Nh-90???

[Wooki]

Well, you have to believe me when I am saying that its simply not possible. I checked the News page of the german army though and it backs up my previous information. First aid was rendered by ISAF units from Afghanistan with CH-53GS helos, and then the regular help kicked in with Heeresfliegerregiment 15 and 25 (Army Air Force Regiments). Both regiments use CH-53G helos. There simply is no NH-90 available for such operations, and even if it would be, the CH-53 are far better suited since they carry heavier payload.
This news report mixed something up. Wouldnt be anything new about it...german news and reports (even the so called "in-depth" ones) are regularly in error about specific military hardware.
So even if it was a NH-90 operating in some mountainous environment (wouldnt be surprising, since its part of the training), then it certainly was not in Kashmir!

I was car pooling with an ex-army traffic controller and he looked up and said "there's a CH-53".... so I looked up and saw a blackhawk but no CH53...

I just kept my eyes on the road after that... All a bit embarrasssing...

maybe the news channel has a website with footage, so you can check?

 

[Kiwi Echo]

nah ah i had a look on the website and couldnt find anything to do with the NH-90 ah
however they did have info about the new two seater euro-fighter

DAMN dat things FINE

it looks like that thing will be far superior to that new f-35 (is dat wat you call it )

 

[Waylander]

These two (EUF and F-35) are very different designs. The EUF is at first an air superiority fighter with a second role as an attacker. The F-35 is primarily a bomb taxi.
You cannot really compare these two.

 

[turin]

maybe the news channel has a website with footage, so you can check?

Been there. Apart from a TV schedule and some very general info on the reports there is nothing to be found. Whatever...I guess it was just one of these mistakes.

 

[Supe]

The NH-90 is proving to be one of the most successful helo's of modern (ie: last 10-20 years) times. Australia has ordered 12 already, with an expect order of up to another 30 to fully replace our S-70A-9 Blackhawks and Iroquois.

Are you sure about the NH-90's replacing the ADF Blackhawk fleet? IIRC a number of them were to be kept on?

 

[Aussie Digger]

Are you sure about the NH-90's replacing the ADF Blackhawk fleet? IIRC a number of them were to be kept on?

Yep, MRH-90 is slated to replace Blackhawk, Seahawk, Seasprite, Seaking and Iroquois, eventually.

There are more rumours coming out in Aviation mags etc, that the Blackhawk replacement (for 5 Aviation Regiment) will be accelerated and announced with the new DCP due to be released anytime soon. Some, upgraded Blackhawks will be retained to support SOCOMD, but the majority will be replaced by MRH-90's. It is expected an additional 28 will be ordered soon.

It's also rumoured the Seaking replacement will be sped up given it's on-going problems and it's almost a certainty MRH-90 will be chosen for this role.

 

[Kiwi Echo]

With so many countries upgrading there birds to add the NH-90

Do you think trainning, ideas, parts, accessories and technology etc.... upgrades be easly exchanged between all of the countries who will eventually be owning them ?

Also with the chopper could all countries possibly get together and create newer and better avionics or new kit that could be added onto it?

 

[Magoo]

Yep, MRH-90 is slated to replace Blackhawk, Seahawk, Seasprite, Seaking and Iroquois, eventually..

Maybe not Seasprite and Iroquois. Seasprite is here for the long haul...if they ever get the damn thing to work that is nfloorl: .

Iroquois will likely be replaced by the platform that is selected for Phase 7 of AIR 9000, however Army and Navy have a different point of view on how much capability they want in the platform. Apparently Navy wants a light training helo only to replace Squirrel and Kiowa, whereas Army wants a more robust light utility helo (LUH) similar to the US Army's current LUH requirement.

There are more rumours coming out in Aviation mags etc, that the Blackhawk replacement (for 5 Aviation Regiment) will be accelerated and announced with the new DCP due to be released anytime soon. Some, upgraded Blackhawks will be retained to support SOCOMD, but the majority will be replaced by MRH-90's. It is expected an additional 28 will be ordered soon. It's also rumoured the Seaking replacement will be sped up given it's on-going problems and it's almost a certainty MRH-90 will be chosen for this role.

It looks almost certain that Phases 4 and 6 of AIR 9000 will be combined, i.e. that the Black Hawk and Sea King replacements will be the same platform, with the first of about 36 (not counting the 12 ordered in Phase 2) to enter service from 2010. You're right, 171 SQN will likely retain its Black hawks for the time being for Special Ops work.

