Which Arab Country Has Strongest Military?

[fylr71]

They are in no way autonomous.
Main small arms: M-16, M-4, etc.
Main artillery system: M-109
Main fighters: F-15, F-16
Main attack helicopters: Apache, Cobra
Main transport helicopters: S-70, CH-47
Main subs: French and german
Main surface ships: US
...

Many of these systems include some kind of israeli tech in it but in the end they have a very big problem if all other countries would stop supplying them.[/QUOTE]

That list is not totally acurate. First, I never said Israel was fully autonomous I said they are self sufficient in tanks, apc/ifv, artillery, small arms. Also the main small arms in Israel is the Galil, Uzi, and Tavor. They also use the M-16 but it is being replaced by the Tavor. And in terms of artillery, although the M109 is in use, it is on its way out to be replaced by the Atmos 2000 and augmented by the indiginously produced Rascal.

 

[Scorpius]

can the Saudis defend themselves from an israeli attack?
I heard the Saudi pilots aren't that bad from some retired american serviceman.
Iran seems to be self sufficient though they are not Arabs.

 

[braveknight_ind]

red arrow, can u tell me wht was wrong exactly in my quote???
i only presented the facts of Israels victoies agains its enemy alliance inspite of being outnumbered

 

[Waylander]

I said that they ARE not autonomous.
The AR-15 variants are the most common small arms in the IDF.

Galil is available since a long time but they refused to use it because it is too expensive and cannot be produced fast enough.

You cannot really believe that Israel is able to hold its technological 1st place in the area without military aid of the US and without the ability to purchase much of their equipement elsewhere in the world.

 

[isthvan]

And that was just what i was talking about. In those previous wars, Syria, Egypt, Lebanon and Jordan only had very old and outdated russian equipment that hardly was a match for what the Israelis already had then.

Well not quite true... During 1967-1973 majority of IDF tanks were Centurions and M-51... Even if you count in M-48/60 those aren’t superior to T-62... Also F-4/ Neshers weren’t superior to Mig-21s Arabs had.
Israeli had technological superiority only during Lebanon invasion, in earlier conflicts technological level of Arab countries was sometimes above Israeli tech. level...

 

[fylr71]

Well not quite true... During 1967-1973 majority of IDF tanks were Centurions and M-51... Even if you count in M-48/60 those aren’t superior to T-62... Also F-4/ Neshers weren’t superior to Mig-21s Arabs had.
Israeli had technological superiority only during Lebanon invasion, in earlier conflicts technological level of Arab countries was sometimes above Israeli tech. level...

During the Suez War, Israel was already considered a military power in the region and had similar technologies as the Egyptians. Sice then Israel's technology has been increasing (in part due to US help) much faster then anyone of its potential enemies. Even though many of the gulf states have a techological capability similar to that of Israel, it is the training and quality of the soldiers combined with the ability to maintain there weapons as well as the constant innovations that gives Israel the best military in the middle east. Hiwever there is a qualifier. As great an army as Israel has it is really a defense force (thus the name IDF) It is very unlikely that Israel will attain (or want to attain) the ability to project power in the way that countries like the US, Britiain, and France can. Man for man the Israelis are in a class that can only be matched by the a few western contries and exceded by even fewer.

 

[contedicavour]

Yep though Israel still relies on the US for all of its air force, its navy is either US (Saar V) or German (U214), and even some of its army assets are directly off the shelf from the US (Apache for example).

cheers

 

[contedicavour]

The question is just do they have enough weapons in their stoks to deal a serious blow to Israel? Because the only scenario in which Egypt and Saudi Arabia would attack Israel would be after a islamistic revolution and the people who would take over power in such a case simply might not care much for whether they lose american support.

In such a case Russia even might pretty fast replace the USA as the big spender, speculating on replacing the USA as the big brother of the Middle East.
They might certainly not ship enough modern tanks to Egypt or Saudi Arabia for them to replace their losses in a war against Israel and the USA in real time, but they might flood them with advanced anti tank and anti aircraft weapons.

That might seem like a very grimm and unlikely scenario now, but who knows were the new lean and mean and increasingly rich Russia is going during the next 10 years and how bad the relations of "Neocon-USA" with Russia and the Arabs will become...?

Yes though we've already seen in 1967 and even more in 1973 that the most up to date Soviet/Russian weaponry wasn't enough to beat the IDF. Even if in 1973 the attack on Israel was entirely a surprise. Soviet anti-tank and anti-aircraft missiles wrecked hundreds of Israeli armour and tens of aircrafts, but at the end we all know what happened.
US support until today is THE asset that ensures who wins in an all-out war. However in guerrilla contexts the situation is soooo different ...

cheers

 

[Grand Danois]

No one has yet mentioned the difference in doctrine and its impact on outcome in these wars.

It is not all dependant on kit and intensity of training. IIRC this is also a case of Western vs Soviet approach to building, training and applying armies.

 

[contedicavour]

No one has yet mentioned the difference in doctrine and its impact on outcome in these wars.

It is not all dependant on kit and intensity of training. IIRC this is also a case of Western vs Soviet approach to building, training and applying armies.

Yes good point. If I can also add another factor, the IDF have mostly been defending, which also gives a boost to morale. Even movements in the Sinai, in the Golan heights or in Southern Lebanon can arguably be considered proactive measures in an overall defensive strategy.
Arab countries' conscript soldiers end up fighting against citizen soldiers who, rightly or wrongly, feel they are protecting their own homeland.

cheers

 

[interseptor]

The israeli Arow air defence tech is pure american fanded and is also engineerd by americans, and about the merkeva again american engineers developed it the israeli nuclear system funded by america and designed by france. It sure isn't self developed systems of israel but just funded by zionist lobyiest in washington, why does israel has so much hi tech is because to control the arabs so that the zoinist don't want pelestine to be free.

