Royal Australian Navy Discussions and Updates

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aussienscale

aussienscale

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
alexsa said:
I would not assume they will give up on the name. Let’s wait and see as they may retain it. It matches well with the ‘A’ naming of the Astute if that is the path we take.

If we are going to change then a return to the ‘O’ boat names would be an idea. The Otway and Oxley name have been used twice for Australian submarines. There are a bunch of very good ‘o’ names to follow the initial 6. Alternatively you use the Australian P names that have been associated with submarines and some small Australian cruisers.

But lets face it, that is a political decision
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Could always be called the N Class for nuclear, plenty of names to choose from

Find hotels at cities & towns in Australia starting with N

See a list of cities & towns with hotels beginning with N in Australia. See a full list of places with links to each location in alphabetical order.
www.lodging-world.com www.lodging-world.com
 
ngatimozart

ngatimozart

Super Moderator
Staff member
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KiwiRob said:
Everyone has known since 1987 that nuclear powered and nuclear armed vessels are banned from NZ, the US threw it's cookies out of the pram and had a temper tantrum at the time, a time which is long past. I doubt NZ's stance on nuclear issues had anything to do with not being invited to AUUKUS, to be frank I'm happy we're not, I don't like the idea of being sub servant or dare I say it a vassal state to the US, which is where Australia and the UK appear to be headed.
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Whoever claimed that NZ or Australia was or is a vassal state of the US? This is a a fiction that is CCP and far left propaganda. Are you supporting such misinformation claims?

This AUKUS pact is Australia putting a stake in the ground and stating its independence and that it will not be bullied or pushed around by anyone. It cannot do it all on its own to start with and it needs help from trusted friends. Even you should be able to understand that.

WRT NZ, the big mistake in NZ political and government bureaucratic circles is to be like Sgt Schultz: "I see nothzing. I hear nothzing. I know nothzing." They are so focused on trade that they don't see, or don't want to see, the greater picture that is the geopolitical and geostrategic reality in the Indo-Pacific.
 
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John Newman

John Newman

The Bunker Group
I know the question of ‘how many’ SSNs for the RAN is still very much a ‘how long is a piece of string’ question, but the wording in the DoD press release was interesting.

It said ‘at least eight’, not the usual ‘up to eight’ that you’d normally expect.

At this stage that says to me that eight is a minimum, a bottom line, leaves the door open potentially for a few more.

Where as the normal ‘up to’ gives a Government the ability to come in under that original number.

Anyway, might be a small point, but an important point, in my opinion.

Cheers,
 
John Newman

John Newman

The Bunker Group
Volkodav said:
How about the billionaire class?

HMAS Gina Rinehart, Clive Palmer, Twiggy Forrest, Kerry Stokes, James Packer etc.

That way we could then fund the entire project with a levy on the super rich and if they complained just threaten to rename the sub.
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Actually I think we also have to thank China for this too, being such arseh*les to us and the region, they helped us come to this decision.

One should be named HMAS G’Day China!

Cheers,

PS, for those that don’t know old Aussie rhyming slang, ‘G’Day China’ means ‘G’Day Mate’.

China is short for China plate, plate = mate.

Yes I am showing my age!
 
A

Arclighy

Member
Australia has been on a path to greater self reliance (not self sufficiency) both economically and in defence matters for the past 2 years or so. This is a recognition of the changed economic, trade and strategic pressures that it finds itself trying to address. AUKUS is one part of a range of responses to give itself a far greater degrée of self reliance into the future. It wil take time and concentrated effort. And it will take support and partnerships with others. If the CCP is upset with this, they need only look at their military build up and posturing, and their coercive and bullying tactics against Australia to get a greater understanding of what has lead to this.
 
J

JohnJT

Active Member
R

Redlands18

Well-Known Member
JohnJT said:
www.navalnews.com

French Government, Naval Group React to Australia's Decision to end Attack-class Submarine Program - Naval News

Following yesterday's announcement that the Australian Government will no longer be proceeding with the Attack Class Submarine Program, France's Foreign Ministry and Ministry of Defense issued the following statement:
www.navalnews.com www.navalnews.com
Well the French are not taking this well. They are actually blaming the USA.
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Of course they are not going to take this very well, that was predictable.
Morrison was very diplomatic during his Presser yesterday in saying it was a change of direction.
 
V

Volkodav

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
Redlands18 said:
Of course they are not going to take this very well, that was predictable.
Morrison was very diplomatic during his Presser yesterday in saying it was a change of direction.
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If they carry on too much just tell the truth. From what I understand, there is more than enough metrics from SEA1000 to demonstrate they were not a good partner.
 
H

hauritz

Well-Known Member
Looking back all of the clues were there that Australia was willing to pull the plug on French submarine deal.
Back as far as May 2019 Australia negotiated a get out clause with the French. Interestingly the settlement was dependant on the progress made by the French. The French would receive $90 million if the basic design was completed up to $400 million if a detailed design was delivered. There was never any obligation for Australia to proceed with the project after each phase of the contract was completed which is usual for these sorts of contracts.

www.abc.net.au

Australia to pay French submarine builders up to $404m if deal collapses

Australia will be forced to make multi-million-dollar compensation payments to France if the future submarine program is terminated, according to leaked figures obtained by the ABC.
www.abc.net.au www.abc.net.au

I have seen the $400 million settlement mentioned in the press but that only applies if a detailed design was delivered ... which I suspect wasn't. It turns out that Scott Morrison wasn't bluffing when he gave the French until September to turn in its design work. These talks were candid which I am assuming would be Morrison telling him that the contract would be terminated if that deadline wasn't met. If that warning was given then it could hardly be described as a knife in the back ... more like French hubris.

www.abc.net.au

Scott Morrison warns France to meet multi-billion-dollar submarine deal deadline

The French company building Australia's $90 billion future submarine fleet has been warned it must meet a September deadline to submit its design work plans for the next two years.
www.abc.net.au www.abc.net.au

Those designs were clearly not delivered by the deadline. I am sure the French would have let us all know if they had.

