SouthernSky
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Photo of it conducting a VERTREP here ESPS Cantabria demonstrates her versatility | Royal Australian Navy
Royal Australian Navy Discussions and Updates
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I've totally led all astray by misreading that page, it was the F100's helo "Toro 07" and NOT Cantabria's. Mea Culpa folks.
That's OK mate - you have helped via Southernsky to uncover the truth...
Finally - the real reason the squids want the spanish to come and play with our navy:
LSCIS Kristal Moona stated that the throw off firing was the highlight of the passage through the GoA, she said after the fact 'I knew that both ships had taken all possible precautions but there was always that sense of what if? I couldn't help but squeeze the person next to me!'
JSM seems to be in a different class compared to harpoon. I don't know if they if one will directly replace the other. Although if you could fit a JSM in a VLS it would be a strong argument for moving away from Harpoon for most vessels (no more boxes!). Certainly vertical launch tubes in a next gen sub able to fire JSM would be a handy capability.
I'm pretty certain you can fit JASSM in a VLS (Abe, was it you that had a diagram of that you posted on another forum some time ago?). Given the LRASM-A is (I think) partially based on the JASSM airframe, I'd say this weapon, should it survive any budget cuts, would be a possibility for any VLS-equipped Navy looking to replace aging Harpoon stocks.
Not sure about where the Kongsberg weapon stands, it certainly looks and sounds like a winner but I think a lot depends on the direction in which the USN decides to go. Doesn't seem like Harpoon replacement is high up on the list of priorities at the moment. I wish I could find more information about the performance of the weapon, as it's gone through so many upgrades during its service life. I'd be curious to know why the Royal Navy decided to ditch Exocet in favour of the Harpoon, whether the decision was based on capability, politics, etc.
Not sure about where the Kongsberg weapon stands, it certainly looks and sounds like a winner but I think a lot depends on the direction in which the USN decides to go. Doesn't seem like Harpoon replacement is high up on the list of priorities at the moment. I wish I could find more information about the performance of the weapon, as it's gone through so many upgrades during its service life. I'd be curious to know why the Royal Navy decided to ditch Exocet in favour of the Harpoon, whether the decision was based on capability, politics, etc.
I agree. JSM seems like a much "lighter" weight weapon, (no disrespect intended to the designers - it just seems like a different class of weapon) than Harpoon.
The direction RAAF and RAN take in relation to their respective replacement anti-ship missile capability in future years is going to be very interesting. Whichever "strategic direction" ADF is given, anti-shipping capability is going to be much higher on the list of priorities than many of our allies seem to consider it...
t68
Well-Known Member
I was reading Navy news today and I came across a story about the Melbourne –Evans incident. It mainly concerned the treatment of Capt. Stevenson treatment at the inquiry in Subic Bay and here in Australia.
I read a book on this incident some time ago and how the board of inquiry was very prejudiced against Capt. Stevenson. The Defence Minister Stephen Smith has sent a written apology on his treatment at the time. the write up came with a you tube release from the USN about the incident and well worth the look on how it apportions the blame, very different from what I remember of reading the book as it appears that it also should have concerns about impartiality of the convening board of inquiry.
[nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8cK0kolfwUw"]The Melbourne-Evans Incident (released 1975) - YouTube[/nomedia]
Defence Newspapers | Navy News
I read a book on this incident some time ago and how the board of inquiry was very prejudiced against Capt. Stevenson. The Defence Minister Stephen Smith has sent a written apology on his treatment at the time. the write up came with a you tube release from the USN about the incident and well worth the look on how it apportions the blame, very different from what I remember of reading the book as it appears that it also should have concerns about impartiality of the convening board of inquiry.
[nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8cK0kolfwUw"]The Melbourne-Evans Incident (released 1975) - YouTube[/nomedia]
Defence Newspapers | Navy News
Smith is a hypocrite. He shows concern at how Stevo was treated by Admiral King with a complicit Austarlian govt concerned about the Aus/US relationship during Vietnam and yet the same political opportunism he displayed during the Bruce Kafer affair gets totally expunged! What a poor excuse for a defence advocate he is.
Capt Stevens wife wrote a book "No Case to Answer" shortly after the affair which gives a biased though fair report on the Joint Board of Inquiry in Subic
The incident remains fresh in my mind, I was Melbournes acting Quarterdeck Officer , we secured Evans back half alongside and transferred all the remaining crew.
Capt Stevens wife wrote a book "No Case to Answer" shortly after the affair which gives a biased though fair report on the Joint Board of Inquiry in Subic
The incident remains fresh in my mind, I was Melbournes acting Quarterdeck Officer , we secured Evans back half alongside and transferred all the remaining crew.
Both incidents involving Melbourne were tragedy's, but the way they were portrayed in the national media, and as you have mentioned in the Evans incident, was the typical Australian trial by "Kangaroo Court" Media crap
Still happens today, guilty even after proven innocent. Just look at the carryon when ever someone is exonerated, even when the real culprit is caught and confesses these always a know it all element that wont let it go.
Jo Stevenson also wrote another book published in 1999 titled "In the Wake". It"s a very good read - a real eye opener. Every day the BOI sat at Subic Jo Stevenson was there taking reams of notes that eventually became "In the Wake". Like Capt Stevo she was treated with the same disdain the entire time she was in Subic..
NSM/JSM have almost identical performance specs to Harpoon. As to being vertically launched there is no development plan for such. NSM is fired out of a slanted canister like Harpoon. Harpoon could be vertically launched and Boeing did an integration study for it years ago. But no one has paid for an actual VL program so it stays in canisters. Which is no big deal as they take up less space and weigh a lot less per missile than a VLS cell does. Submarine launching is an entire different thing and AFAIK the only plan is for a torpedo tube launched encapsulated version of the JSM.
JSM has a much smaller warhead than Harpoon. 125kgs v 250kgs...
Otherwise I agree they're pretty similar. I do wonder if JSM/NSM is enough of a development over what Harpoon II provides, to justify investment in it from RAN's POV?
From RAAF's POV, surely it's a lay down misere...
Blas de Lezo
Member
Just for illustration. [nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XR8s8BW_Te8"]NSM - YouTube[/nomedia]
I am sure is not needed but ......
I am sure is not needed but ......
weegee
Active Member
Spanish Armada Ship Cantabria arrives!
Hey Guys,
I came across this today:
Spanish Armada Ship Cantabria arrives in Australia | Royal Australian Navy
What are the odds of her not going home? shall we get a little bet happening? haha
Hey Guys,
I came across this today:
Spanish Armada Ship Cantabria arrives in Australia | Royal Australian Navy
What are the odds of her not going home? shall we get a little bet happening? haha
Harpoon warhead is actually 221kg but the two are not equal. NSM/JSM uses an advanced titanium warhead casing that significantly increases penetration and blast effectiveness. Especially against targets with the misfortune of being surrounded by water thanks to reactive properties.
Actually the prospect of this class of ship serving in the RAN must be pretty high.
As for this particular ship becoming HMAS Anything ... well, maybe, but I suspect not.
Only way I could see it happening is if Spain put it up for sale. Which given their current economic state may not be totally out of the question.
224kg according to the USN fact file...
:duel
Anyhoo, there's no doubt Harpoon features a 500lbs class warhead compared to a 250lbs class warhead. The JSM features a penetrating warhead design true, but so does Harpoon...
You could be right as a Memorandum of Understanding on bilateral defence cooperation was signed yesterday between Australia and Spain.
It's not a silly move and could bode well for the future.
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