black Watch, to 1st Battalion Parachute Regt taking on the role. Does anyone know for sure?
I've read all sorts of rumours, that it's going to be formed by the remains of the Black Watch, to 1st Battalion Parachute Regt taking on the role. Does anyone know for sure?
asked around and received this... :
"SRR was mentioned as a key requirement in July 2004 by CGS Gen Carver. It is being formed around the existing 14 Intelligence Company ("14 Int", the deep cover operators and recon experts in Northern Ireland and Bosnia). It's a 200 person (male/female, tri-service) Intelligence Corps unit expert in penetrating terrorist cells, running/turning enemy agents and conducting extreme close recon. It may grow to 300 to form out SRR. Its headquarters will relocate from Lisburn, N.I. to Hereford. CGS has said that infiltration of cells cannot be done simply by dressing up as a bush; 14 Int are the people who do this...different skill set from SAS....requires all officer/NCO teams."
"SRR was mentioned as a key requirement in July 2004 by CGS Gen Carver. It is being formed around the existing 14 Intelligence Company ("14 Int", the deep cover operators and recon experts in Northern Ireland and Bosnia). It's a 200 person (male/female, tri-service) Intelligence Corps unit expert in penetrating terrorist cells, running/turning enemy agents and conducting extreme close recon. It may grow to 300 to form out SRR. Its headquarters will relocate from Lisburn, N.I. to Hereford. CGS has said that infiltration of cells cannot be done simply by dressing up as a bush; 14 Int are the people who do this...different skill set from SAS....requires all officer/NCO teams."
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Aussie Digger
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Fair enough, I thought it might be something like that. I'm not sure about the SAS not being able to do it though. The SAS devised the tactics and operatioal procedures the "Det" (ie: 14 Int Coy) used. Most of the original operators were 22nd SAS...
The special forces within the Turkish Armed Forces are one of the finest among their counterparts throughout the world. Despite the fact that there are many other special operations commando units, such as the Mountain Commando Brigades, Gendarmerie Commandos and Marine Corps, within the Turkish Armed Forces, they do not fall under the definition/classification of modern day special forces.
The Turkish special forces units could be classified into the following:
1. SPECIAL FORCES COMMAND - GENERAL STAFF HEADQUARTERS (SFC)
The manpower required for the Special Forces Command (SFC), which is publicly known as Red Berets, is acquired from the selected officers and non-commissioned officers (NCOs) of various units operating under the Land Forces Command. In other words, the Army officers and NCOs only are eligible to join this elite unit. This unit directly operates under the command of the General Staff Headquarters. The individuals forming this special unit are selected from their regular army troops on voluntary basis. Not all who volunteer are admitted though since there is a pass/fail written and physical exam. Those who pass the exams become special forces candidates. Adequate linguistic skills in at least one foreign language is a plus for admission. The candidates then have to complete a challenging training period which lasts around 2.5 years. Many drop out during this intense training period. Training encompasses fitness, obstacle, Martial Arts, close quarters combat (CQC), biological/chemical/nuclear warfare, parachuting, diving, sniping, demolition, counter-terrorism, search and rescue, stealth seek and destroy, reconnaissance and survival. Learning foreign languages is a part of the training. During the training, candidates are pushed by their instructors to their limits, both physical and mental. Training schedule includes all aspects of a modern day regular and psychological warfare. 100 kilometer terrain-walking with a 40 kg load is just an example of what the candidates have to go through during training. The size of the SFC stands at a "Division" level. The SFC can be considered as the Turkish counterpart of the US Green Berets.
Within the SFC, there is a top-secret unit which only has 100 members. The name of the unit is Combat Search and Rescue (C.S.R. or M.A.K. in Turkish). However, no further information is available on CSR except for the fact that it is thought to be established and organized like its US counterpart Delta Force. It also differs from the SFC in that its members are selected not only from the Army, but also from the other two main forces, Navy and Air Force. It should not be difficult to conclude that CSR members are the best of the best within the Turkish Armed Forces.
SFC and CSR perform a variety of duties such as:
- Surveillance on enemy structures, facilities, defense systems or strategically relevant buildings.
- Covert sabotage against enemy units and structures.
- Infiltration.
- Reconnaissance.
- Hostage/POW/downed pilot rescue.
- Counter-terrorism missions.