 

[Rich]

The israeli Arow air defence tech is pure american fanded and is also engineerd by americans, and about the merkeva again american engineers developed it the israeli nuclear system funded by america and designed by france. It sure isn't self developed systems of israel but just funded by zionist lobyiest in washington, why does israel has so much hi tech is because to control the arabs so that the zoinist don't want pelestine to be free.

We sell and/or give as much arms to Arab countries as we do Israel. Israel developed nuclear weapons in a cooperative agreement with South Africa, the same goes with ballistic missiles. Get your facts straight.

Its true we co-developed the ARROW system with Israel. Its a purely defensive system and who can blame the Israelis for wanting it being surrounded by Arab Dictatorships. Israel doesn't have the military means to "control the Arabs", only to defend itself. I suggest you download an English spell checker because I cant understand the rest of your post.

 

[alhaq]

Yes its true the US does sell weapons to the Arabs. However, Israel with its powerful friends in the US gets the latest equipment as well as access to state-of-the-art technology enabling it to indigenously produce yet more weapons.

The ARROW system is indeed a defensive system , however it is not the only weapons system in Israel's arsenal and as recent events have shown Israel is not shy of using them. As regards Arab Dictatorships , we all know very well the US foreign policy of propping up these regimes.

 

[contedicavour]

Yes its true the US does sell weapons to the Arabs. However, Israel with its powerful friends in the US gets the latest equipment as well as access to state-of-the-art technology enabling it to indigenously produce yet more weapons.

The ARROW system is indeed a defensive system , however it is not the only weapons system in Israel's arsenal and as recent events have shown Israel is not shy of using them. As regards Arab Dictatorships , we all know very well the US foreign policy of propping up these regimes.

I agree that while (for example) both Egypt and Israel operate hundreds of F-16s, Israeli industry has access to much more technology and can thus develop local improvements and progressively become more and more autonomous.
However the question could also be : which Arab country's aerospace industry is developed enough to participate in US arms programmes ?

cheers

 

[atilla]

arab goverments dıd learn some lessons ın last decates ın terms of army.
that could be the maın reason whıch most of them ıs usıng same equıpment
ıt ıs ımportant to have sımılar weapons ıf they wıll move together ın future.
saudı arabıa usıng maınly Us and englısh equıpment. Turkey ıs on way to produce 100% turkısh made weapons ın all fıelds.Future ın the regıon we could see more know how or cooperatıon between russıa egypt ıran and probly france or germany .
Iran has learned a lot from ıraq war the need of traıned and educated hıgh rankıng

Turkey has close tıes whıth ısrael ın terms of weapon producıng but planıng to cut down ıts land forces ın terms of number ınthe regıon turkey has the best maıntaıned and largest and qualıfed personel ın all bases

then as an arab state egypt probly but kep ın mınd the founder of modern egypt was a mınester who has educated ın enderun(place school use to be ın ıstanbul) so there mıght be close relatıons ın terms of need ın the future ??????????

ı thınk when ıt comes to ısrael they know they dont have luxery to lose agınst states whıch ıs surruındıng them .
but they are producıng good tech . but ın terms of man force realy unmatch to ıts rıvals
good maıntaıned army good equıpment

If there wıll be an unıted counter attack by arab states to ısrael
ısrael thıs tıme wont be able to stop maybe could use chemıcal and nukes ıf needed.and counter could come from non arab whıch ıs IRAn

 

[Gerasimos]

My opinion is that as far as diplomacy is concerned in this period of time Turkey is in the most difficult position.The country is a member of NATO,is trying to enter E.U,is having good relations with Israel,with the U.S.A,but it is a muslim country,I'm interested to see how will Turkey keep balance of its double role in the next years.

 

[atilla]

My opinion is that as far as diplomacy is concerned in this period of time Turkey is in the most difficult position.The country is a member of NATO,is trying to enter E.U,is having good relations with Israel,with the U.S.A,but it is a muslim country,I'm interested to see how will Turkey keep balance of its double role in the next years.

I thınk turkey wıll try to be out any sutıatıon ın mıd east exept north IRAQ. USA and turkey ıs not havıng good relatıons ın my opınıon but ın the regıon Iran and turkey ıs havıng same concerns about ıraq

And yes turkey ıs trıng to enter EU but thıs wont affect turkıes maın dıplomacy ın the regıon so far ı can see.

but thıs could brıng balance abıt dıfferent and hopefully ıf turkey could settle ıts problem ın cyprus then wıll be more flexable because of securıng ıts west border and To the nato ı dont thınk nato ıs useful and havıng ımportant role ın the regıon..?????

the regıon needs peace more than before ın terms of economy and ın terms of trade . ıf peace could happen lots of good thıngs can be done ın future whıth out US or EU s assıstance or intrefferıng

 

[Scorpius]

Turks are now less concerned about EU membership.some military officers are more concerned about having a high place in NATO.

 

[Gerasimos]

Yes but imagine what a great step for Turkey is to join E.U,imagine the benefits it will get,economical and political.Also it will be a good decision for E.U,because it will show the world that E.U is not just a club of countries having the same faith(you understand what I mean),but a group of countries having the same vision for future for prosperity for peace.

 

[Waylander]

I can live with the thinking of some people that the EU is just a club for christians (I am not religious) if our economy works better than with new members.
I think EU is still expanding too fast.