Royal New Zealand Air Force

[kiwipatriot69]

Spea

Some local news, ground work has started at Ohakea for the P8 facilities. On saturday the Deer Spitfire spent some time flying around town, over the Marton park, waggling it's wings and sounding delightful. I don't know the reason but enjoyed the show.

Speaking of local news, is there any media coverage of defence force involvement at White Island Volcano disaster? I suppose it wouldn't be safe to be sending recovery teams now due to hot ash and a possible further eruption.

 

[ngatimozart]

Speaking of local news, is there any media coverage of defence force involvement at White Island Volcano disaster? I suppose it wouldn't be safe to be sending recovery teams now due to hot ash and a possible further eruption.

Just mentions of an Orion recce mission, NH90 & OPV deployment. No imagery. Difficult to state when recover ops will start, although the alert status for the volcano was reduced from 4 to 3. From the video shown on media, a pyroclastic flow flowed down the external flanks of the crater. Any living thing caught up in those don't stand a chance.

 

[kiwipatriot69]

Just mentions of an Orion recce mission, NH90 & OPV deployment. No imagery. Difficult to state when recover ops will start, although the alert status for the volcano was reduced from 4 to 3. From the video shown on media, a pyroclastic flow flowed down the external flanks of the crater. Any living thing caught up in those don't stand a chance.

It seems pretty insane to me having tours on a active volcano in the first place.Given its not the first there either.

 

[ngatimozart]

It seems pretty insane to me having tours on a active volcano in the first place.Given its not the first there either.

That's a decision for other people to make and that will come out in due course through the resulting enquiries. If you take your argument to its logical conclusion then that's everything in the Taupo Volcanic Zone and the Auckland volcanic field off limits. Just because the last eruption in Auckland was Rangi2tos went bang 500 years ago, doesn't mean that the field is dead quiet, and we can forget about it. It never sleeps and Ngauruhoe, Ruapehu, and Tongariro are part of the same zone. From memory, Ruapehu was the last one to blow its stack in 2007. Taupo is a supervolcano and arguably the most dangerous volcano in the world and when it really blows its stack, it has serious global impacts. It's up there with Tambora and Yellowstone. I would posit that if two of those volcanoes had full size eruptions within a decade of each other, they would most likely would create an extinction level event; if all three were to have full size eruptions within a decade, then all life on earth would cease. From memory there are 8 supervolcanoes and Taupo, Tambora and Yellowstone are IIRC, in the top 4. We live in one of the most geologically active countries in the world and volcanics are just one natural hazard that we have to learn to live with and adapt too.

 

[MrConservative]

It seems pretty insane to me having tours on a active volcano in the first place.Given its not the first there either.

Thousands go skiing each day on Mount Ruapehu during the winter as well. About 25 years ago it went off one Sunday afternoon as the lifts were closing. Closed down a lot of domestic flights around the central North Island for a few days due to the dust plume. Skiers back up the mountain a couple of weeks later.

 

[ngatimozart]

Am I right in thinking the MRTT (RAAF ones at least) don't have the strengthened floor so can't carry pallets on the main deck? Seating & tanking equipment space only on main deck?

I believe so.

 

[ASSAIL]

Am I right in thinking the MRTT (RAAF ones at least) don't have the strengthened floor so can't carry pallets on the main deck? Seating & tanking equipment space only on main deck?

I have no idea mate? Maybe some moustachioed light blue chappie knows that answer.

 

[pussertas]

I have no idea mate? Maybe some moustachioed light blue chappie knows that answer.

AFAIK the RAAF purchased its MRTT prior to Airbus upgrading the floor & enabling the carrying of pallets

The RAAF have announced plans to have the floor ungraded at some future date,

 

[John Newman]

Am I right in thinking the MRTT (RAAF ones at least) don't have the strengthened floor so can't carry pallets on the main deck? Seating & tanking equipment space only on main deck?

My understanding is that all KC-30A/A330 MRTTs are manufactured from the standard passenger version of the A330-200, eg, they do not have a large cargo access door to the main deck. Regardless of strengthened floor or not, they do not have the ability to load large cargo pallets on that main deck.

If I remember correctly, a few years ago when France announced it's procurement plan for 15 MRTTs, it was mentioned that the last two or three would have a large main deck cargo door fitted (possibly that meant using the A330-200F freighter version??). I haven't seen any further reports since then.

And if I also remember correctly the failed Airbus KC-45A bid was to be based on the A330-200F freighter version.

Basically the main difference between Airbus KC-30A and Boeing KC-46A, is that one is based on a passenger airframe and the other is based on a freighter airframe.

The question is, beyond tanker ability and below main deck cargo capability, is your main deck priority large cargo pallets or passengers?

Cheers,

 

[ASSAIL]

The question is, beyond tanker ability and below main deck cargo capability, is your main deck priority large cargo pallets or passengers?

Cheers,

I would think that’s the exact question which will be considered by the RNZAF and the answer should be passengers.
They are covered by the C130 -J purchase complimented by the main deck cargo capacity of the A330s but still bare on personnel movement with the demise of the B757’s

 

[KiwiRob]

Thousands go skiing each day on Mount Ruapehu during the winter as well. About 25 years ago it went off one Sunday afternoon as the lifts were closing. Closed down a lot of domestic flights around the central North Island for a few days due to the dust plume. Skiers back up the mountain a couple of weeks later.

