Pakistan Air Force [PAF] News and Discussions

[pramodkumarca]

J-11 is requirment of P.A.F ....
fight india with 40 years old machine ?
we know very well US not given F-16 easily .....

US is lobbying heavily to get 12 billion dollar deals (it is very secret than the india want clause in agreement that will hinder the sale of F-16 or more compliant fighter jet to PAK)

other thing is that US is annoyed by the fact that pak is try to get it hands on chines fighter jets. by time you get any chinese jet, the us will impose sanction to stop spare and other related supplies for existing F-16(iran is classic example)nfloorl:

unlike india, pakistan has no plan to build fighter jet on its own this is going to hurt than in longer run:ar15

 

[funtz]

US is lobbying heavily to get 12 billion dollar deals (it is very secret than the india want clause in agreement that will hinder the sale of F-16 or more compliant fighter jet to PAK)

other thing is that US is annoyed by the fact that pak is try to get it hands on chines fighter jets. by time you get any Chinese jet, the us will impose sanction to stop spare and other related supplies for existing F-16(iran is classic example)nfloorl:

unlike india, pakistan has no plan to build fighter jet on its own this is going to hurt than in longer run:ar15

PAF will have (or already has) a fully operational JF-17 production line, if majority of the components that can not be manufactured indigenously (avionics, weapons, engines) are sourced from China they will have a supply line for many required parts that are sanction proof (to a degree). Since PLA-AF is not inclined to induct a light fighter/bomber type into its inventory as soon as the engine becomes online i suppose they will transfer the technology to manufacture them to Pakistan, avionics and weapons are already available.

IAF is not concerned about the US military equipment and weapons grant to PAF and has no say in the relation between them.

PAF already operates planes form PRC.

A plane ihas certain capabilities, like payload, avionics, operational radius, etc. which are not dependent on where the plane is produced but on how capable they are.

 

[mysterious]

You know that the Falco is Italian?

Yup, I know its Italian. Btw, is there a UAV along the lines of Predator or Reaper in the works at NESCOM or some other defense firm in Pakistan?

 

[umair]

Like I said back in 02 and Sabre in 04, we evaled the J-10 in 2000 and now the J-10s are coming. Either the last quarter of 2009 or early 2010. These machines will be ''very different'' and much better than stock J-10s.
So good infact, that (in all probability) my sources are saying we won't be buying any more new Vipers than the 18 on order.

 

[mysterious]

Like I said back in 02 and Sabre in 04, we evaled the J-10 in 2000 and now the J-10s are coming. Either the last quarter of 2009 or early 2010. These machines will be ''very different'' and much better than stock J-10s.

So good infact, that (in all probability) my sources are saying we won't be buying any more new Vipers than the 18 on order.

Care to throw some light on the specs? What Western avionics and/or weapons suite has P.A.F selected for its version of the J-10?

Yeh I agree that given the right specifications; J-10s could eliminate any need for the extra F-16s saving PAF the money plus the political headaches that come with such purchases from the United States. Not to mention the fact that India has been given complete access to F-16 tech by Lockheed Martin - meaning, its not necessarily wise for PAF to continue wielding an aircraft about which the 'enemy' knows pretty much everything there is to know already.

 

[SABRE]

Care to throw some light on the specs? What Western avionics and/or weapons suite has P.A.F selected for its version of the J-10?

Yeh I agree that given the right specifications; J-10s could eliminate any need for the extra F-16s saving PAF the money plus the political headaches that come with such purchases from the United States. Not to mention the fact that India has been given complete access to F-16 tech by Lockheed Martin - meaning, its not necessarily wise for PAF to continue wielding an aircraft about which the 'enemy' knows pretty much everything there is to know already.

Northrop is going to produce F-16 radars in cooperation with India from second half of 2009. This could be a major concern for PAF hence the option for another 18 F-16 seems closed (as Umair predicts). We may though maintain 60-70+ F-16s - which is significantly good enough.

The avionics, specs and weapon systems for FC-20 at the moment are unknown and will remain vague untill the deal is officially unvielled (may be even after that) so all we can do is speculate. Considering the previous Mirage2000 -5 rumors and French interest in providing avionics and weapons for JF-17 I am assuming PAC might upgrade the FC-20s with French technology. However, initially these aircrafts might fly with full Chinese technology. I am also speculating increase in number of FC-20s from 36 to 40-50. Mostly they would be configuered for air-superiority role.