Also, look for more Chinooks to be acquired as part of Phase 5 of AIR 9000. In 10 years, the ADF's rotary force should look something like this:

48 x MRH-90 (or 36 x MRH-90 + 12 x upgraded Black Hawks)
22 x Tiger ARH
11 x Seasprite
10-12 x CH-47D/F
48-60 x LTH/LUH

Magoo

 

[Cootamundra]

Yep, MRH-90 is slated to replace Blackhawk, Seahawk, Seasprite, Seaking and Iroquois, eventually.

There are more rumours coming out in Aviation mags etc, that the Blackhawk replacement (for 5 Aviation Regiment) will be accelerated and announced with the new DCP due to be released anytime soon. Some, upgraded Blackhawks will be retained to support SOCOMD, but the majority will be replaced by MRH-90's. It is expected an additional 28 will be ordered soon.

It's also rumoured the Seaking replacement will be sped up given it's on-going problems and it's almost a certainty MRH-90 will be chosen for this role.

AD i just hope that the RAN and Army guys get together and align on this particular purchase, it makes A LOT of sense for the Sea Kings to be replaced with MRH-90s at the same time as a bunch of the Army BlackHawks. Then the best of the old BH's could go over to the SASr and 4RAR for dedicated SpecWar activities. By doing this the gov could squeeze an even better deal out of Eurocopter and we'd be able to build even more of them up in QLD.

 

[Supe]

Some, upgraded Blackhawks will be retained to support SOCOMD.

Care to float an educated guess on how many SOCOMD will keep on? Will they be further upgraded for the sort of work expected of them?

 

[Magoo]

Care to float an educated guess on how many SOCOMD will keep on? Will they be further upgraded for the sort of work expected of them?

Educated guess? I'd say a squadron, i.e. 12-14 airframes (171SQN based @ Holsworthy), possibly with cockpit avionics, airframe structural and cabin seating upgrades from the UH-60M program, as well as some other enhancements such as EW (ALR-2002), and maybe FLIR, TFR, side gun mounts etc. Should be a nice bit of kit!

Magoo

 

[Aussie Digger]

Care to float an educated guess on how many SOCOMD will keep on? Will they be further upgraded for the sort of work expected of them?

8-14 platforms, enough for normal squadron strength I'd imagine. Senator Hill alluded to the fact that upgrades will be performed on the BH's in order to bring them closer to HH/MH-60 levels of capability. What that means and when it will happen, is a matter of some conjecture as are all of these issues, until the new DCP comes out...

 

[rossfrb_1]

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,18163273%255E31477,00.html

" Sea King chopper set to be replaced
Jonathan Porter and Sid Marris
February 16, 2006 THE troubled, ageing Sea King helicopter may be replaced earlier than planned in the wake of the crash on the Indonesian island of Nias that claimed nine Defence Force lives and injured two others last year......
..A replacement for the Sea King was envisaged over the next 10 years as part of the 2003 Defence Capability Plan, but will now be accelerated.
Defence Force chief Air Chief Marshal Angus Houston would not be drawn on when the replacement would happen when asked in Senate estimates hearings yesterday.
But a Defence spokeswoman last night confirmed a decision would be made on the replacement craft this year.
Air Chief Marshal Houston said the European MRH-90, of which a dozen have been ordered for the army, would be one suitable option...."

cheers
rb

 

[Whiskyjack]

It has now been 10 months since NZ selected the NH90, and no news as to how many or when they are to be delivered, no selection of the LUH. Anyone have any news?

Also what the situation with Australia's NH90s is?

The latest issue of APDR has an article suggesting that more CH-47s are about to be ordered under fast track and that the NH90 order may be increased to replace the Seaking, and a decision as to whether the Blackhawks will be upgraded or replaced altogether will be made in the first half of this year.

