Sukhoi unveils Supercruising Su 35-1 flanker

[tphuang]

SDF, the forum, not the site. oh man,
this an article from HKB (aerospace daily in China) from September 14th

沈飞开足马力生产“重点型号”

　来源: 中国航空报　


　　核心提示：在距离年底不足150天的关键时刻，一航沈飞召开了“双创双高”攻坚决战动员大会，，动员全 体干部员工进一步认清公司科研生产形势任务，统一思想，振奋精神，全力以赴投身到军民机科研生产攻坚决战中 ，确保全年生产任务按时完成。

中国航空报9月14日报道 在距离年底不足150天的关键时刻，一航沈飞召开了“双创双高”攻坚决战动员大会，动员全体干部员工进一步 认清公司科研生产形势任务，统一思想，振奋精神，全力以赴投身到军民机科研生产攻坚决战中，确保全年生产任 务按时完成。
今年是一航沈飞军民机科研生产转型之年，主导产品更新转型，大量新技术、新材料运用到新产品上，给生产组织带来很大难度。同时，今年又是一航沈飞“爬坡” 之年，各型号飞机生产任务高度交叉，军民机科研生产面临前所未有的压力，既要完成新机研制任务又要形成稳定 的批生产能力。
面对繁重的军民机科研生产任务，一航沈飞采取了有力措施，及时召开攻坚决战动员大会，从建设现代化国防的全局出发、从企业发展的战略高度，着眼国内外军机、民机发展形势，向全公司干部员工讲清完成全年型号任务的重要性和必要性。公司党委书记罗阳说：“沈飞公司所承担的是国家重点型号任务，产品不仅要性能先进，而且要安全可靠。我们必须采取一切有效措施，确保完成全年生产任务。”
资料图：国产歼11B战机后视特写一航沈飞从年初开始就按照李方勇总经理要求对生产管理模式进行改革，由过去的直线职能式管理向项目流程型管理模式转变；通过实施项目管理，组成若干个项目团队，进一步提高管理效率、工作效率。新的生产管理模式理顺了生产流程，有效地促进了型号研制任务不断取得阶段性成果。
为攻克难关，突破生产“瓶颈”，一航沈飞从年初开始就在承担军民机型号研制任务的关键单位全面开展了“创优秀团队，高效率推进；创优质共产党员工程，高质量交付”专项竞赛活动。上半年，“双创双高”专项竞赛共攻克关键项目201项，有力地推动了全年任务顺利进行。据统计，上半年一航沈飞工业总产值较去年同期相比增长了 74.2%。
下半年，一航沈飞将紧紧抓住零件生产、成品配套、技术处理等科研生产重点和关键，集中优势资源重点突破。在 “双创双高”攻坚决战动员会上，公司与14家承担重点型号研制任务的关键单位签订了责任状，涉及关键项目1 211项。
各基层单位按照一航沈飞提出的攻坚决战要求，采取多项措施，加强生产组织管理。数控加工厂成立了联合工作组，着重解决在生产组织、技术协调、设备能力、产品质量等方面存在的问题，提高关键项目生产能力和交付速率。承担军机总装任务的生产厂进一步加强科学管理，深入挖掘潜能，合理调配生产工艺流程，在保证质量和生产安全前提下，实施大范围的交叉作业和平行作业，有效缩短生产周期。
在决战决胜的关键时刻，一航沈飞要求领导干部深入一线，工程技术人员深入现场，运用精益思想和原则纠错防错 ，提高处理技术问题的能力和速度；要求承担设备维修的单位全方位加强设备维护和管理，保证设备完好率、使用 率，提高生产效率。
此外，一航沈飞狠抓基础管理工作，要求各单位要大力开展班组建设工作，通过培养人、塑造人，进一步激励广大 干部员工奋力拼搏的干劲和热情，创造非凡的工作业绩，为完成重点型号任务贡献力量。
一航沈飞进一步加强与驻厂军代表的协作，紧密配合、协同工作，共同为完成重点型号研制任务努力 奋斗。

