Royal New Zealand Air Force

ngatimozart

Super Moderator
Staff member
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RNZAF News a while back signalled AWO training moving 'home' in 2-3 years so that seems to fit with the tender details etc. Currently 4 airframes providing MEPT & light transport, so probably not overly busy - wonder if 4 frames is considered enough once AWO training & light MPA duties are added in... may see 42 sqn go back to 5 strong fleet.

What is intersting is the interior - whilst I imagine these days AWO training requires just a laptop on a table, I imagine console etc for MPA operator will be more substantial & possibly not so 'portable' - so might reduce ability to provide anything more than very light transport. We can't rule out another King Air type (ie: B350) being offered - that would help just a wee bit with providing that little extra space.

Wait & see I guess...
For the interior the word console (singular per aircraft) was used with the cabin required to be re-roled as stipulated, so read console required to be plug and play. No real reason why console can't be portable. Forget MPA term its airborne surveillance both maritime and overland. The cockpit is to be digital. Regarding numbers a certain financial number has been stipulated and the respondents will have to work within that, but that number excludes the sensors.
 

MrConservative

Super Moderator
Staff member
Yep. A console for the AWO trainee and another console 'in line of sight' for the instructor and a partial desktop console for the 2nd trainee. Two VIP seats for John and Bronagh and at least 4 minders.
 

Gibbo

Well-Known Member
Yep. A console for the AWO trainee and another console 'in line of sight' for the instructor and a partial desktop console for the 2nd trainee. Two VIP seats for John and Bronagh and at least 4 minders.
Actually yeah, I suspect VIP (MinDef & CDF etc) isn't a high priority for 42. There's always A109 & NH90 for that sort of stuff too if required.
 

Gibbo

Well-Known Member
For the interior the word console (singular per aircraft) was used with the cabin required to be re-roled as stipulated, so read console required to be plug and play. No real reason why console can't be portable. Forget MPA term its airborne surveillance both maritime and overland. The cockpit is to be digital. Regarding numbers a certain financial number has been stipulated and the respondents will have to work within that, but that number excludes the sensors.
Yep, used MPA c'os I didn't know how else to refer to it...:p:

Just hope they don't rely on 1 set of sensors - can't see more than 1 being used at a time but need another to cover maintenance, failures etc.
 

ngatimozart

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Yep, used MPA c'os I didn't know how else to refer to it...:p:

Just hope they don't rely on 1 set of sensors - can't see more than 1 being used at a time but need another to cover maintenance, failures etc.
I think that more than one will be used at a time but we'll have to wait and see.

Since the Ministry has had the new procurement team in place I have noticed a significant increase in the detail that is being included in NOI, RFI, RFP & RFT documents, which is really good. They also have more communication with industry and this is reflected in the number of amendments that are issued and the feedback within. A good example of this is the current LOSC RFT. This is a move very much for the better.
 

40 deg south

Well-Known Member
I think that more than one will be used at a time but we'll have to wait and see.

Since the Ministry has had the new procurement team in place I have noticed a significant increase in the detail that is being included in NOI, RFI, RFP & RFT documents, which is really good. They also have more communication with industry and this is reflected in the number of amendments that are issued and the feedback within. A good example of this is the current LOSC RFT. This is a move very much for the better.
Yes, I've noticed that too. I'd guess a change in policy backed by increased resources.

http://airforce.mil.nz/downloads/pdf/airforce-news/afn186.pdf

Latest Air Force News now out.
 

Rob c

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
I was out walking the dog when i heard a rumble overhead, looking up at what sounded like a Dak (DC3) I was surprised to see a Catalina fly past at about 1000ft, heading north I don't know where it came from or where it was going but it was a nice surprise to see it.
 

ngatimozart

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I was out walking the dog when i heard a rumble overhead, looking up at what sounded like a Dak (DC3) I was surprised to see a Catalina fly past at about 1000ft, heading north I don't know where it came from or where it was going but it was a nice surprise to see it.
It's the Catalina society PBY Cat and has just recently started flying again after a multi-year major wing and centre section rebuild which cost a fortune. IIRC it's painted up in RNZAF WW2 Pacific markings for 6 Sqn and it may be based at Ohakea along with the TBF Avenger and Brendon Deeres twin seat Spitfire.


Image Copyright Gavin Conroy.
 
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Rob c

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
It's the Catalina society PBY Cat and has just recently started flying again after a multi-year major wing and centre section rebuild which cost a fortune. IIRC it's painted up in RNZAF WW2 Pacific markings for 6 Sqn and it may be based at Ohakea along with the TBF Avenger and Brendon Deeres twin seat Spitfire.


Image Copyright Gavin Conroy.
AHHH that will be good. so I will be in for additional viewings from time to time, lucky me.
 

Spitfire

New Member
The Catalina is now based in New Plymouth. Although over the summer it will be in Tauranga, Ardmore etc. between air shows.

Brendon Deere's Spitfire is a single seater MK IX (the two seater is based at Ardmore)
 

ngatimozart

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The Catalina is now based in New Plymouth. Although over the summer it will be in Tauranga, Ardmore etc. between air shows.

