RubiconNZ
The Wanderer
What a fuss it caused, speculation was rampant of a new arms race etc etc, uh the good old days
Russia to Deliver Su-33 Fighters to China
- Thread starter kams
- Start date
contedicavour
New Member
Looking for a justification to secure main gate approval for the Queen Elizabeth carriersWhat a fuss it caused, speculation was rampant of a new arms race etc etc, uh the good old days
?cheers
i never said that aircraft carriers are built in a sheltered dry dock ,i just implied that they are different from merchant tankers,but the merchant tankers can be modified for use as aircraft carriers.the modern ship building trend is that they built modules or sections of a vessel in different plants(facilities) and then send them to a dockyard for integration,this is known as modular construction.
It doesnt matter where it is built it is going to be built, news of it will spill out. Any ways, you can built a carrier in segments and then combine it later.
Whatever the case, the purchase of Su-33 is a manifest of china's dedication to its aircraft carrier project. Weather it will be made from that old russian carrier or a completely new domestic project, tat is completely pure speculation. I suspect with the continueing repairs and stuff on the Varyag, its flight deck will at least be operational.
News reports China will base their own domestic carrier fighter on the Su-33. Will that be like a navalized version of j-11, a twin engine version of J-10 or completely new fighter.
any guesses or specualtions ?
Whatever the case, the purchase of Su-33 is a manifest of china's dedication to its aircraft carrier project. Weather it will be made from that old russian carrier or a completely new domestic project, tat is completely pure speculation. I suspect with the continueing repairs and stuff on the Varyag, its flight deck will at least be operational.
News reports China will base their own domestic carrier fighter on the Su-33. Will that be like a navalized version of j-11, a twin engine version of J-10 or completely new fighter.
any guesses or specualtions ?
My guess would be somethign entirely new, probably with SU-33 influences.
A redesigned J-10 would be a nightmare to do, anyone remember the fiasco with the Phantoms redesigned for RR engines? It could be done but a dedicated design would probably be easier. Has there ever been a delta carrier-launched aircraft? Seems a very inefficient system for STOL aircraft (mind you, if the Gripen can do it it's possible the J-10 could too).
A redesigned J-10 would be a nightmare to do, anyone remember the fiasco with the Phantoms redesigned for RR engines? It could be done but a dedicated design would probably be easier. Has there ever been a delta carrier-launched aircraft? Seems a very inefficient system for STOL aircraft (mind you, if the Gripen can do it it's possible the J-10 could too).
Delta are not good for carriers because of their inherent qualities.
Deltas generally require high takeoff and landing speeds, and long runaways. These are low aspect wing ratio planes where the lift is not efficient at lower speeds.
Having canards somehow makes up for that though, but a naval J-10 would require TVC at least. But then again, that may have been among the considerations for obtaining the TVC AL-31FN for the J-10 with the Klimov designed nozzle used on the MiG-29OVT.
Deltas generally require high takeoff and landing speeds, and long runaways. These are low aspect wing ratio planes where the lift is not efficient at lower speeds.
Having canards somehow makes up for that though, but a naval J-10 would require TVC at least. But then again, that may have been among the considerations for obtaining the TVC AL-31FN for the J-10 with the Klimov designed nozzle used on the MiG-29OVT.
Scorpion82
New Member
Crobato,
the Rafale is indeed a very good carrier capable aircraft and it does not need TVC to be it.
the Rafale is indeed a very good carrier capable aircraft and it does not need TVC to be it.
One of the best carrier aircraft ever made is in fact a hybrid delta. ie the Scooter.
long launch runs are academic if you are using a catapult. STOBAR carriers restrict the opportunity to look at a wider variety of aircraft.
you lose more real estate to runway length and hence a decidedly greater intrusion on avail real estate for the parking apron. hence its harder to queue up aircraft for the launch cycle.
hey Gary, have you guys noticed any movement on Varyag lately to indicate that more preparation are done toward eventually commissioning the ship? I guess a different way to say is "have the Chinese been trying out new stuff on Varyag?"
I think the unqual assumption to date is that she will be activated within 18months to 2 years - depending on how they elect to resolve the engine issues.
What do you think that Japan will do to counter this potential future threat.
Japan already has a counter to it in the form of the Oyashios. They are one of the best submarines in the world. They can dive deeper than any other conventional and can outdive some nukes. They're certainly the best sub by a golden mile in eastern and south eastern asia. The 2nd iteration of the class will be significant.
I'm also more than curious to see how much more prodding it takes before Japan does her own development on torpedoes and naval cruise missiles.
Precisely speaking, Varyag is china's counter measure to what Japan already got. China could not match what Japan's Self Defence force has put on table and at least for the next 5-10 years it will still be the case.
If you don't this into your consideration, you may find it strange about what PLAN is going to do in the next 5-10 years. To them, they are still covering gaps that they ought to do long time ago.
their planned future cruisers are actually more or less hybrid STOVL carriers.
they will travel their own power path - and a lot sooner than prev planned IMV. North Korea has changed their attitude
japan, south korea, aus are all get hybrids ships for there navys are they any other nations in that region planing on doing the same
Agreed - China is really not happy with North Korea right now.
In a way, if Varyag is placed in South Sea fleet, which is what I personally expect, it won't be aimed directly at Japan. But if it's placed in North Sea Fleet, then that's different.
the 13500 tonne DDH that is currently under construction, how many stovl fighters like say (F-35) would it be able to carry?
What type of aircraft will they carry.