the bold part "同时，今年又是一航沈飞“爬坡” 之年，各型号飞机生产任务高度交叉，军民机科研生产面临前所未有的压力，既要完成新机研制任务又要形成稳定 的批生产能力。" said that this year is SAC's hill climbing year, each major type of aircraft's production task has high degree of difficulties. military and civilian aircraft development and production faces a lot of pressure. They had to finish the new fighter's development and achieve stable mass production capability.
And the new fighter is talking about J-11B, it had a photo of J-11B in the article. It also explains about how mass production is reached with J-11B. Do you want the WS-10A articles on it reaching mass production and finally equipping J-10s? I already posted all of this in different threads in sinodefenceforum.

 

[sunjerem]

J-11B is based on the Su-27 AKA J-11 licensed-produced in China. It is not in production and neither are the engines.

 

[qwerty223]

SDF, the forum, not the site. oh man,
this an article from HKB (aerospace daily in China) from September 14th

the bold part "同时，今年又是一航沈飞“爬坡” 之年，各型号飞机生产任务高度交叉，军民机科研生产面临前所未有的压力，既要完成新机研制任务又要形成稳定 的批生产能力。" said that this year is SAC's hill climbing year, each major type of aircraft's production task has high degree of difficulties. military and civilian aircraft development and production faces a lot of pressure. They had to finish the new fighter's development and achieve stable mass production capability.
And the new fighter is talking about J-11B, it had a photo of J-11B in the article. It also explains about how mass production is reached with J-11B. Do you want the WS-10A articles on it reaching mass production and finally equipping J-10s? I already posted all of this in different threads in sinodefenceforum.

Yes, i m not a member of the forum, but i have the confidence that in any case, any responsible source will not state J-11B is indeed operational. While the article...

Well, its a typical CPC propaganda style of writing. Without any solid statement but cutting both ends through whole article. If noticed the title says "SAC boost to produce pivotal model"., however the article actually emphasized how fellow SAC employees pull together to conquer the last and critical breakthrough. In contrast the very end of the article: 共同为完成重点型号研制任务努力 奋斗 (Join (our) effort to complete the key task mission), with the title, clearly shown the writer's intent is not to deliver credible message as a professional instead building a platform to credit the CPC.

As for the paragraph you quote above, its says SAC is facing multiple manufacturing task for various model of aircrafts, after a comma, it clearly stated: balance of both task, to complete development for new model and to maintain a well product line. Not to mention, the "new model" above may well be the ARJ21 which rolled out on 21st December. The manufacture tasks may also be the Dreamliner contract, the already exits Airbus parts contract together with other regular part supply for the PLAAF.

And do read my post carefully, as i respect you in the same way. I did said if you were to include experimental airframes to the "operational" scope, SU-35 senior had already been in service for almost one decade, as a 90s project to have at least 90% efficiency of the planned J-11B.

 

[tphuang]

J-11B is based on the Su-27 AKA J-11 licensed-produced in China. It is not in production and neither are the engines.

WS-10A is in mass production. Actually, this is avic1's report from yesterday. Kind of like year end summary.
http://www.avic1.com.cn/chinese/xwzx/detail/20071228_4.htm
It talks about production and product support for both WS-10A series and WP-14 series.
And J-11B stuff is already posted.

Yes, i m not a member of the forum, but i have the confidence that in any case, any responsible source will not state J-11B is indeed operational. While the article...

Well, its a typical CPC propaganda style of writing. Without any solid statement but cutting both ends through whole article. If noticed the title says "SAC boost to produce pivotal model"., however the article actually emphasized how fellow SAC employees pull together to conquer the last and critical breakthrough. In contrast the very end of the article: 共同为完成重点型号研制任务努力 奋斗 (Join (our) effort to complete the key task mission), with the title, clearly shown the writer's intent is not to deliver credible message as a professional instead building a platform to credit the CPC.

