kirov class battle cruiser

[nevidimka]

The Kirov visited Toulon, France's navy base.


http://www.en.rian.ru/photolents/20081111/118237176.html

 

[SkolZkiy]

Ressurection =)
What do you think guys about - Russia to have 4 such ships ?? will it be useful?? =)

 

[Feanor]

Heh, it's the Nakhimov that's in refit right now. Lazarev in is reserve as of '04. The Ushakov was supposed to be scrapped. I suspect that they will reactivate the Nakhimov. Maybe the Lazarev (if funds permit). I doubt all 4 will be active again.

 

[SkolZkiy]

I am just interesting "what if?" =) 4 NBC I think it will very strong power - if armed with Granit or Vulkan =)

Lazarev is also reactivated and is getting ready to move to Sevmash for repair\modernization from FarEast where it is now.
Ushakov still is alive and most main systems are in service.

 

[Balancer]

deputy of the Russian Minister of Defence told that 2 Kirov 1144 cruisers will return to service very soon after modernization(Nahimov and Lazarev)

One will serve in the Northern Fleet (Nahimov) together with Peter the Great and the other will serve in the Pacific Fleet

i guess this cruisers will have new s400 air defence system at least and other modernization.

It is a very cheap way to strengthen Pacific fleet , especially taking into account conflict with Japan regarding South Kuril islands

 

[nevidimka]

Now thats great news. But arent those two is a very bad shape since being neglected for so long? But it will certainly increase Russian Navy's power in the short term before they reinvest on newer and modern warship.

plus it would make the northern fleet very powerfull. 1 Kutznetsov carrier + 2 Kirov battlecruisers, + ? moskva cruisers.. would make it a really powerfull fleet.

 

[Balancer]

not in a really bad shape, Nahimov is quite good , may be modernized and return to Nothern Fleet by 2012 (with new weapon systems)
Lazarev now is in the Pacific Fleet and I am not sure it can be repaired there quickly, so will need transportation

Anyway , now Russia has enough funds to modernize and preserve active this 3 Kirov Klass Cruisers (Peter the Great, Nahimov and Lazarev) + i hope will be baught 95% ready Slava klass cruiser (which stays in Ukrain now )

 

[Feanor]

The Slava-class in Ukraine will probably remain there for some time. Relations between the countries are quite bad at the moment (though with a decisive change in leadership it could be traded in exchange for forgiveness of certain debts).

 

[SkolZkiy]

More then this the first Kirov - I mean a ship KIROV is also in enough good shape - so not 3 but may be 4 Kirov
what about Slava-class ship in Ukraine - it will stay there forever. Many guys who saw it (I mean NAVY officers) wrote that it is in a very bad shape - Ukraine didn't do anything to even conserve it. So it is cheaper to build new one then to modify and repair this one

 

[Balancer]

No , Lobov (Slava klass) was inspected by the russian navy specialists . It is in a good shape and is almost ready , only need weapon systems to install.

pls read what Kasatonov told in his intervew in 2005
Âîëíîþ ìîðñêîþ… - Èíôîðìàöèÿ - ÐÓÑÑÊÎÅ ÂÎÑÊÐÅÑÅÍÈÅ


The problem is that this ship was designed for a "cold war period" and in the 90s our ministers and navy generals considered that Russia does not need ocean fleet

Nowadays , it is clear to the government that to carry out any naval operation even in peace time Russia need big ships with long time of autonomous service. (voyage of ships to Venezuela, and to Gulf of Aden proved it)

by the way first Kirov (Ushakov) will be scrapped for sure , as the were some serious with engines (construction mistakes) , and now Ushakov is not listed in the Russia navy ,

so we have 3 Kirov (1 active + 2 being mordenized) and 3 Slava (all active) + 1 Slava under construction in Ukrain

frankly speaking, not so much......

