Sukhoi unveils Supercruising Su 35-1 flanker

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Scorpion82

New Member
F-15 Eagle said:
What are you talking about? The websites I gave you does have pictures of operational SU-30 and SU-35. The SU-35 is not in the Russian Nights because they do not have a distinctive paint scheme on them that the Russian Nights have.
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You nasty guy are unbelieveable. The pictures shown, some of the prototypes/pre-production aircraft with their paint schemes. Do you believe the RuAF uses these paint schemes? I requested pictures from the aircraft with board numbers which I haven't listed. I doubt you will find them, because these aircraft do not exist.

And just for you
Su-35 Russian Knights
http://www.knights.ru/2-10000000-0.shtml (picture right top)
http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/visits_pages/maks2003_files/su-35rk_01.jpg

One of the 3 production examples (watch the colour scheme)
http://www.milavia.net/aircraft/su-35/gallery/su-35_06.jpg
 
F

F-15 Eagle

New Member
Scorpion82 said:
You nasty guy are unbelieveable. The pictures shown, some of the prototypes/pre-production aircraft with their paint schemes. Do you believe the RuAF uses these paint schemes? I requested pictures from the aircraft with board numbers which I haven't listed. I doubt you will find them, because these aircraft do not exist.

And just for you
Su-35 Russian Knights
http://www.knights.ru/2-10000000-0.shtml (picture right top)
http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/visits_pages/maks2003_files/su-35rk_01.jpg

One of the 3 production examples (watch the colour scheme)
http://www.milavia.net/aircraft/su-35/gallery/su-35_06.jpg
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Those are just SU-27s. As for the paint scheme, all Russia jets have those colors, its their tradition. And how do you know those pictures are pre-production models/prototypes, what proof do you have? I know there are small numbers of Su-30 and SU-35 in service, and you have not given me a source that says they are not in service other than some pictures of SU-27's. And its not RuAF, its really VVS.
 
A

Awang se

New Member
Verified Defense Pro
That's what i'm trying to say earlier. SU-30 will probably be the last variant of SU-27 that came into operational use. SU-35/37 introduce some of the latest technological advancement, but i doubt it will see any operational use. but many of the technologies developed for SU-35 have been integrated into SU-27/30. like MKI and MKM for example, though i sometimes think that SU-30MKI were actually SU-35 disguise as 30.

i've got info that said the forward canard of the SU-30MKI was added specifically to counter the extra weight of the N011M Bars radar.
 
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Scorpion82

New Member
F-15 Eagle said:
Those are just SU-27s. As for the paint scheme, all Russia jets have those colors, its their tradition. And how do you know those pictures are pre-production models/prototypes, what proof do you have? I know there are small numbers of Su-30 and SU-35 in service, and you have not given me a source that says they are not in service other than some pictures of SU-27's. And its not RuAF, its really VVS.
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Sorry guy but this is my last reply to you, because your ignorance annoys me and before I start to get really personal I just won't reply to you anymore.

Just a last hint for you. LOOK again at the pictures in the links I gave you and look for the canards and square tipped fins. These are Su-27M aka Su-35!
That the Su-35 ended up as aerobatic aircraft for Russian Knights and the rest is flying for Sukhoi is widely aknowledge, I won't waste my time to search for the original sources just for you.
 
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Scorpion82

New Member
weasel1962 said:
There are pics of Su-30s in russian colors with bort numbers 388/389 (visited paris and singapore air shows). Eg 388...
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The 388 is in fact a stock Su-27 (look at the picture of your link) and the 389 was a Su-27UB. Don't forget about the existance of the twin seat trainer;)

Also 501 & 502 pics are also pretty common but not sure if these remain in Russian service. Understand 503 and 504 were delivered to China.
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The 500 series were in fact Su-30MKK prototypes/pre-production aircraft. Some of these aircraft are still flying for Sukhoi and were used as Su-30MK2 test beds. The 503 was in fact not delivered to China but is currently used for testing the Irbis radar for the new Su-35.

