Royal Australian Navy Discussions and Updates 2.0

[hauritz]

ABC article weirdly also states potentially 6 frigates built overseas.

Actually that bit of the article surprised me the least. WA already has a lot of work coming its way and it complicates things a lot more if you have to also rush a new frigate into service. Six new GPFs and the arrival of the first Hunters before the mid 30s is pretty crucial.

 

[Reptilia]

Actually that bit of the article surprised me the least. WA already has a lot of work coming its way and it complicates things a lot more if you have to also rush a new frigate into service. Six new GPFs and the arrival of the first Hunters before the mid 30s is pretty crucial.

Maybe 3 RAN 2029/early 2030s, 3 RNZS mid 2030s + 8 built in Australia from 2029.

 

[hauritz]

Maybe 3 RAN 2029/early 2030s, 3 RNZS mid 2030s + 8 built in Australia from 2029.

What NZ does is up to NZ. It wouldn’t be a bad thing if they teamed with Australia on this but the priority for Australia is to simply get its own ships in the water.

 

[icelord]

There is a 100% chance that a journalist has confused Hunter Class with GPF numbers. See above for many members thoughts on certain credibility for some Media writers

Anything else is just conspiracy or wild assertions.

GFP 3 build overseas. 6-8 in Aus (numbers not confirmed)
Hunters 6 build in Aus (Batch 1 is signed for with 3 ships to be built, batch 2 yet to be signed for)

 

[StevoJH]

The issue with MEKO is that the A200 doesn’t exist at present in a configuration that would be acceptable to the RAN, and I doubt it would offer much in the way of growth margins.

As for the A210, I don’t think it even exists?

 

[koxinga]

I understand if some RAN officers would prefer familiar over revolutionary. But as downunderblue points out, Japan has been producing the Mogami-class very quickly. If Australia needs frigates sooner rather than later, Japan is where they'll come from.

Similar to @spoz 's view, there are no question on ability (speed/quality) of Japanese shipbuilding. However, the pace that you see JMSDF acquire and put into service the Mogami is unlikely to be replicable for RAN due to system integration challenges.

JMSDF uses Japanese specific sub-systems (e.g OPY-2 radar, OYQ-1 combat systems, OQQ-25 sonar etc). I would imagine that these would be replaced. Even if they are not replaced and adopted wholesale, translation of both the systems and training curriculum would take up time. JMSDF don't have these constraints, and these sub-systems are evolutionary and already in service with their fleet.

Also how is the RAN doing for recruitment right now? From some basic research it looks like Mogami needs at least 30 less crew than the A-200 series ships.

This is indeed a significant advantage (automation). But this is also a double edge sword. I brought up earlier that Asian navies due to manpower constraints (e.g Singapore, Japan) have adopted a higher degree of automation and would like have different definitions of what is acceptable risk when it comes to DC.

Is this something RAN is willing to accept without changes?

I also don't understand the point about Japan having not exported a warship in living memory. At some point every country was in that position. The UK hadn't exported any new warships above corvette-size (selling used RN ships doesn't count) since the Type 42 destroyers sold to Argentina. In the last several years we've had significant licensed orders of the Type 26 and 31 frigates.

The question is whether RAN wants to be the first customer of a highly complex warship from a country not known to have done naval exports. Their recent export was the Teresa Magbanua-class patrol vessels to the Philippines funded by JICA. From all accounts, the transaction seems to be smooth, but they are not complex vessels.

Interesting view about not disappointing Japan again. Maybe if it's a close decision, the government will go with Mogami.

Personally, I hope they (Japan) will succeed as a first sale to a Western country will have tremendous strategic implications. It will also set Japan off on the path of a credible alternative for military hardware.

However, the facts remain that Australia would likely be a very demanding first customer. I am less certain about the politics of it all tbh, since I am not Australian.