- Close Quarter Combat.
- Organization and training of friendly civilians against the enemy.
SFC and CSR both took part in the accomplishment of several missions. Capture of Abdullah Ocalan, the Chief of the terrorist PKK organization, in Kenya and of Semdin Sakik, PKK's second chief in charge were carried out by the SFC. The SFC acquired vast amount of experience in search and destroy type missions, especially in rural areas and caves in South-East Turkey, during its years long campaign against the PKK. The SFC has also been undertaking missions in Bosnia, Kosovo, Albania, Afghanistan and North Iraq. A few SFC teams were sent to Afghanistan during Operation Enduring Freedom and trained the new recruits of the newly-established regular Afghan Army.
2. NAVAL SPECIAL FORCES
The Naval Special Forces of the Turkish Armed Forces are classified under two categories. Although these two categories, publicly known as SAS and SAT, are thought to be the same by many people, in fact they are not. They are two different units with completely different specialization areas and range of duties. The personnel of both units are selected only from the Navy officers and non-commissioned officers, on voluntary basis.
A. UNDERWATER DEFENSE TEAMS (UDT)
Underwater Defense Teams (UDT), or SAS in Turkish, are the counterparts of the US Underwater Demolition Teams (UDT). Their main tasks are:
- Deactivation or disposal of explosive material, mines and/or unidentified ordinance under the water off the friendly ports and coasts.
- Deactivation or disposal of explosive material, mines and/or unidentified ordinance under the water off the target coasts or ports. That includes clearing of the target beaches of mines, explosives, booby traps and tank traps, prior to the amphibious assault of the friendly forces.
- Deactivation or disposal of explosives and mines that might be present on the course of the friendly troops and/or VIP military personnel.
- Consultancy in defending the strategic facilities against stealth assaults by enemy commandos.
UDT units do not perform assault, counter-terrorism, recon or CQC missions. A real-time duty executed by the SAS has been the clearing of the Girne Beach, Cyprus, prior to the amphibious assault of the Turkish Armed Forces to the island in 1974.
B. UNDERWATER ASSAULT TEAMS (UAT)
Underwater Assault Teams (UAT), or SAT in Turkish, are the counterparts of the US Navy Seals. Their main tasks are:
- Surveillance on enemy structures, facilities, defense systems or strategically relevant buildings.
- Covert sabotage against naval units and/or enemy structures.
- Covert landing and infiltration.
- Reconnaissance on beaches being considered for amphibious landing operations.
- Determining secure landing paths.
- Underwater recon within 2.5 m deep water/beach corridors.
- Direct action during first wave of landing missions.
- Hostage/POW/downed pilot rescue.
- Counter-terrorism missions.
- Close Quarter Combat.
The training period of the Turkish Naval Special Forces, which lasts 49 weeks, is shorter than that of the SFC. It starts off with a 5-week-long Indoctrination period, followed by three consecutive training phases, and then Airborne Training and Special Ops Training.
Training and Duration:
BUD/S: Indoctrination Period - 5 weeks Phase I (Basic conditioning + Hell Week) - 9 weeks
Phase II (Diving) - 8 weeks
Phase III (Land Warfare) - 9 weeks
Post BUD/S:
Airborne Training - 3 weeks
Special Ops Technical Training - 2 weeks
Medical Training - 30 weeks
Platoon Training - 18 months
SFC, SAS or SAT, every Special Operations mission needs absolute secrecy and stealth. In consequence to these requirements, some peculiarities are expected in all special operations candidates: Total dedication to the motherland and extreme determination; No fear of darkness, altitude, underwater activity or loneliness at all; resistance and effective reaction capability in extreme situations (including torture); capacity and determination to accomplish the tasked mission at any cost; ability to make immediate and effective decisions; capacity to adapt to changing situations or environments.
