Royal Australian Air Force [RAAF] News, Discussions and Updates

StingrayOZ

Super Moderator
Staff member
If they needed to take heavier loads and need to refuel would they just use KC-30A?
Maybe.

Skytraders operates a A319 to Antarctica on contract (~25 per summer, they also operate 2 c-212 for intra antarctic lift). So really there is nothing that a A330 would be needed that a A319 couldn't do.

C17 can carrier more awkward loads, also do air drops if the weather is bad. Also do things that a normal contractor won't or can't be arranged in time, like emergency flights or winter flights (like with Jerri Nielsen back in 99).

All the heavy stuff comes on ship. But timely air deliveries can be critical. Medical, Morale, change staff. There have been problems with Antarctic bases, the US just made theirs alcohol free due to problems.

Also China is building a permanent run way. .Which you can see some of the points on the docs GF referenced being perternant to.

My Antarctic flights by more aircraft is important.

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2014-10/29/content_18819683.htm
 

weegee

Active Member
Indonesia to buy Su-35

So i saw this on the Flanker export thread.
Roundup: Indonesia finally confirms to purchase Sukhoi Su-35 fighter jets | GlobalPost

I was just wondering will this raise any eyebrows in the RAAF? I know that they allready have some SU-27 and 30's but by all accounts the 35 is a half decent bird.

Secondly would this decision from Indonesia come because we are sourcing the F-35? or does their defence procurement not really pay much attention to what we do?
 

Todjaeger

Potstirrer
So i saw this on the Flanker export thread.
Roundup: Indonesia finally confirms to purchase Sukhoi Su-35 fighter jets | GlobalPost

I was just wondering will this raise any eyebrows in the RAAF? I know that they allready have some SU-27 and 30's but by all accounts the 35 is a half decent bird.

Secondly would this decision from Indonesia come because we are sourcing the F-35? or does their defence procurement not really pay much attention to what we do?
Keep in mind the article mentioned not purchasing the full 16 aircraft squadron, but perhaps only 12. Also IIRC when Indonesia purchased the half-dozen Su-30MKI2 (I think it was MKI2) they were acquired without weaponry. I believe they have since been armed, but with Indonesia only purchasing replacement aircraft in very small numbers, and without them being acquired with full sets of required kit (replacement parts, weaponry, training munitions, etc.) to really be operationally useful, I see it more as Indonesia replacing, when it can and to the degree it can, aging platforms which provide needed capabilities.

Keep in mind what they are replacing, the F-5E Tiger II. While the aircraft are ~35 years old, the design itself is 40+ years old, and it was designed as a low-cost fighter for sale to US allies. It was also essentially an updated version of the F-5A, which dates from ~1959. Basically in a conflict, they would be useful vs. unarmed aircraft, but likely of limited use against modern frontline aircraft. Against something like an F-35 they would likely be little more than targets.

The other consideration is just how much the balance of power will shift by the acquisition. A dozen new fighters would likely allow Indonesia to maintain two pairs either aloft, or on hotpad/ready to launch status at best, perhaps with the ability to surge all of them. Something to keep in mind though with so few in service though, is just how much flight time will the individual pilots actually get? A skilled pilot in a less than ideal fighter can often achieve more than an inexperienced pilot can in an advanced aircraft.

With the RAAF though, it is likely that there would be a skilled pilot in an advanced aircraft, and potentially backed up by other advanced systems (Wedgetail, JORN, Vigilaire, etc.) which could make the battlespace a nightmare for potentially hostile forces. Within the region, only the USN and perhaps the RSAF could achieve the sensor footprint and degree of integration that the RAAF seems on track to achieve.
 

John Fedup

The Bunker Group
The C17's are the gifts that keep giving. How much good pr have they generated for the RAAF and Australia.
Very true and the same applies to Canada's C-17s. Frankly, one of the reasons the Cdn govt bought into the strategic lifter was the embarrassment of not being able to fly the Canadian Forces DART team and equipment in a timely manner to disaster scenes.
 