As for the paragraph you quote above, its says SAC is facing multiple manufacturing task for various model of aircrafts, after a comma, it clearly stated: balance of both task, to complete development for new model and to maintain a well product line. Not to mention, the "new model" above may well be the ARJ21 which rolled out on 21st December. The manufacture tasks may also be the Dreamliner contract, the already exits Airbus parts contract together with other regular part supply for the PLAAF.

And do read my post carefully, as i respect you in the same way. I did said if you were to include experimental airframes to the "operational" scope, SU-35 senior had already been in service for almost one decade, as a 90s project to have at least 90% efficiency of the planned J-11B.

We already explained earlier in this thread the status of su-35, I don't think I need to go on. Now for some reason, you take offense to the fact that China/SAC can produce a decent version of flankers. And started a rant against CPC, SAC and such. The article was talking about J-11B (excluding from the fact that a J-11B photo was included in the article), since the projects you mentionned does not involve final assembly at SAC. Clearly, you have a hard time believing that China's good sources would have the audacity of saying J-11B is in production. Oh btw, it helps to actually read this kind of article a lot and not just rely on google translate.

So, I suggest you read what PLA watchers find rather than relying on your out dated assumptions.

 

[qwerty223]

WS-10A is in mass production. Actually, this is avic1's report from yesterday. Kind of like year end summary.
http://www.avic1.com.cn/chinese/xwzx/detail/20071228_4.htm
It talks about production and product support for both WS-10A series and WP-14 series.
And J-11B stuff is already posted.

We already explained earlier in this thread the status of su-35, I don't think I need to go on. Now for some reason, you take offense to the fact that China/SAC can produce a decent version of flankers. And started a rant against CPC, SAC and such. The article was talking about J-11B (excluding from the fact that a J-11B photo was included in the article), since the projects you mentionned does not involve final assembly at SAC. Clearly, you have a hard time believing that China's good sources would have the audacity of saying J-11B is in production. Oh btw, it helps to actually read this kind of article a lot and not just rely on google translate.

So, I suggest you read what PLA watchers find rather than relying on your out dated assumptions.

LoL, I read Chinese at native level, need no google translator.
Nation pride is good when its doesn't effect ones judgement. As a Chinese i felt proud of the Chinese achievement and i think so far, SAC done some great jobs. And i admit that i dislike CPC, but it did not affected my judgment on the topic. From literature wise, the article in fact did not send any solid message. While other J-11B post here is either non cited or base on writing as such you post above.
Don't try to act pro on PLA related source. I know how you guys work to build up a believe. Most of the time, those with flighty minds would pick quotes from various source and patchwork them according to personal desire.
Anyways I did not assume any thing, but you did.

 

[tphuang]

LoL, I read Chinese at native level, need no google translator.
Nation pride is good when its doesn't effect ones judgement. As a Chinese i felt proud of the Chinese achievement and i think so far, SAC done some great jobs. And i admit that i dislike CPC, but it did not affected my judgment on the topic. From literature wise, the article in fact did not send any solid message. While other J-11B post here is either non cited or base on writing as such you post above.
Don't try to act pro on PLA related source. I know how you guys work to build up a believe. Most of the time, those with flighty minds would pick quotes from various source and patchwork them according to personal desire.
Anyways I did not assume any thing, but you did.

lol, I only let my sources do judgment. I actually think SAC's progress on J-11 series has generally been an embarrassment. J-11B was supposed to be in service at the end of last year and now it's finally in service a year late.

So, basically you refuse to admit to this part. "同时，今年又是一航沈飞“爬坡” 之年，各型号飞机生产任务高度交叉，军民机科研生产面临前所未有的压力，既要完成新机研制任务 又要形成稳定 的批生产能力" As I mentionned before, based on the current progress of SAC, the only plane that this part could be talking about is J-11B. And it says the development will have to be finished this year and achieve stable mass production capability. And they even had a picture of J-11B in the article. I don't work hard to believe. You asked for official sources, because you thought there is no way I can come up with official source, which I did. I know there are many people who use the lack of transparency in PLAAF to try to argue for their cause. But I wish these people would just drop their case if they see some real good source. If you want more direct claim that J-11B is in service, you can check the same thread and you will see very reliable non-official sources also saying that J-11B is in service by the end of this year. But not wanting to face the truth, you will just refuse to read it.