 

[falconlover81]

Northrop is going to produce F-16 radars in cooperation with India from second half of 2009. This could be a major concern for PAF hence the option for another 18 F-16 seems closed (as Umair predicts). We may though maintain 60-70+ F-16s - which is significantly good enough.

The avionics, specs and weapon systems for FC-20 at the moment are unknown and will remain vague untill the deal is officially unvielled (may be even after that) so all we can do is speculate. Considering the previous Mirage2000 -5 rumors and French interest in providing avionics and weapons for JF-17 I am assuming PAC might upgrade the FC-20s with French technology. However, initially these aircrafts might fly with full Chinese technology. I am also speculating increase in number of FC-20s from 36 to 40-50. Mostly they would be configuered for air-superiority role.

Sabre this is complete madness i mean 5.1 billion $ for 18 aircraft it simply dosent make any sense and as far as the avionics and weapon systems is concerned according to H khan from pakdef we "might" get M-AESA radar for our FC-20 which is jointly produced by italy and sweden and in addition we might also get 300 PL-12/SD_10 Missiles.Let me tell you that all this is mere speculation and i cant certify the truth associated with the above mentioned news.

 

[fltworthy]

They're Coming . . .

Like I said back in 02 and Sabre in 04, we evaled the J-10 in 2000 and now the J-10s are coming. Either the last quarter of 2009 or early 2010.

I have also been hearing more and more rumors to this effect. I haven't seen anything definitive in open publication, however. Perhaps Pakistan's leadership is trying to avoid adding friction to their relations with the US - at least until after the final batch of 18 F-16s has been delivered.

Considering the previous Mirage2000 -5 rumors and French interest in providing avionics and weapons for JF-17 I am assuming PAC might upgrade the FC-20s with French technology. However, initially these aircrafts might fly with full Chinese technology.

I would agree that integrating a Western avionics suite will require a fair amount of time and effort. It's not only a matter of sensors, but also of weapons integration with those sensors. This is particularly true if they want to employ an Italian or French radar - but still retain the use of Chinese-supplied PL-12 (SD-10) missiles. Early examples of the FC-20 will either have to be dedicated test articles, or they will have to incorporate a largely Chinese avionics suite.

I have always been impressed by the potential that this airframe holds. Given the right mix avionics and weapons, the FC-20 will be a formidable opponent.

I am also speculating increase in number of FC-20s from 36 to 40-50. Mostly they would be configuered for air-superiority role.

Perhaps, but it will depend on what Pakistan wants out of these aircraft. This is an airplane with equal potential in either an air-to-air or air-to-ground role.

China introduced the J-10 into service with a largely air-to-air weapons selection, and then gradually integrated the air-to-ground sensors. Given the right avionics, the J-10 should match up very well against the latest Block 52 F-16s as a multirole platform - without the need to resort to conformal fuel tanks. This airplane has the muscle to give it the sort of range and bombload that the JF-17 was never intended to match. The JF-17 and FC-20 should compliment each other nicely.

 

[SABRE]

Sabre this is complete madness i mean 5.1 billion $ for 18 aircraft it simply dosent make any sense and as far as the avionics and weapon systems is concerned according to H khan from pakdef we "might" get M-AESA radar for our FC-20 which is jointly produced by italy and sweden and in addition we might also get 300 PL-12/SD_10 Missiles.Let me tell you that all this is mere speculation and i cant certify the truth associated with the above mentioned news.

I used two words in my above post which are worth a notice i) Speculate ii) assuming. So what I have written above is my own belief and prediction so not to make any news or rumor of it.

I cannot confirm the M-AESA radar induction but SD-10/PL-12 most likely will be there.

As for the whole J-10 deal, I had word with someone and though he did not give a proper answer he seemed to be hinting towards "Yes they are coming." All I can say is wait for the President Zardari's visit to China.