 

[Balancer]

you can see some photos of "Admiral Lobov" (Ukrain) cruiser
Sevastopol.info • ???????? ???? - ??? ??????? ( ????????? ? ??????? )

 

[nevidimka]

So what is the latest news on this? Is there a timeline given, or a said date when the overhaul will begin? Also will there be a replacement of the Granit missiles with newer type missiles?
( which would be less capable than the Granit itself )

 

[Balancer]

i guess there will be used improved P-1000 Vulkan with 700 km range

P-1000 Vulkan (3M70)
Type: Anti-ship cruise missile
Designer: Chelomey
Maximum Range: 700 km
Maximum Speed: Mach 1.7
Propulsion: Solid-propellant rocket booster + turbojet sustainer
Guidance: Command + active or passive radar terminal homing
Fire Control: Argon-KV radar + Kasatka-B SATCOM
Warhead: HE or nuclear
Platforms: Pr.675MKV, Pr.1164

 

[SkolZkiy]

Vulkan is not a replacement for Granit. It is a replacement for 1164 Bazalt P-500.
Granit is already been replacing on subs pr. 949A. But with what it is replaced that's unknown. We call it "Granit-2" or "Granit-M"

 

[Balancer]

yes i see my mistake.....

as regards Granite-M - it can be connected to the project "Bolid" with maximum range 800km , but it seems to me that specifications of this missile are classified

 

[Feanor]

Vulkan is not a replacement for Granit. It is a replacement for 1164 Bazalt P-500.
Granit is already been replacing on subs pr. 949A. But with what it is replaced that's unknown. We call it "Granit-2" or "Granit-M"

Do you have a source on the Granit replacements by any chance?

 

[nevidimka]

Is there a replacement for Granit? I thought granit is dead end? and that the replacement missile would come back to the traditional ASM, with 300km range and mach 3 speed missile?

I'm not aware of any projects to build a replacement for the granit with greater capability than itself. If there is, it sure is shrouded in mystery. Is this back to the old days of clasifying secret and deadly weapon programms?

 

[Balancer]

What can be found regarding Granite M is that its maximum range is at least 800km , max speed more 2,5M (even for granite initially max speed was 4M) , can go both high and low atitude (up to 25km attitude)......and it has armor too

but all data is classified the same as classified for ICBM RS24

 

[Salty Dog]

i guess there will be used improved P-1000 Vulkan with 700 km range

P-1000 Vulkan (3M70)
Type: Anti-ship cruise missile
Designer: Chelomey
Maximum Range: 700 km
Maximum Speed: Mach 1.7
Propulsion: Solid-propellant rocket booster + turbojet sustainer
Guidance: Command + active or passive radar terminal homing
Fire Control: Argon-KV radar + Kasatka-B SATCOM
Warhead: HE or nuclear
Platforms: Pr.675MKV, Pr.1164

Looks like P-1000 Vulkan has come and gone . . . . .

The P-1000 Vulkan was one of the most mysterious missiles in Soviet service. It was also the last Russian missile that required a submarine to surface for launch. Its existence was never discovered by NATO, despite the fact it was operational on five submarines. It was generally similar to P-500 but had titanium armor, and many of its steel parts were replaced by titanium ones. This enabled a significant decrease in launch weight. At the same time, a more powerful booster and a more powerful and more fuel-efficient sustainer turbojet engine was employed. This increased the range to about 700 km. Its development was initiated in May 1979, and it underwent tests in the mid-1980s. The P-1000 was introduced into service in about 1987. In the late 1980s, five Echo II-class submarines were modernized to accommodate the new P-1000 Vulkan system, but all five were withdrawn from service in the mid-1990s.

 

[Salty Dog]

Is there a replacement for Granit? I thought granit is dead end? and that the replacement missile would come back to the traditional ASM, with 300km range and mach 3 speed missile?

I'm not aware of any projects to build a replacement for the granit with greater capability than itself. If there is, it sure is shrouded in mystery. Is this back to the old days of clasifying secret and deadly weapon programms?

P-700/Granit would be a dead end as these are no longer manufactured.

WRT the Kirov class, I've seen some sources where the P-700/Granit may be replaced with the P-800/Oniks.