 

[qwerty223]

lol, I only let my sources do judgment. I actually think SAC's progress on J-11 series has generally been an embarrassment. J-11B was supposed to be in service at the end of last year and now it's finally in service a year late.

So, basically you refuse to admit to this part. "同时，今年又是一航沈飞“爬坡” 之年，各型号飞机生产任务高度交叉，军民机科研生产面临前所未有的压力，既要完成新机研制任务 又要形成稳定 的批生产能力" As I mentionned before, based on the current progress of SAC, the only plane that this part could be talking about is J-11B. And it says the development will have to be finished this year and achieve stable mass production capability. And they even had a picture of J-11B in the article. I don't work hard to believe. You asked for official sources, because you thought there is no way I can come up with official source, which I did. I know there are many people who use the lack of transparency in PLAAF to try to argue for their cause. But I wish these people would just drop their case if they see some real good source. If you want more direct claim that J-11B is in service, you can check the same thread and you will see very reliable non-official sources also saying that J-11B is in service by the end of this year. But not wanting to face the truth, you will just refuse to read it.

I did said, some flighty minds would build their picture from part and piece of various article. And i did elaborate the quote above. It shows you don't even bother to read post by other and start your attack like a bull dog. It is tired to argue facts with an extreme nationalism.

Anyways, back to where it belongs, I do believe it will result a immediate and decent output if the Russian dump in all their best. The drawback they are facing now is most probably to maximize tech profit from a limited budget, which i felt they had hit the limit. Like always, compromise will soon be taken and the outcome may well on schedule but might be a little bit disappointed.

 

[tphuang]

I did said, some flighty minds would build their picture from part and piece of various article. And i did elaborate the quote above. It shows you don't even bother to read post by other and start your attack like a bull dog. It is tired to argue facts with an extreme nationalism.

Anyways, back to where it belongs, I do believe it will result a immediate and decent output if the Russian dump in all their best. The drawback they are facing now is most probably to maximize tech profit from a limited budget, which i felt they had hit the limit. Like always, compromise will soon be taken and the outcome may well on schedule but might be a little bit disappointed.

Look, it would help a lot if you can swallow your pride and hate toward CCP and just admit that WS-10A/J-11B combination is out, but then you just keep on getting off tangent. As for if the Russians can help China with their input, it certainly can't hurt. But the Russians are not going to give China their best technology. For example, they won't sell Irbis or 117S by themselves, but only as part of su-35. And frankly, China would have no interest for su-35 at this point. By the time Irbis and su-35 are ready for export delivery to China, what use would they really have? These are the things you will notice if you follow PLAAF more closely.

 

[qwerty223]

Look, it would help a lot if you can swallow your pride and hate toward CCP and just admit that WS-10A/J-11B combination is out, but then you just keep on getting off tangent. As for if the Russians can help China with their input, it certainly can't hurt. But the Russians are not going to give China their best technology. For example, they won't sell Irbis or 117S by themselves, but only as part of su-35. And frankly, China would have no interest for su-35 at this point. By the time Irbis and su-35 are ready for export delivery to China, what use would they really have? These are the things you will notice if you follow PLAAF more closely.

Please dont act like a kid, you are a MOD here. Bring it back to the topic.

 

[tphuang]

Please dont act like a kid, you are a MOD here. Bring it back to the topic.

I am simply explaining to you the current situation regarding to China and flankers. If you would like to know more, I could answer, but do not be bitter about this. After all, it's totally logical that you don't know about J-11B as well as a frequent PLA watcher does.

 

[Awang se]

i have a chat with someone from Irkuut during LIMA 2007. he said that the MKI and MKM are not heavily upgraded version of SU-30, instead it was a slightly downgraded version of SU-35.