Brendon Deere's Spitfire is a single seater MK IX (the two seater is based at Ardmore)
Great thanks for that, much appreciated.
 

htbrst

Active Member
Things are starting to heat up with some aerial activity around the Navy and Air force anniversaries coming up in the next few months:

- Not one but two P-1's are in town: MRC Aviation: Kawasaki P-1's jet into Whenuapai

- US, Australia, Singapore, the UK and Japan have RSVPed for the Airforces 80th. With that mix it's not totally out of the question that practically all of the C-130 replacement contenders could participate :p: .
 

40 deg south

Well-Known Member

John Fedup

The Bunker Group
Small country releases Defence White Paper in June, proposing funding boost and replacement of their six-strong P-3C fleet. No, not New Zealand.

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/norway-reveals-p-3-replacement-plans-426544/

And now an agreement to work closely with the UK on maritime patrol. I'd have to say that another P-8 order looks likely.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/uk-and-norway-agree-new-cooperation-on-maritime-patrol-aircraft
I would like to see Norway commit to P-8s as it would put some pressure on Canada to address our P-3 Aurora replacement. It would also address Trump's complaint that certain NATO members need to start pulling some weight.;)
 

kiwipatriot69

Active Member
Embraer Responds to New Zealand RFI for Airlift, Surveillance Aircraft

Embraer announces they are responding to NZ's RFI.

Entirely predicable, but interesting they have gone public. Probably a combination of the reporters spin and sales department hype, but it reads as if it is a Tender response rather than a Request for Information.
Seems rather ambitIous of Embraer, to market the Kc390 to fill both maritime patrol and tactical lift, though they mentioned only five to seven aircraft, surely they realise we need to replace 6 maritime and 7 airlift transports, ie we need dedicated MPA? If anything, the current quakes have shown a big capability gap , with numbers and lift we have now. will KC390 be able to land on the small airfeilds like Kaikoura?
 

ngatimozart

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Seems rather ambitIous of Embraer, to market the Kc390 to fill both maritime patrol and tactical lift, though they mentioned only five to seven aircraft, surely they realise we need to replace 6 maritime and 7 airlift transports, ie we need dedicated MPA? If anything, the current quakes have shown a big capability gap , with numbers and lift we have now. will KC390 be able to land on the small airfeilds like Kaikoura?
No, the KC390 is only for the C130H(NZ) replacement. They are going to develope a MPA from their E-190 airliner. However, the 2016 DCP states on P82 (thanks 40DS):
A key lesson learned in the delivery of military capabilities over the last 15 years has been the benefits of a risk mitigation strategy that purchases Military off the Shelf (MOTS) and Commercial off the Shelf (COTS) products, and avoids early adoption of new technologies. This can mean the acquisition of an established product as developed for other militaries, usually our closest partners, without specific modification to meet unique New Zealand requirements. This avoids the risks inherent in early development work, and limits the degree of risk around cost and effectiveness of the capability. Joining a large production run undertaken by our partners can also provide efficiencies leading to a lower unit cost. It also provides benefits around commonality with our partners and the ability to draw on their investment in initial development.
So given that, IF by some feat of procurement, diplomatic and political magic, we were to acquire a couple of C17A for strategic airlift, then the KC390 may have a look in because of the Boeing connection. That would also give Boeing the opportunity for a single B737-700ER (range 5,600nm) sale, as the B757 replacement in the pax, medivac and VIP role. Along with the P8, Boeing would have a great opportunity here, because its the after sales maintenance contracting where the money is really made.
 

MrConservative

Super Moderator
Staff member
If two C-17's do get up then it will be only four C-130's and operation of a single transport type according to the recent C-17 document dump by MinDef.

Of course with the P-8 a 737 derivative makes sense. A new COTS 737 from the NG range should have greater reliability then the current 25 year old transports and be less prone for going u/s. They could also get greater utility out of the airframe in a number of smaller but vital roles in addition to primary passenger/vip transport, which get get more use out of the aircraft just to keep humming along.

There is no requirement for the solution to come from just a single manufacturer or bidding team. Making it all sweet and easy for the commercial bidder is not their main focus or problem to solve.
 

kiwipatriot69

Active Member
If two C-17's do get up then it will be only four C-130's and operation of a single transport type according to the recent C-17 document dump by MinDef.

Of course with the P-8 a 737 derivative makes sense. A new COTS 737 from the NG range should have greater reliability then the current 25 year old transports and be less prone for going u/s. They could also get greater utility out of the airframe in a number of smaller but vital roles in addition to primary passenger/vip transport, which get get more use out of the aircraft just to keep humming along.

There is no requirement for the solution to come from just a single manufacturer or bidding team. Making it all sweet and easy for the commercial bidder is not their main focus or problem to solve.
Given the current issues we are facIng though, would this be a good fit in the event of another earthquake regards to turnover of equipment and evacuation of local communities? Canterbury nothwithstanding, , the effort is being severly hampered by damaged roads for our army response, so air ransport would be seen as a priority now, surely?
 
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