This also sends a pretty clear message to other defence contractors that they need to lift their games and not assume that they are safe from cancellation. Particularly with a hardass like Dutton now in control of defence.
 
John Newman

John Newman

The Bunker Group
JohnJT said:
www.navalnews.com

French Government, Naval Group React to Australia's Decision to end Attack-class Submarine Program - Naval News

Following yesterday's announcement that the Australian Government will no longer be proceeding with the Attack Class Submarine Program, France's Foreign Ministry and Ministry of Defense issued the following statement:
www.navalnews.com www.navalnews.com
Well the French are not taking this well. They are actually blaming the USA.
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Yes the poor old Froggies are a bit Butt hurt at the moment, but the news isn’t as surprising as they make out.

This is a good read:

www.abc.net.au

Morrison has gone nuclear — and there's no turning back

The geostrategic wrestle between Washington and Beijing is one for the ages and Australia is now to play an even bigger role — in a stealthier and speedier bit of nuclear kit, writes Andrew Probyn.
www.abc.net.au www.abc.net.au

Apparently PM Morrison gave President Macron the heads up as to what might happen back in June this year.

As to when this whole process started, apparently the PM had former Def Min Linda Reynolds start working on this 18mths ago.

Anyway, read the article for the details.

Its still amazing for this to have its roots going back so far and being kept under wraps for so long too.

Cheers,
 
S

Shanesworld

Well-Known Member
Sideline said:
Throwing this out there for my SA mates
Astute Class Submarine Owners Workshop Manual

Astute Class Nuclear Submarine – Owners Workshop Manual uses the well established Haynes technical manual format, to provide a detailed and comprehensive guide that explains the design, construction and operation of the RN’s and most likely Australia's newest submarines.

For the Army types there are good selection of photographs, the diagrams are easy to read, with a pull out "coloring in" section :D :D
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Does it come with edible crayons? If not- no deal.
 
J

jack412

Active Member
Continuing my post from yesterday. Royal Australian Navy Discussions and Updates

I'm still thinking that it could be a partnership with UK. On their replacement of the Astute. It fits the timeline that was said today.

ABC news "An 18-month taskforce led by Defence will now investigate how Australia can become a "reliable steward" of nuclear submarines, while federal Labor said it received advice that the new submarines might not be constructed until 2040."

ukdefencejournal.org.uk

UK to develop new class of nuclear submarine

A new generation of nuclear submarines will be developed to replace the Astute class in the 2040s.
ukdefencejournal.org.uk ukdefencejournal.org.uk
 
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John Newman

John Newman

The Bunker Group
jack412 said:
ABC news "An 18-month taskforce led by Defence will now investigate how Australia can become a "reliable steward" of nuclear submarines, while federal Labor said it received advice that the new submarines might not be constructed until 2040."
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I watched Albo doing his press conference yesterday, he didn’t look like a happy camper at all.

It was funny how he gave bipartisan support to the Government without actually saying the word ‘yes’.

As for the ‘2040’ date, he said that in his press conference, I think that was pure politics, separates himself from something by setting a date way way into the future.

Cheers,
 
H

hauritz

Well-Known Member
Depot Dog said:

Bloomberg - Are you a robot?

www.bloomberg.com

Given yesterdays speculation as to which type of reactor will power the new sub. Rolls Royce share price rose last night after Aukus announcement. Maybe the markets know something we don't.

Regards
DD
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Maybe Rolls Royce know something we don't.

As it turns out Australia has long been targeted by RR as a potential client for its small modular reactors.

Introduction to the Rolls-Royce UK SMR technology and consortium. – Australian Nuclear Association

Speaker: Alan Woods, Director Strategy and Business Development - SMR, Rolls Royce, UK. Webinar 5 pm Sydney time, Wednesday 21 October 2020. Alan's s
www.nuclearaustralia.org.au www.nuclearaustralia.org.au

In fact once the Australian public get over its phobia of nuclear power plants there is a huge market in Australia for this sort of reactor.

The American S9G reactor used in the Virginia class is designed specifically for submarines and uses weapons grade Highly Enriched Uranium fuel (HEU) while the commercial version of the RR reactors use Uranium Oxide UO2. I don't know whether or not the military version of the RR reactor is significantly different to their commercial version but if it isn't I can see why a UO2 fuelled reactor could be a more attractive option for the Australian government. Even more so if this reactor becomes widely used across Australia.
 
R

Redlands18

Well-Known Member
John Newman said:
I watched Albo doing his press conference yesterday, he didn’t look like a happy camper at all.

It was funny how he gave bipartisan support to the Government without actually saying the word ‘yes’.

As for the ‘2040’ date, he said that in his press conference, I think that was pure politics, separates himself from something by setting a date way way into the future.

Cheers,
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Morrison said that they hoped to start building the first Sub within the decade and completed towards the end of next decade.
 
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