There is also a pic of the Su-30KN with 302 (c/n 1010302). This could have gone to the IAF...
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The board number 302 was the Su-30KN prototype built from RuAF board number 53. The RuAF originally planned to upgrade their dirty hand full to that standard along with some Su-27UB, but eventually decided to go for the Su-27SM upgrade. I don't know about the status of the 302, but it was definitely not delivered to India.

btw, you'll get to see a lot of 01-06, 597/603 pics as well (these are of course 51-56 series).
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The 01 & 06 were the first Su-30MKI prototypes. The 01 was in fact converted from the RuAF board number 56. Sukhoi additionally built the Su-30MKI pre-production aircraft 04 & 05 which are now used as testbeds for the Su-30MKM & MKA.
The 603 was the original Su-30MK demonstrator and was converted from one of the 2 Su-30 prototypes, which were built in the late 80's.
The 597 was one of 2 Su-30 preproduction examples which passed the flight acceptance tests and was handed over to the Test Pilot Aerobatics Team of Anatoly Kvotchur after completing their tests. I'm not completely sure if the second example was handed over as well as 596 or 598, but I mean to remember both aircraft were delivered to the Aerobatics Team.

There is also this interesting pic of a 67 in 2006...
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That is indeed the only board number I don't know about. It seems to be a Russian Knights aircraft. Might be that this is the former 302 or one of the Test Pilot Aerobatics Team examples decribed above.

greets Scorpion
 
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onslaught

New Member
F-15 Eagle said:
Those are just SU-27s. As for the paint scheme, all Russia jets have those colors, its their tradition. And how do you know those pictures are pre-production models/prototypes, what proof do you have? I know there are small numbers of Su-30 and SU-35 in service, and you have not given me a source that says they are not in service other than some pictures of SU-27's. And its not RuAF, its really VVS.
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I actually brought up this issue in another thread where I thought Su-35's were in service. In fact, I even gave that thread the same website that said that 12 Su-35's were "in service". Since trying to find that thread might be a pain, this is what I learned. First of all, The old Su-35 (Su-27M) didn't enter service but the Russians started another upgrade program (Su-27SM). The Su-27SM took features from the Su-30MKK but with some better Russian electronics (if I remember correctly). I even found an article that said that the Su-27SM could be considered as something like 4+ or even 5th generation (I highly doubt the 5th generation descrition). Anyway, I think this site will clear up a lot of issues.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/russia/su-35.htm
 
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eaf-f16

New Member
onslaught said:
I actually brought up this issue in another thread where I thought Su-35's were in service. In fact, I even gave that thread the same website that said that 12 Su-35's were "in service". Since trying to find that thread might be a pain, this is what I learned. First of all, The old Su-35 (Su-27M) didn't enter service but the Russians started another upgrade program (Su-27SM). The Su-27SM took features from the Su-30MKK but with some better Russian electronics (if I remember correctly). I even found an article that said that the Su-27SM could be considered as something like 4+ or even 5th generation (I highly doubt the 5th generation descrition). Anyway, I think this site will clear up a lot of issues.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/russia/su-35.htm
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Yeah, I'm going to look more into Russia's upgrade program for their Flanker fleet. I wonder if it's going to be like China's J-11B. Anybody have any info on this?
 
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qwerty223

New Member
Don't know who to quote as the thread is quite long, but SU-35 is not ONLY for export. Like what the Russian from the pass had been practicing, it is a multipurpose development. The most important purpose IMO is the practical experience gain from operating the system developed from the new concept. These experience play a very important role in the Russian style of tech development. Anyhow, Russian is quite lack back in the AF assets, with the rise of their interest in regain military power, I see positive future of the SU-35. According to my prediction, at least 40~60 samples will be introduce before the PAK-FA come into service.

eaf-f16 said:
Yeah, I'm going to look more into Russia's upgrade program for their Flanker fleet. I wonder if it's going to be like China's J-11B. Anybody have any info on this?
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J-11B is a Chinese development, and for the present time, SU-35 is obviously heading for a far more sophisticate stage, in other words, it is no where near a J-11B
 
F

F-15 Eagle

New Member
onslaught said:
I actually brought up this issue in another thread where I thought Su-35's were in service. In fact, I even gave that thread the same website that said that 12 Su-35's were "in service". Since trying to find that thread might be a pain, this is what I learned. First of all, The old Su-35 (Su-27M) didn't enter service but the Russians started another upgrade program (Su-27SM). The Su-27SM took features from the Su-30MKK but with some better Russian electronics (if I remember correctly). I even found an article that said that the Su-27SM could be considered as something like 4+ or even 5th generation (I highly doubt the 5th generation description). Anyway, I think this site will clear up a lot of issues.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/russia/su-35.htm
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It said the financial crisis meant that the SU-35 was not built in large numbers, only 15 were built, so i take it those 15 are in service...right?
 
