i would guess it's probably just the painting and coating. Let's face it, the original prototype doesn't need to look beautiful, it just needs to be able to fly.
Russia to get SU-35 by 2011
- Thread starter F-15 Eagle
- Start date
Haavarla
Active Member
Agreed.
The 901 was designed to evaluate structure strenght, a new flight controller system and the 117S engine performance output.
The 902 and 903 are subject to full mission evaluation like ECM, EWE and radar performance too.
And of course a improved RCS performance.
That would imply better RAM coating, but also a more refined surface/finnish on the airframe..
Thanks
Haavarla
Active Member
Sukhoi-confirms-Su-35-deliveries-to-Russian-Air-Force-in-2011
http://www.air-attack.com/news/arti...-deliveries-to-Russian-Air-Force-in-2011.html
Lets say Russia do starts procuring the Su-35 in 2011.
Will the ballance of world air power shift in any way?
Or will it be in such small amounts that it does not have an impact at all?
Also if they export it to Venezuela and/or Brazil, how would this impact the Air power ballance of South and North Amerika Region?
Thanks
http://www.air-attack.com/news/arti...-deliveries-to-Russian-Air-Force-in-2011.html
Lets say Russia do starts procuring the Su-35 in 2011.
Will the ballance of world air power shift in any way?
Or will it be in such small amounts that it does not have an impact at all?
Also if they export it to Venezuela and/or Brazil, how would this impact the Air power ballance of South and North Amerika Region?
Thanks
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Su-35
Hi Haavarla
Venezuela will need many more fighters to become a threat to North America meaning the United States. South America is slightly different but don't see Chavez projecting power so soon.
Brazil going with the Su-35 is still has only a slim chance but crazier things have happened. Brazil's aircraft industry might be a good mixed for the Su-35? Is the Su-35 still in?
Hi Haavarla
On world air power I think it would little effect based on the number of platforms produced. 30/40 frames produced a year then training up pilots all of this takes time and Russia itself has many aircraft to replace. This is a good thing for Russia and hope there's a way to ramp up production.
Venezuela not even finished there training on their current Flankers so taking on a new type might not work out for them and also think oil prices will come into effect on this 'might be" future purchase.
Venezuela will need many more fighters to become a threat to North America meaning the United States. South America is slightly different but don't see Chavez projecting power so soon.
Brazil going with the Su-35 is still has only a slim chance but crazier things have happened. Brazil's aircraft industry might be a good mixed for the Su-35? Is the Su-35 still in?
Crusader2000
Banned Member
Just more of the same.............Nothing has been said to confirm any orders placed by the Russian Government.
nfloorl:
Crusader we have the statement of head of the VVS confirming that the Su-35BM will be bought. Typically contracts of this kinda are NOT announced. Just like the T-90A production contract with UVZ is not announced, even though it is being produced. Unless you have something of value to add please refrain restating the same thing over and over again when it was thoroughly responded to previously.
EDIT: That having been said, I would expect squadron service no earlier then 2013, IF deliveries start on schedule and move along quickly.
EDIT: That having been said, I would expect squadron service no earlier then 2013, IF deliveries start on schedule and move along quickly.
Crusader2000
Banned Member
Sorry, intentions, what we will do, promises, next year, etc. etc. etc.
I've heard them until my ears bleed..........
Sorry, nothing official in the article...........same old stuff!
BTW How many times have we hear the issue with India over the ex-Gorshokov would be resolved soon..........PLEASE! Russia has lost all credibility.:unknown
wtsimpson7
New Member
The Sukhoi Su-35 Flanker-E is about $28 million more than the Sukhoi Su-30MKI Flanker-H. These two aircraft are not much different at all. I'm sort of questioning Russia's choice to go with the more expensive aircraft, despite the MKI's similar performance, and a greatly reduced overall cost.
Price
Hi wtsimpson7
If your going by India's first contracts for the MKI those were signed many years ago I remeber India bought a batch of a new MKI a few years back. Using the price from this last batch and then adding $15/20 mil per, I think you would be in the ballpark. The non Russian devices and sub-systems to bring up the cost.
I would like read a update on how the latest batch of Flanker users are doing with their fighters?
India
Venezuela
Algeria
Malaysia
Indonesia
Did I miss anybody?
As far as maintenance issues, weapons deliveries, how many pilots trained, stuff like that I think it would be interesting.
Hi wtsimpson7
If your going by India's first contracts for the MKI those were signed many years ago I remeber India bought a batch of a new MKI a few years back. Using the price from this last batch and then adding $15/20 mil per, I think you would be in the ballpark. The non Russian devices and sub-systems to bring up the cost.
I would like read a update on how the latest batch of Flanker users are doing with their fighters?
India
Venezuela
Algeria
Malaysia
Indonesia
Did I miss anybody?
As far as maintenance issues, weapons deliveries, how many pilots trained, stuff like that I think it would be interesting.