 

[cherry]

I suspect that we will find out about the entire format of the AIR9000 when the revised Defence Capability Plan 2006 is released some time this year, perhaps even this month. The DCP was supposed to be released in Feb this year but with a new defence minister, it has been delayed. Yes there has been some talk of the Seakings being replaced, probably with MRH-90, with a decision to be made this year (again, probably be specified in the new DCP). There is continuing talk also as to more Chinooks being purchased too. This may also come under AIR8000 which is a new battlefield airlifter for Army, the replacement for the Caribou, which most likely a mix of fixed wing aircraft i.e. C-27J or C-295, and rotary wing, either more Chinooks or MRH-90. My feeling is that the new DCP will outline a slightly different AIR9000 to that of the last DCP 2004 with decisions on more Chinooks, more MRH-90 (for both Seaking and Blackhawk replacements), some Blackhawks retained and upgraded for our special forces, and a training/LUH. Once this is released, ADF will finally get there sh#t together and start ordering these aircraft. This project has dilly-dallied on for too long and not only are people like us getting jack of it, but I suspect those within our armed forces and government are jack of it too. So keep your eyes peeled for the new DCP. Once this is released AIR9000 will finally get moving again.

 

[cherry]

Found this on another forum. Very interesting!!!!!



APDR Feb 2006

Peter La Franchi

{The Australian Government will shortly consider a potential purchase of additional Boeing CH-47 Chinook helicopters as well as a heavy airlifter acqisition as part of a cabinet submission now being prepared by the Australian Defence Department.

The additional Chinook helicopter buy will be one of a number of options put forward by the DOD to fulfill its long standing battlefield intra-theatre airlift requirement. The submission will examine the future of the RAAf's existing DH-4 Caribou aircraft and Lockheed Martin C-130H fleets.

A related submission may seek approvals for replacing the RAN's Sea king helicopters as part of a requirement to upgrade or replace the Australian Army's Sikorsky SH-70A Blackhawk helicopter fleet with the Eurocopter MRH-90 aircraft.

The cabinet submissions are being put forward as part of government budget planning for the Australian 2006-2007 financial year.
INITIAL DETAILS ON APPROVED OUTCOMES ARE TO BE RELEASED 9 MAY.....

According to Rear Admiral Matt Tripovich, head of capability systems division in the Australian Defence headquarters capability group, "the question regarding future fleet size for the Chinook is an interesting one and will be considered in the context of the whole battlefield intra theatre lift issue.
This and other issues are being considered by the Department and shortly by Government in line of an overview of operational and strategic airlift for the ADF."....

Tripovich said that the Australian Army's six CH-47D Chinooks remain central to plans for rationalisation of the wider military helicopter fleet under a rethink of the existing Air 9000 programme.

A joint helicopter management study commissioned by government will be completed by the end of February with this to "determine an agreed consensus position between the three services on the future of ADF rotary wing capability." The study will be considered by senior Australian defence planning committees in March-April....

Some of the questions they are looking at are how ADF rotary wing personnel could be jointly managed across the services to improve the ADF's operational flexibilty and to improve retention; and would the co-location of training systems and-or squadrons bring about increased operational capability where it is sensible to do so.}

 

[Stuart Mackey]

It has now been 10 months since NZ selected the NH90, and no news as to how many or when they are to be delivered, no selection of the LUH. Anyone have any news?

I suspect that the delay has to do with finalising the Sioux replacment, as both helicopters are part of the same programme cost wise. When that is out of the way, and officials and ministers have recovered from their heart attacks over the cost of the programme, then we will find out.

 

[Aussie Digger]

I suspect that the delay has to do with finalising the Sioux replacment, as both helicopters are part of the same programme cost wise. When that is out of the way, and officials and ministers have recovered from their heart attacks over the cost of the programme, then we will find out.

I think I read somewhere that NZ will finalise it's plans by the end of March 2006, in relation to it's new helo acquisition plans.

Apparently they are considering a submission from NH Industries and Eurocopter to purchase NH-90 (obviously) AND EC-135 type helo's under a combined package...

 

[gf0012-aust]

AND EC-135 type helo's under a combined package...

I've been inside an early version of the EC-135. Very nice little helo and ideal for altitude work. It's one of the few smaller helos that doesn't have an asthma attack in mountainous areas.

 

[Whiskyjack]

I think I read somewhere that NZ will finalise it's plans by the end of March 2006, in relation to it's new helo acquisition plans.

Apparently they are considering a submission from NH Industries and Eurocopter to purchase NH-90 (obviously) AND EC-135 type helo's under a combined package...

Had a quick look at the specs for the EC-135, a nice option for a LUH, just the right size. Can support civil SAR as well as provide support for the NH90 on deployment, in areas like Medivac, and general util duties.

Interesting to see the numbers.

Thanks for the info.