The Turkish special forces units could be classified into the following:
1. SPECIAL FORCES COMMAND - GENERAL STAFF HEADQUARTERS (SFC)
The manpower required for the Special Forces Command (SFC), which is publicly known as Red Berets, is acquired from the selected officers and non-commissioned officers (NCOs) of various units operating under the Land Forces Command. In other words, the Army officers and NCOs only are eligible to join this elite unit. This unit directly operates under the command of the General Staff Headquarters. The individuals forming this special unit are selected from their regular army troops on voluntary basis. Not all who volunteer are admitted though since there is a pass/fail written and physical exam. Those who pass the exams become special forces candidates. Adequate linguistic skills in at least one foreign language is a plus for admission. The candidates then have to complete a challenging training period which lasts around 2.5 years. Many drop out during this intense training period. Training encompasses fitness, obstacle, Martial Arts, close quarters combat (CQC), biological/chemical/nuclear warfare, parachuting, diving, sniping, demolition, counter-terrorism, search and rescue, stealth seek and destroy, reconnaissance and survival. Learning foreign languages is a part of the training. During the training, candidates are pushed by their instructors to their limits, both physical and mental. Training schedule includes all aspects of a modern day regular and psychological warfare. 100 kilometer terrain-walking with a 40 kg load is just an example of what the candidates have to go through during training. The size of the SFC stands at a "Division" level. The SFC can be considered as the Turkish counterpart of the US Green Berets.
Within the SFC, there is a top-secret unit which only has 100 members. The name of the unit is Combat Search and Rescue (C.S.R. or M.A.K. in Turkish). However, no further information is available on CSR except for the fact that it is thought to be established and organized like its US counterpart Delta Force. It also differs from the SFC in that its members are selected not only from the Army, but also from the other two main forces, Navy and Air Force. It should not be difficult to conclude that CSR members are the best of the best within the Turkish Armed Forces.
SFC and CSR perform a variety of duties such as:
- Surveillance on enemy structures, facilities, defense systems or strategically relevant buildings.
- Covert sabotage against enemy units and structures.
- Infiltration.
- Reconnaissance.
- Hostage/POW/downed pilot rescue.
- Counter-terrorism missions.
- Close Quarter Combat.
- Organization and training of friendly civilians against the enemy.
SFC and CSR both took part in the accomplishment of several missions. Capture of Abdullah Ocalan, the Chief of the terrorist PKK organization, in Kenya and of Semdin Sakik, PKK's second chief in charge were carried out by the SFC. The SFC acquired vast amount of experience in search and destroy type missions, especially in rural areas and caves in South-East Turkey, during its years long campaign against the PKK. The SFC has also been undertaking missions in Bosnia, Kosovo, Albania, Afghanistan and North Iraq. A few SFC teams were sent to Afghanistan during Operation Enduring Freedom and trained the new recruits of the newly-established regular Afghan Army.
2. NAVAL SPECIAL FORCES
The Naval Special Forces of the Turkish Armed Forces are classified under two categories. Although these two categories, publicly known as SAS and SAT, are thought to be the same by many people, in fact they are not. They are two different units with completely different specialization areas and range of duties. The personnel of both units are selected only from the Navy officers and non-commissioned officers, on voluntary basis.
A. UNDERWATER DEFENSE TEAMS (UDT)
Underwater Defense Teams (UDT), or SAS in Turkish, are the counterparts of the US Underwater Demolition Teams (UDT). Their main tasks are:
- Deactivation or disposal of explosive material, mines and/or unidentified ordinance under the water off the friendly ports and coasts.
- Deactivation or disposal of explosive material, mines and/or unidentified ordinance under the water off the target coasts or ports. That includes clearing of the target beaches of mines, explosives, booby traps and tank traps, prior to the amphibious assault of the friendly forces.
- Deactivation or disposal of explosives and mines that might be present on the course of the friendly troops and/or VIP military personnel.
- Consultancy in defending the strategic facilities against stealth assaults by enemy commandos.
UDT units do not perform assault, counter-terrorism, recon or CQC missions. A real-time duty executed by the SAS has been the clearing of the Girne Beach, Cyprus, prior to the amphibious assault of the Turkish Armed Forces to the island in 1974.
B. UNDERWATER ASSAULT TEAMS (UAT)
Underwater Assault Teams (UAT), or SAT in Turkish, are the counterparts of the US Navy Seals. Their main tasks are:
- Surveillance on enemy structures, facilities, defense systems or strategically relevant buildings.
- Covert sabotage against naval units and/or enemy structures.
- Covert landing and infiltration.
- Reconnaissance on beaches being considered for amphibious landing operations.
- Determining secure landing paths.
- Underwater recon within 2.5 m deep water/beach corridors.