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Scorpion82

New Member
F-15 Eagle said:
It said the financial crisis meant that the SU-35 was not built in large numbers, only 15 were built, so i take it those 15 are in service...right?
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Unbelieveable have you read anything I posted before and if yes have you understand it? I suppose not. This question is almost a brashness after I tipped my fingers wound:lul
 
T

tphuang

Super Moderator
F-15 Eagle said:
It said the financial crisis meant that the SU-35 was not built in large numbers, only 15 were built, so i take it those 15 are in service...right?
Click to expand...
For the last time, they are not in service anywhere.

Yeah, I'm going to look more into Russia's upgrade program for their Flanker fleet. I wonder if it's going to be like China's J-11B. Anybody have any info on this?
Click to expand...
J-11B is not an upgrade program. It's a brand new fighter.

Don't know who to quote as the thread is quite long, but SU-35 is not ONLY for export. Like what the Russian from the pass had been practicing, it is a multipurpose development. The most important purpose IMO is the practical experience gain from operating the system developed from the new concept. These experience play a very important role in the Russian style of tech development. Anyhow, Russian is quite lack back in the AF assets, with the rise of their interest in regain military power, I see positive future of the SU-35. According to my prediction, at least 40~60 samples will be introduce before the PAK-FA come into service.
Click to expand...
RuAF already committed all of their money into su-34 and upgrade programs for su-27, there is simply no money left for su-35.

J-11B is a Chinese development, and for the present time, SU-35 is obviously heading for a far more sophisticate stage, in other words, it is no where near a J-11B
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what makes you think su-35 when it comes out will be better than J-11B?

That's what i'm trying to say earlier. SU-30 will probably be the last variant of SU-27 that came into operational use. SU-35/37 introduce some of the latest technological advancement, but i doubt it will see any operational use. but many of the technologies developed for SU-35 have been integrated into SU-27/30. like MKI and MKM for example, though i sometimes think that SU-30MKI were actually SU-35 disguise as 30.

i've got info that said the forward canard of the SU-30MKI was added specifically to counter the extra weight of the N011M Bars radar.
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one is a knaapo product and the other is an iapo product. airframe is different, engine has far more thrust, uses 3D TVC, has an all-digital cockpit and a more advanced radar.
 
O

onslaught

New Member
F-15 Eagle said:
It said the financial crisis meant that the SU-35 was not built in large numbers, only 15 were built, so i take it those 15 are in service...right?
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Right now, I think the Russians' biggest goal is the PAK FA. The Su-47 and the MiG-1.44 were technology demonstrators that tested the technology that will be put onto the PAK FA. An Su-35 could be used as a tech demonstrator too (kinda like the MiG-29OVT). You can also check out: http://www.vectorsite.net/avsu27_2.html#m3
I'll put it another way, the Su-35 is a pretty advanced bird, but against the F-22, the PAK FA seems to have more promise (not to mention more funding from India). The Russians really need to focus their efforts on PAK FA if they want to get its first flight by 2009, which is what they planned. The Su-27M (Su-35) was a huge step up from the older Su-27's and I guess the Russians were unsure if they could pull it off. The Su-27SM isn't as big a step up but it's still a substantial upgrade. I believe though, that the bottom line is PAK FA.
 
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qwerty223

New Member
tphuang said:
RuAF already committed all of their money into su-34 and upgrade programs for su-27, there is simply no money left for su-35.
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I dont see any reason the russian will back of for SU-35 if they were to practice as they said: to regain military power. Take navy for example, old subs are due to scarp with no fund allocated, but new subs and SLBM are coming up rapidly. note that each sub is worth a sqd of fighter.

The fact is they are building new SU-34 not upgrading them. Anyhow, they are both different assets that cannot replace each other, hence and allocate will not overlap each other. When upgrading the S/SMs are not the option to go as these airframe could had been 25~30years old given time at 2012, new airframe with SU-35 standard which actually is a SU-35 will be accepted into service.
 
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