That was in 1996, I was on the mountain that day, and had been skiing where the lahar flowed 30 minute prior, my mates and I were down by the Chateau when she erupted.

 

[ngatimozart]

That was in 1996, I was on the mountain that day, and had been skiing where the lahar flowed 30 minute prior, my mates and I were down by the Chateau when she erupted.

Timing eh!!! You and your cobbers were very lucky. Did you go buy a lotto ticket later?

 

[Oberon]

Am I right in thinking the MRTT (RAAF ones at least) don't have the strengthened floor so can't carry pallets on the main deck? Seating & tanking equipment space only on main deck?

Basically, the requirement was mitigated when Australia purchased C-17s

 

[Gibbo]

Basically, the requirement was mitigated when Australia purchased C-17s

Yes true, good point that I hadn't twigged to! The ability to do combi pax + a few pallets, esp. AME setup, sounds the best for RNZAF... I'd hope the RNZAF can provide the project team a summary of the last decade of operational B757 flights showing figures for pax vs cargo on main deck to help develop requirements.

 

[MrConservative]

That was in 1996, I was on the mountain that day, and had been skiing where the lahar flowed 30 minute prior, my mates and I were down by the Chateau when she erupted.

Were you in the Whakapapa Tavern across the road from the Chateau by that time? Have had many a great evening there when I was a younger chap.

A mate was ski patrol that day and said there were 2 reactions from the people still on the mountain - sheer terror and panic and the others who stood there looking at the eruption and going and "Wow. Where's the camera?"

 

[KiwiRob]

Were you in the Whakapapa Tavern across the road from the Chateau by that time? Have had many a great evening there when I was a younger chap.

A mate was ski patrol that day and said there were 2 reactions from the people still on the mountain - sheer terror and panic and the others who stood there looking at the eruption and going and "Wow. Where's the camera?"

No we weren't in the Tavern.

Since we were already at the bottom I fell squarely into the "Wow. Where's the camera?" group. It was awesome watching it erupt, a day I'll never forget.

 

[Rangitoto]

I notice that some(?) of the NH90s are sporting emergency flotation gear. I guess this is part of the marinization process to allow them to operate off ships? Not sure.


This is what they look like when deployed:

 

[ngatimozart]

IIRC 3 of the NH90 have the flotation gear installed.

 

[chis73]

IIRC 3 of the NH90 have the flotation gear installed.

Yeah, 3 was the number I recalled as well, Ngati - somewhere back in this thread there is undoubtedly more info. More correctly though, I'd say up to 3 aircraft can have the flotation gear installed, presumably because there are (were?) only 3 sets in the RNZAF. Nothing unusual in an NH90 having it fitted Rangitoto - it is routinely fitted when an NH90 is expected to operate over water, such as in a Cook Strait crossing.

If there are still only 3 sets (hopefully there are more now), does that not present some operational difficulties? I would assume that on a average day, you would typically be aiming for 60-70% of the fleet available for ops, so that's 5 (maybe 6 on a good day), with the other 2 or 3 in maintenance - less any deployed overseas (but given how hopeless the RNZAF's ability is to deploy them, that isn't a great probability) or factoring in a lower than average availability rate (possible, given the NH90's troubled history and complexity, and a Euro logistics handicap). If a crisis developed in the South Island (as the NH90s are based at Ohakea in the North), could only 3 fly there immediately? That figure could be decidedly worse if some happened to be overseas on exercise - so maybe only 1 or 2 able to fly across the Strait immediately if we're unlucky. Seems rather limiting.

I seem to recall we eventually got 4 up in the air for the Kaikoura earthquake response though.

 

[ngatimozart]

Yeah, 3 was the number I recalled as well, Ngati - somewhere back in this thread there is undoubtedly more info. More correctly though, I'd say up to 3 aircraft can have the flotation gear installed, presumably because there are (were?) only 3 sets in the RNZAF. Nothing unusual in an NH90 having it fitted Rangitoto - it is routinely fitted when an NH90 is expected to operate over water, such as in a Cook Strait crossing.

If there are still only 3 sets (hopefully there are more now), does that not present some operational difficulties? I would assume that on a average day, you would typically be aiming for 60-70% of the fleet available for ops, so that's 5 (maybe 6 on a good day), with the other 2 or 3 in maintenance - less any deployed overseas (but given how hopeless the RNZAF's ability is to deploy them, that isn't a great probability) or factoring in a lower than average availability rate (possible, given the NH90's troubled history and complexity, and a Euro logistics handicap). If a crisis developed in the South Island (as the NH90s are based at Ohakea in the North), could only 3 fly there immediately? That figure could be decidedly worse if some happened to be overseas on exercise - so maybe only 1 or 2 able to fly across the Strait immediately if we're unlucky. Seems rather limiting.

I seem to recall we eventually got 4 up in the air for the Kaikoura earthquake response though.

Yep, it sorta underline the fact that we are a couple or three short numbers wise. I think that we do have the availability rate up and remember reading somewhere that it was around the >70% mark. Might've been in an Air Force News. I know that they use the attritional air frame as a spares source and replace the bits off that with parts orderer from NHI, which as you have said takes time.