- Direct action during first wave of landing missions.
- Hostage/POW/downed pilot rescue.
- Counter-terrorism missions.
- Close Quarter Combat.
The training period of the Turkish Naval Special Forces, which lasts 49 weeks, is shorter than that of the SFC. It starts off with a 5-week-long Indoctrination period, followed by three consecutive training phases, and then Airborne Training and Special Ops Training.
Training and Duration:
BUD/S: Indoctrination Period - 5 weeks Phase I (Basic conditioning + Hell Week) - 9 weeks
Phase II (Diving) - 8 weeks
Phase III (Land Warfare) - 9 weeks
Post BUD/S:
Airborne Training - 3 weeks
Special Ops Technical Training - 2 weeks
Medical Training - 30 weeks
Platoon Training - 18 months
SFC, SAS or SAT, every Special Operations mission needs absolute secrecy and stealth. In consequence to these requirements, some peculiarities are expected in all special operations candidates: Total dedication to the motherland and extreme determination; No fear of darkness, altitude, underwater activity or loneliness at all; resistance and effective reaction capability in extreme situations (including torture); capacity and determination to accomplish the tasked mission at any cost; ability to make immediate and effective decisions; capacity to adapt to changing situations or environments.
OPERATIONS:
1. Fight against the terrorist/seperatist group PKK/KADEK (1984-2000)
2. Capture of Semdin Sakik, the second name in command of the PKK (1998).
3. Capture of Abdullah Ocalan, the head of PKK, in Kenya (1999).
4. Kardak (Imia) Islets operation (1996).
http://warriorsoul.4t.com/sof.html
1. Fight against the terrorist/seperatist group PKK/KADEK (1984-2000)
2. Capture of Semdin Sakik, the second name in command of the PKK (1998).
3. Capture of Abdullah Ocalan, the head of PKK, in Kenya (1999).
4. Kardak (Imia) Islets operation (1996).
http://warriorsoul.4t.com/sof.html
I agree that this was an absolute stuff up. The death of 130 or a 174 denotes a lack of control and management in a number of places. One of the people who works for me on Exec Protection and is ex UK SAS is absolutely appalled by it - and he does have access to info that is not in the public domain.Pathfinder-X said:
The Team Leader has a lot to answer for.
well if that's the criteria then it would be the Brit'sjtcohen said:
:,the USMC has several very capable special operation's unit's, but the average Jarhead is an elite light infantryman, there is a big difference between that and being an operator :cool2Can't forget SSG which is simular to SAS, and you can only be chosen if you have been an officer for atleast 3 years, and compleets the 2 week initial tests.
It was "made" alot later then SAS though, at around 1990 and was "made" to protect our military commander in an event of war. They have a direct line of command from the highest military aouthority. The government knew about them first around 1993, and they where then banned (by the government) to operate inside Sweden (because of an insident in 1931) but they ware allowed to operate outside Sweden, and has now operated (this are the only confirmed mission) in Kosovo, Kongo and Afghanistan. There are speculations of where they have operated outside that but non has been confirmed as its still a top secret Anti terrorist/Recon/Protection force. The number of operatives is unknown, group sizes are unknown, weapons are unknown. But most of the operatives has been trained in Airborne insertings and are mostly trained as Airborne Rangers (then they are trained as SSG operatives, with daily training all years they are part of the team (bit of a speculation there aswll, as said, not much about them is known)
They have worked with American and British Special forces, aswell as the FFL in kongo.
It was "made" alot later then SAS though, at around 1990 and was "made" to protect our military commander in an event of war. They have a direct line of command from the highest military aouthority. The government knew about them first around 1993, and they where then banned (by the government) to operate inside Sweden (because of an insident in 1931) but they ware allowed to operate outside Sweden, and has now operated (this are the only confirmed mission) in Kosovo, Kongo and Afghanistan. There are speculations of where they have operated outside that but non has been confirmed as its still a top secret Anti terrorist/Recon/Protection force. The number of operatives is unknown, group sizes are unknown, weapons are unknown. But most of the operatives has been trained in Airborne insertings and are mostly trained as Airborne Rangers (then they are trained as SSG operatives, with daily training all years they are part of the team (bit of a speculation there aswll, as said, not much about them is known)
They have worked with American and British Special forces, aswell as the FFL in kongo.
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