 

[SABRE]

I would agree that integrating a Western avionics suite will require a fair amount of time and effort. It's not only a matter of sensors, but also of weapons integration with those sensors. This is particularly true if they want to employ an Italian or French radar - but still retain the use of Chinese-supplied PL-12 (SD-10) missiles. Early examples of the FC-20 will either have to be dedicated test articles, or they will have to incorporate a largely Chinese avionics suite.

To just give a simple answer. PAF needs a capable fighter aircraft, especially in A2A configuration, on urgent basis. Hence the J-10s which are to be given to Pakistan will be incorporated largely with Chinese avionics. Since its urgent basis there is no time to test the aircraft with Western technology. Feasibility study for incorporating western avionics and weapons will/may take place on a future date.

 

[falconlover81]

Guys you know what General Kiyani is on an official visit to Washington and some sources are already alledging that he has a long "shopping list" which includes transport as well as attack helicopters and may be some F-16's will also be on the offing in addition to talks on how to tackle Al-Qaeda in the tribal areas.
Guys will the originally planned F-16 unveiling in january take place during Gen.Kiyani's visit?

 

[tphuang]

To just give a simple answer. PAF needs a capable fighter aircraft, especially in A2A configuration, on urgent basis. Hence the J-10s which are to be given to Pakistan will be incorporated largely with Chinese avionics. Since its urgent basis there is no time to test the aircraft with Western technology. Feasibility study for incorporating western avionics and weapons will/may take place on a future date.

yep, that sounds about right to me. Especially if they are serious about getting the aircraft by 2010. As it turned out, Zardari's visit didn't yield any formal signings on this.

 

[good_old_viper]

yep, that sounds about right to me. Especially if they are serious about getting the aircraft by 2010. As it turned out, Zardari's visit didn't yield any formal signings on this.

Historically speaking, most Sino-Pak defense signatures aren't signed during high level dignitaries but later on a defense official level.

 

[mysterious]

Any updates on the production of Jf-17s? It seems like all defence related information coming out of Pakistan has dried up or simply over-taken by the media-hype around Taliban and Pakistan's WoT offensive against them.

I do know that Pakistan Airforce is using F-16s for precision attacks on Taliban bunkers, training camps, hideouts, etc; any word if Jf-17s are being put to operational use at any level; perhaps just to give the new aircraft a piece of the war?

 

[SABRE]

Any updates on the production of Jf-17s? It seems like all defence related information coming out of Pakistan has dried up or simply over-taken by the media-hype around Taliban and Pakistan's WoT offensive against them.

I do know that Pakistan Airforce is using F-16s for precision attacks on Taliban bunkers, training camps, hideouts, etc; any word if Jf-17s are being put to operational use at any level; perhaps just to give the new aircraft a piece of the war?

I think the number of JF17 has increased to 16. I haven't had a time to confirm it though.

PAF is using F-16s against Taliban. I don't think JF-17 has seen any combat yet.

 

[SURB]

any news about developmemt of jf17 block2 model and when we will get j10b?

 

[SABRE]

any news about developmemt of jf17 block2 model and when we will get j10b?

PAC has not even properly established itself on JF-17 while CAC is busy with J-10B, how do you expect them to work on JF-17 so early?

We will probably be getting FC-20 by 2014 (at the late). I can't say if its J-10B or the current version however.

 

[SURB]

PAC has not even properly established itself on JF-17 while CAC is busy with J-10B, how do you expect them to work on JF-17 so early?

We will probably be getting FC-20 by 2014 (at the late). I can't say if its J-10B or the current version however.

Just changing gears............. is anything named jxx going to exist in the near future? if the answer is yes then why not we cooperate with china in this............i mean then we would be just wasting our money on j10's.Our cooperation can follow the footsteps of indians as in case of their joint venture on pak fa stealth with Russia.IF we can't do this because of scarcity of resources then why just sticking to j10, Gripen or rafale would be a better choice???????

 

[SURB]

Can any body suggest me any site 4m which i can download video's relating AWE&CS.YOUTUBE was'nt a great help..............

 

[zeven]

Can any body suggest me any site 4m which i can download video's relating AWE&CS.YOUTUBE was'nt a great help..............

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOaxi2G0aNI]YouTube - SAAB - ERIEYE - Explained[/ame]

SAABGroups.com ?

download a "youtube" download program and gon with it.