Of course back in the day the Adelaide class came with a Mark 13 missile launcher and a magazine of 40 SM2 and harpoon missiles. Later an additional 8 VLS were added with sea sparrows. Packed a couple of Seahawks and a phalanx as well. The sea sparrows were later replaced by ESSMs, possibly quad packed, which would have given that tiny ship a pretty impressive weapon loadout.
Royal Australian Navy Discussions and Updates 2.0
- Thread starter OPSSG
- Start date
I believe the FFGUP had ESSM from the start.
If I recall correctly the Tenix bid included replacing the Mk-13 with a Mk-41.
I think the ultimate solution to this reloading issue is in effect a railed reload system that transfers the new round from the magazine to the missile deck for anchoring to the empty cell that requires the reload.
the secured reload canister to be raised and the round lowered.
of course this is utterly conceptual, and would require a complete re-design of warships as I don’t think anything remotely looks like it today.
in concept would allow the ship itself to reload its own cells, in more varied sea states.
if this actually could happen, would it be a Dreadnaught moment, evolving ship analogy from muzzle loaded muskets into Bolt Action reloading.
-not fantasy fleets, but fantasy engineering instead.
the secured reload canister to be raised and the round lowered.
of course this is utterly conceptual, and would require a complete re-design of warships as I don’t think anything remotely looks like it today.
in concept would allow the ship itself to reload its own cells, in more varied sea states.
if this actually could happen, would it be a Dreadnaught moment, evolving ship analogy from muzzle loaded muskets into Bolt Action reloading.
-not fantasy fleets, but fantasy engineering instead.
Redlands18
Well-Known Member
Could fit only 8 SM-2 and the ESSM is the only real hard kill AD the Anzacs other than the limited AAW capability provided by the 127 and 25mm, have and is the SM-2 integrated into the Anzacs CMS?
To be clear I don’t think the gov are suggesting not supporting people with Autism but the method of funding the support will change as the current level of spend is not sustainable. The numbers coming on each year are very high which a cynic might say is some people taking advantage of a poorly administered system. First hand I know of a family friend who died about 8 months ago. He was in a wheel chair for the last 12 month. How wheel chair lift for their car was billed to NDIS via the provider at $34000. The same lift is available online for about $7k fitted. After he died his wife rang the provider and said it’s only been used for 3 months where can I send it back to be re used and they didn’t want it back. She was told Just dispose of it yourself. Same for his $7000 medical alert system that never got used. It’s these things that need to be zeroed in on.
If you have the missiles in a magazine aboard ship, why not have them in more VLS cells? No railed reload system needed.
The main problem with reloading is the need to transfer missiles from one ship to another, because missile firing ships don't have space & weight allowances for more missiles.
If only there was a system that could hold the rounds in an armoured box, similar to a magazine while protecting them from weather, have redundancy, and even some fire fighting.
John Fedup
The Bunker Group
I really don’t know much about tamir missiles and a naval adaptation of Iron Dome. I suspect it would have the same limitations of other missile defence solutions, rapid depletion of AD missiles during a saturation attack.
I was thinking more along the lines of being able to reload the cells from a hardened missile stores within the ship. Thus a single Mk41 launcher with a robotic reloader is only limited to the size of missile stores on ship.
Being able to locate your missile stores closer to the water line helps lower your center of gravity.
For the type 26 it would be cheaper to have an extra pair of Mk41 launchers in the Type 26 mission bay with a robotic reloader than say 8 Mk41 launchers. Saving the weight of 6 launchers is significant.
Keeps a certain individual candidate who is known to make rash comments out of the procession. Whoever wins will be gone by 2029
John Fedup
The Bunker Group
. A bridge too far IMHO.
Having only 1 of 3 deployable ships into a ballistic missile theatre isn’t really much of a surprise. It’s what the pros have been saying here for sometime.
At the time several here commented on having the last two FFGs go through an upgrade like the Anzacs (CEFAR radar etc) rather than be sold.
As for an Anzac to the Gulf, perhaps stipulate in will deploy if is in company with another vessel.
Be it NATO, USN, Asian or NZ, perhaps another nation also has a vessel that they would think twice about deploying alone but could team up with the Anzac.
After all this is how it would operate in a conflict in our own region, the RAN is unlikely to send an Anzac up north all alone.
A palletised reload system could work. Pallet frame fits over and locks onto the eight cell module with its doors open and the loading system is built in the pallet and lowers the canasters into the cells. The question is whether it would be light enough for vertrep.
The problem is the RAN really needed a replacement for the FFGs but the money wasn't there. Well it was, we were in the middle of the biggest economic windfall the country has ever seen, but defence was not a priority and any government that spent up on buying a dozen FFGs or DDGs would have been spanked at the ballet box.
An reloading the Mk-13 was a major evolution, it was bulky, complicated and very very time consuming to do !
That would take a lot of internal space for the missile store, passageways to allow it to be filled & the missiles to be transferred to the VLS, & handling machinery. Goes against one of the main advantages of a VLS.
OldTex
Well-Known Member
It would almost be a reinvention of the system used for Sea Slug on the RN County Class destroyers. It would definitely be a case of designing out all of the best features of the VLS.
According to the Australian newspaper Richard Marles has played down the importance of deploying an Australian ship to the middle east citing that the navy's priorities were on our immediate region. He did say we will consider the request in due course. Given the complete lack of urgency shown by the government with defence issues this assurance probably doesn't mean a lot.
The commander of the Australian naval fleet, Rear Admiral Christopher Smith, said the navy was prepared for a government order to deploy. Got to wonder about that however as Australia apparantly only has 3 full crews for the Anzacs and that these frigates are probably undergunned for such a mission. A lot would seem to ride on whether we can deploy one of the Hobarts.
The commander of the Australian naval fleet, Rear Admiral Christopher Smith, said the navy was prepared for a government order to deploy. Got to wonder about that however as Australia apparantly only has 3 full crews for the Anzacs and that these frigates are probably undergunned for such a mission. A lot would seem to ride on whether we can deploy one of the Hobarts.