European 5th Generation Fighters
- Thread starter fylr71
- Start date
Grand Danois
Entertainer
Well, I am one of those that doesn't know.Viktor said:
Stealth. What is the Russian history on very LO. Do they have any operational or flying prototype fighters with very LO? (I guess we'll see the PAK FA in the air this year
) How about stealthy UAVs/UCAVs?Sensors. Any flying prototype AESAs? I guess Russia would have proper IRST.
Engines. As I understand it, the most modern engines have the hallmark of high availability rates, reliability, ease of maintenance and fuel efficiency. There is probably more. How does the AL-41F fare in these aspects?
That would be data points.
Just curious.
Russians curently dont have any operational LO fighter or plane. Some reductions have being done on Tu-160 (with 50 percent more square area it has lower radar cross section than B-1)/ Su-35 has being experimenting with plasma stealth as well as tehnological demonstrator Mig-1.42. Even Su-47 has some stealth carateristics but all that is no where near F-22 or F-35.Grand Danois said:Well, I am one of those that doesn't know.
Stealth. What is the Russian history on very LO. Do they have any operational or flying prototype fighters with very LO? (I guess we'll see the PAK FA in the air this year
Sensors. Any flying prototype AESAs? I guess Russia would have proper IRST.
Engines. As I understand it, the most modern engines have the hallmark of high availability rates, reliability, ease of maintenance and fuel efficiency. There is probably more. How does the AL-41F fare in these aspects?
That would be data points.
Just curious.
Thre stealth will be Pak-Fa and 5th generation fighters from Mig biro.
Concerninc Russian UAV/UCAV.
For a fact I know they begin researching it as same time as US making its UAV like Tu-141 .
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tupolev_Tu-141
Modern Russian UAV are:
ALBATROS and EXPERT
RPV PCHELA-1T
REIS-D unmanned tactical aerial reconnaissance
PUSTELGA
MBVK-137 MULTIPURPOSE UNMANNED HELICOPTER COMPLEX
As for a UCAV there are non existing or have I heard any plans about deployment of any. I have seen some pictures of stealth Russian UCAV with FSW witch is said to be in advanced state of development.
At the moment Im not posting from my computer but soon I will provide you with the information about two Russian AESA radars witch are currently cometing over 5th generation fighters.
As for IRST I have heard rumors that IRST on Pak-Fa will have range of 50km.
AL-41F will be engine for Pak-Fa and it produces about same trust as F119-PW-100.
Grand Danois
Entertainer
Cool! I haven't got the time to make a good reply before early next week, but then you would also have time to post the AESA stuff.
Cheers
Cheers
Found a concept design from SAAB here. It's meant for S. korea and their KFX.
http://img389.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ksaab78xp4.jpg
http://img172.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ksaab108dh8.jpg
http://img167.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ksaab248is4.jpg
http://www.wipo.int/pctdb/en/wo.jsp?IA=SE2003000705&wo=2003098739&DISPLAY=STATUS
http://img389.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ksaab78xp4.jpg
http://img172.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ksaab108dh8.jpg
http://img167.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ksaab248is4.jpg
http://www.wipo.int/pctdb/en/wo.jsp?IA=SE2003000705&wo=2003098739&DISPLAY=STATUS
Grand Danois
Entertainer
It was something along the lines of this I was suggesting earlier. Though a tad late (does it say 2006 at the bottom of the graphics? It's a possibility as I think I have seen these before).
"Cheap" stealth and a loadout of 2 x IRIS-T and 4 X Meteor for air superiority and dirty in the A2g config. Could be that some small A2G ordnance could be fitted in the bays. Perhaps also a fuel fraction in excess of 0.3, 2 x EJ-2xx, the avionics suite from the Gripen NG and we have a winner.
Any takers? Besides perhaps Korea...
The term stealth until it is truly developed is a misnomer. To rely on a radar signal in the 21st century is utter folly. There are much better ways of tracking down a plane or any other object of substantial mass. Unless someone can truly develops a method of hiding or altering apparent mass there will never be true stealth.
Haavarla
Active Member
Keep in mind the rules of conduct in this forum.
My aircraft vs your aircraft is not very popular here, nor is it allowed.
On a general basis, we don't know cause we don't know.
The Pak-Fa program is still under deveopment and very much under the wrap by Russian Sukhoi.
And the F-22 performance is not exactly an open book eighter.
Impossible to answer your question, cause there are too many missing parameters to go by..
My aircraft vs your aircraft is not very popular here, nor is it allowed.
On a general basis, we don't know cause we don't know.
The Pak-Fa program is still under deveopment and very much under the wrap by Russian Sukhoi.
And the F-22 performance is not exactly an open book eighter.
Impossible to answer your question, cause there are too many missing parameters to go by..
Stealth depends not only on how hard you are to detect, but also on how effective the other sides' means of detection are. It's not hard to be invisible if you poke the other guys' eye out.
Again, the "eye " in the sky is not what is needed to bust stealth, If you know what to do with an object of significant mass, the rest comes easy if one is going to ask the right question.:
lol3
OpinionNoted
Banned Member
care to expand on what you mean?
spares to keep 100 in the air
but im still thinking that some will go to countries other than Russia and India
I really wonder what other countries will get 5th gen capabilities(Vietnam?N.Korea?Pakistan?Iran? the list is endless)
localhost127
Member
you need to do some research into how "5th gen" platforms integrate into the system as a whole. it's not about simply possessing the individual platforms...
Twinblade
Member
Pak-Fa will be on sale only to "friendlies" (to both India and Russia)
Vietnam : Maybe
NKorea : No
Pakistan : No
Iran : No
Venezuela : No (they may get su-35's though)
The countries which have bought Russian equipment in the past and are considered stable and safe by western standards will be offered Pak-Fa, they include :
Malaysia
Indonesia
Algeria
It may also be offered to Brazil as well.
Other than Vietnam, i don't think any country has any arms embargo imposed on them.
India and Russia are buying 250 each so that makes it 500. I don't think any country other than Brazil is in a position to buy and maintain more than a couple of squadrons of Pak-Fa.
Twinblade
Member
Not really, there may not be any Indian input as of now, but India and Russia will have the right to veto sales on both versions as a part of the deal. AFAIK India will hold 30% rights on Pak-Fa and 50% on FGFA