StobieWan

Super Moderator
Staff member
That's why I didn't rate the rumours of flogging off two of the RAF birds - they've been too damn useful.
 

StobieWan

Super Moderator
Staff member
It was another of the "and this un-named source claims that" <insert rumour>

Same category as the "and the MPA deal has fallen down and nothing will be bought" :)
 

John Fedup

The Bunker Group
It was another of the "and this un-named source claims that" <insert rumour>

Same category as the "and the MPA deal has fallen down and nothing will be bought" :)
...and the same sources that claimed the USAF would be buying new F-16s and F-15s instead of F-35s:eek:nfloorl:
 

swerve

Super Moderator
That's why I didn't rate the rumours of flogging off two of the RAF birds - they've been too damn useful.
And if they were going to be sold they wouldn't have featured in the future transport fleet listed last week. The SDSR said we're expanding the transport fleet, keeping C-130Js that had previously been scheduled to be retired, & will have all our C-17s in service in 2025.

It probably won't stop all the rumours, though. I expect there are still people saying we're going to sell an aircraft carrier, retire the Typhoon T1s early, & only buy 48 F-35s.
 

StobieWan

Super Moderator
Staff member
And if they were going to be sold they wouldn't have featured in the future transport fleet listed last week. The SDSR said we're expanding the transport fleet, keeping C-130Js that had previously been scheduled to be retired, & will have all our C-17s in service in 2025.

It probably won't stop all the rumours, though. I expect there are still people saying we're going to sell an aircraft carrier, retire the Typhoon T1s early, & only buy 48 F-35s.
And disband the Red Arrows, fold the SAS up and so on and so forth. There are *still* people saying now that the commitment to buy 138 F35 is a paper commitment and not reliable. I get bored with this motiveless pessimism, this insistence that an absence of proof is evidence enough to support their argument.
 

alexsa

Super Moderator
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
I haven't seen it said, but are we getting our LADS - laser airborne depth sounding on the P-8?

LADS - Laser Airborne Depth Sounder | DST Group
LADS is essntially a hdyrographic tool for mapping the depth of large areas of poorly charted (and relatively shallow) water. Fine detail of channels and safe routes still needs detailed survey.

I has been responsible for finding a number of alternative routes (that are now fully charted and marked) in the great barrier reef and torres strait.

It is portable but I don't think there would be value in fitting this to an expensive platform such as the P8.
 

jack412

Active Member
It was more the tech, rather than that unit. They have been working on it for a while.
https://fas.org/nuke/guide/usa/slbm/detection.pdf
Submerged vessels may be directly detectable by
observing how a hull absorbs or reflects blue-green
laser light (450-550 nm)6
. This response could be
used to create an image with the vessel appearing as
either a bright spot in the normal background
scattering of the ocean, or as a hole
 

gf0012-aust

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
Unlike the Indians - no MAD boom then? OR is there no MAD boom for the Indian Navy P-8s either?

P-8I Poseidon from Indian Navy - Submarine Detect & Destruction

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHGoXhbHjC0
we've discussed this before - no MAD for RAAF

its not needed with current tech advances - the Indians are fitting theirs out as they wish - ours will be in lock step with USN so as to maintain commonality and development integrity

the other issue is that MAD is also driven by the Indian ASW SOP's - they are diametrically opposite to how USN and RAAF do business as far as ASW goes
 

ASSAIL

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
Unlike the Indians - no MAD boom then? OR is there no MAD boom for the Indian Navy P-8s either?

P-8I Poseidon from Indian Navy - Submarine Detect & Destruction

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHGoXhbHjC0
The Indians have bought a very basic sensor/processing model of the P8 without al the bells and whistles to be used by the US and its closer allies Australia and now, I guess the RAF.

Most of the prosecutions and attack will be completed at high altitude with the localisation facility provided by MAD being made redundant.
Others on here can provide better updates but so far as I've read, MAD's had its day.

sorry didn't read the gf post
 
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