That is just one ship and one shipyard with some tough challenges. Just a minute fraction of the Russian defense industry as a whole. Hardly a fair statement.
Wonderful. You have an opinion that you refuse to adapt to any facts that you are presented with. You're welcome to your opinion. But when you post something make an effort to add something new to the discussion instead of repeating your opinion over and over again as you did in this same thread a few pages back.
Crusader2000
Banned Member
Please, talk about calling the "kettle black"!
The fact is and has been the Su-35 has yet to be officially ordered.....All we get is every couple of months. Is another source that states someones "intent" or we will order it or start production someday, etc. etc. etc. Then nothing happens..............Been going on forever.
nfloorl:Really, kind of sounds like the ex-Gorshkov Deal doesn't it. So, until it becomes official. I will rebutt any claims that can't be substantiated.........
Crusader2000
Banned Member
The point was Russia makes a lot of claims it fails to keep..........So, pardon me. If, I would prefer "facts" instead of Russian Promises.
Haavarla
Active Member
Please, talk about calling the "kettle black"!
The fact is and has been the Su-35 has yet to be officially ordered.....All we get is every couple of months. Is another source that states someones "intent" or we will order it or start production someday, etc. etc. etc. Then nothing happens..............Been going on forever.
Really, kind of sounds like the ex-Gorshkov Deal doesn't it. So, until it becomes official. I will rebutt any claims that can't be substantiated.........
Some questions Crusader2000..
How in your mind will an official order have to look like before you to approve of it?
And can you show us some earlier Official orders
like the Su-34 or Mig-29K or Ka-52 etc etc?
Can you show us any Russian official orders,
so i can see what it looks like?
And where would i find those Official orders?
Thanks
Haavarla
Active Member
Crusader2000
Banned Member
I would be happy to see an official signing on a major Russian New Network.
Anything but the continued promises that account for nothing but hot air....:unknown
Again the Russian Government has not placed an order for Su-35's.........
Haavarla
Active Member
Ok, witch one?
There are some good Russian news network and many less good one..
Will Russia today news network suffice, or are this just hot air?
They state that deliveries will take place in 2011.
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhvNVekTYSw&feature=related"]YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.[/ame]
Can you plz show some exsisting Russian official Orders signing for all to see?Anything but the continued promises that account for nothing but hot air....:unknown
Again the Russian Government has not placed an order for Su-35's.........
I really want to see one.
You can even throw in some US order Signing from any TV or Network news, i don't think there are many..
Perhaps the Official Orders signing of millitary hardware doesn't get covered on Tv or networks news in Russia?
I've tried to find some, but i failed..
If there is any hot air here, it's your continual hopless denial of this matter..
Thanks
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1) It has not been going on forever. The 2011 date has been named and has been stuck to.Please, talk about calling the "kettle black"!
The fact is and has been the Su-35 has yet to be officially ordered.....All we get is every couple of months. Is another source that states someones "intent" or we will order it or start production someday, etc. etc. etc. Then nothing happens..............Been going on forever.
2) You don't know that it has not been officially ordered. It's been pointed out repeatedly that our (Russian) government does not typically announce contracts signed for the delivery of military equipment. Occasionally they will confirm that deliveries are taking place or have taken place. Most often nothing at all is said, and only later on I find that certain units have received new equipment.
You have nothing to rebutt. You have an opinion that's based on cursory (at best) knowledge of the Russian defence establishment. You also have a stubborn determination to ignore everything said to you. So... once again I politely ask that if you have nothing new to add, please refrain from making comments.Really, kind of sounds like the ex-Gorshkov Deal doesn't it. So, until it becomes official. I will rebutt any claims that can't be substantiated.........
We all know what your opinion is. If you have nothing else to say....
EDIT: Speak of the devil. The Mi-28N for which I also have seen no official contract has been delivered to the 487'th independent helicopter regiment. Allegedly 6 of them. A total of 47 (possibly typo, as 48 is standard regiment size) are planned for delivery. This seems to be in addition to the 4 in Torzhok.
http://lenta.ru/news/2009/04/21/chopper/
Note the pattern? No official contract. No specifics, only generalities about planned deliveries and (occasionally) confirmation of deliveries.
Haavarla
Active Member
In what output rate can we expect KNAAPO to turn out Su-35, when/if it hits
full production?
1 unit per 3 months, or is this to high?
Knaapo have others deliveries like Indonesia and Venezuela.
In 2006 and 2007 Knaapo delivered 4 units to Venexuela each year.
Is it likely that the Su-35 will have a Low prod rate outpout all the way?
How fast is Irkutsk plant prod output(Su-30..) to countrys like Malaysia and India?
And do you think there are much difference in the Su-27SM and the Su-35 systems?
And how will this affect pilot training time on Su-35?
Thanks
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Crusader2000
Banned Member
Wow, a women news reporter claiming that production will start in 2011..............Please, still no orders, signing, nothing concrete at all. Just more Russian promises....
nfloorl:nfloorl:nfloorl: