Indonesian Aero News

Sandhi Yudha

Well-Known Member
|"Unless they can maintain the huge increment on budget, better drop F-15ID and add more Rafale and refurbished F-16 as F-16ID. If they still go with IFX program with KAI, those F-16ID can be replaced by IFX/IF-21 later part on 2030+ (if Indonesia still committing with the project, thus Big 'if')."|
If i was president, i would make you my Minister of Defence and Financial Affairs.... (after they created the post/function of Minister of Maritime Affairs, Investments and Covid-19, everything is now possible).




From DI FB page, shown graphic of N219 cockpit. Shown fairly modern glass cockpit with relatively simple arrangements. Straight forward cockpit for modern short range turboprop regional airliner.
This layout/design is already made public a couple of years ago, its better if they announce when they want to take this aircraft in production.
 

Ananda

The Bunker Group

Kami juga bangga karena telah mengumumkan baru-baru ini bahwa Indonesia juga telah memesan dua pesawat A400M generasi terbaru kami, dengan empat pesawat tambahan sebagai opsi.

Put it in here, as the Airbus Asia Pacific Chief talk on Indonesia A400M deal. There's talk before that the deal is 2+2 (firm+option). However the Airbus Chief talk on 2+4.
 
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Sandhi Yudha

Well-Known Member




Put it in here, as the Airbus Asia Pacific Chief talk on Indonesia A400M deal. There's talk before that the deal is 2+2 (firm+option). However the Airbus Chief talk on 2+4.
According to
The contract, which will become effective in 2022, will bring the total number of A400M operators to ten nations. The agreement includes a complete maintenance and training support package. A Letter of Intent was also signed for the future acquisition of four additional A400M aircraft.
Do you have more information about the financial details?
I'm curious about the A330 MRTT, until now no any developments, right?
 

Ananda

The Bunker Group
This project already included on Bapenas draft plan for 2022 financing. However the final allocation will come after MoF put the stamp. Will see if it is this year or next. Sometimes they keep bit off radar, just like C-130J. We then know when TNI-AU Chief visit LM factory during 1st cutting of 1st plane.
 

Sandhi Yudha

Well-Known Member
This project already included on Bapenas draft plan for 2022 financing. However the final allocation will come after MoF put the stamp. Will see if it is this year or next. Sometimes they keep bit off radar, just like C-130J. We then know when TNI-AU Chief visit LM factory during 1st cutting of 1st plane.
Yes it was remarkable that the C-130J acquisition was not announced on DSCA. I can not see a reason to keep this procurement secret.

Btw, a certain 'defence expert' on Twitter posted recently this:
|"It's useless for Indonesia to acquire F-15EX if it doesn't want to adopt Link 16. CISMOA gave golden opportunity for Jakarta to procure Link 16. "|

But wasn't Link 16 already for decades in use by TNI-AU?
As far as i know Link 16 is also used by the AH-64E, C-130J, F-16 and even the NASAMS.
 

Ananda

The Bunker Group
Btw, a certain 'defence expert' on Twitter posted recently this:
I don't know what he's blabing about. The network centric system that Scytalys build and LEN Link ID basically build to cater Western, Eastern and Indigenous network link system. Perhaps he is talking on some factions that still think LINK 16 security integrity can't be control fully within Indonesia, even already using Scytalys network with LEN Link ID.

In truth any digital system still open to potential break in on security. Just depends how good your fire wall will be. Even Russian try to break in Starlink firewall, but seems Elon's security wall so far beyond their reach.

So, it should be depends on how well MinDef, TNI, LEN with their contractors like Scytalys build the secure network.
 
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Arji

Active Member
Anyone has more information regarding PT. LEN's GCI Radar? Its specification or what is it based on? How far it is in development? That sort of information? I'm interested in learning more about the product, but all the information I read from most media feels like promotional brochure aimed at the general reader. Best I can find is from indomiliter.com video. Said it's only a prototype, though no detail at what stage. I assume it's pretty late since there is already a contract signed at the DEFENCE ID ceremony for orders.

I'm guessing most of the parts will be supplied by Thales, given their announced partnership with PT. LEN. Also, I'm largely ignorant about their competency in this field, though from their sites, they claim to have ample experiences in integrating a multitude of radars for military and civilian use, as well as partnering with many international companies.
 
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Ananda

The Bunker Group
So far the info that you see on Indonesian defense blogers, vlogers, forums and Media is basically about the same. However with they are already clear out in latest signing on Defend ID, then it's clear they are going to work with Thales as main partner for C5ISR. This includes the radar.


So in the end I'm quite sure, it will be based on GM 400 tech. I don't think Thales have problem to help build GCI radar for LEN based on GM 400 software. Afterall they already move on to GM 400 Alpha for their own latest GCI line.

Note:
I'm no electronics industry guy. However talking to some Industry players, they are talking it is not that hard to build the hardware. There's enough off the shelf components suppliers in Asia and Euro you can work out. The problem is how to connect and make it work as optimise possible.

That's where the partner coming. Not only to help integrating the components, but more importantly providing with proven soft ware.
 
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Arji

Active Member
I'm no electronics industry guy. However talking to some Industry players, they are talking it is not that hard to build the hardware. There's enough off the shelf components suppliers in Asia and Euro you can work out. The problem is how to connect and make it work as optimise possible.
In that case, I guess the order could be completed in a "relatively" short time. ("relatively" in the loosest sense of the word)
 
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Sandhi Yudha

Well-Known Member
At last there is some progress in the EH-101 acquisition case of TNI-AU.
KPK (the national anti-corruption agency) has blocked the account of a company involved in this corruption case.

"Pengadaan helikopter ini diduga telah merugikan keuangan negara sebesar Rp224 miliar dari nilai kontrak Rp738,9 miliar," terang dia.

Baca artikel CNN Indonesia "Kasus Helikopter AW-101, KPK Blokir Rekening Bank Rp139 M" selengkapnya di sini: Kasus Helikopter AW-101, KPK Blokir Rekening Bank Rp139 M.

The EH-101 contract has a value of Rp738.900.000.000.
From this amount around Rp 224.000.000.000 went into the pockets of corruptors.
 
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Ananda

The Bunker Group
Yes, that's why I put in this thread few years back, that Soeharto's regime Air Defense (practically all defense) framework line was actually more detail and structure, compare the 'democratic' regimes after him. I sometimes laughing on those know it all millenial kiddos that blame everything on TNI-AU condition with Soeharto's era neglect.

On paper TNI-AU have 8 Fighter sq, 2 LCA (Hawk209/109), 4 MRCA (F-16, Flankers and F-5), 1 LIFT/LCA (TA-50), and 1 COIN (Super Tucano). Thus with F-5 already retired close to 7 years ago without replacement ready yet, on paper they still have 7 sq of fighters. However if the definition of fighter only cover LCA and MRCA then yes, they only have 5 operational sq.

The early 80's era was where US still reluctant to release F-16 other then to NATO or Non NATO major allies (just like F-35 at this moment). Just like F-35 they are always 'diplomatically' package the response on matter of Affordability and Tech Preparation.

For that matter, this is the era they (US) try to offer F-20 for those interested with F-16 and already use F-5 or other 2nd gen US Fighters. Thus why F-20 being marketed quite vigerously in ASEAN region. In sense I do see F-20 as connotation (on US marketing side) as F-16V marketing effort this time around. They also toying with the idea of F-16-79 (F-16 downgrade version with J79) concept, which not getting much market attention.

Back to Soeharto's era, by 90's Habibie's as most influential minister that time (in sense like Luhut thid time around), talk in media for the need of 300+ fighters inventory for TNI-AU. This is reflected of plan 20 sq for TNI-AU which basically being plan since the 80's. This shown Soeharto's regime actually have more ambitious plan then current 11 sq the "democratic" administrations plan.

However realistically in my opinion, even if Habibie plan get underway smoothly, TNI-AU will get around 10-12 sq by early 2000 at most. In 1996 Indonesian Aerospace, Habibie teams talk the plan of licensing Hawk 200/100. With 40 build by BAE (this come to fruition) and 60+ build under license by IPTN. Hawk 200 as LCA will augmented plan of 4 F-16 blk15+ OCU (which by early 90's only one sq got implemented).

East Timor and Economics problem (after 97) shoot down all the plan, and what TNI-AU doing up till this moment is to catch up with plan that being prepared by Soeharto regime. In fact many development projects outside defense (including infrastructure), actually modifications toward blue print planning that being prepared by Soeharto's regime. I got colleugues in Bapenas talk few years back how they are rewriting and modifued many old blue prints plan from Soeharto's era. This because their plan actually quite details and reasonable structured.

Well just to shown those Jokowow millenials on on line forums are talking nonsense if they think Jokowi's administrations planning everything.
 

Ananda

The Bunker Group

Further information from Thales on their partnership with LEN for GCI radar. Basically they're not only providing tech partnership, but provide licensing agreement for GM 403 type Mobile GCI platform.
 

Ananda

The Bunker Group

It is clearer that the Capital Injection for DI portion is for increasing the production capacity for CN-235 and N-219. We have seen the leak on those slides for few days ago on Indonesian online forums and media. However with this put in Antara news agency, it is clear there are no production capacity build up asside for N-219 and CN-235.
 

Arji

Active Member
Apparently, there's talk of reducing the Rafale purchase number and buying ex-gulf state's Mirages? If true, that's disappointing. I kind of understand considering the economic condition of the entire world, but why Mirages? Why not divert it to other projects other than fighter jet? Why not look for more F-16s?
 
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Ananda

The Bunker Group
There're too many rumours running around now. Some say 42 Rafale cut to 22 (6 +16) while add 14 Mirage 2000. However also talk the 42 Rafale still on, however due to financing schedule it is divided on 3 contract batch of 6+16+20.

Those 14 is stop gap from Dasault, as Qatar and UAE as part of their own Rafale deals also ask Dasault to trade their Mirage 2000 in their inventory. Thus that rumours talk those 14 Mirage 2000 is actually already own back by Dasault.

Because of Dasault production capacity, back log existing order and Indonesian financing schedule, those Rafale some of them will not be getting to Indonesia at least by end of Decade. So this 14 is stop gap that also can be used to familiarize TNI-AU personals with French Fighters.

Again this just one of the rumours, so we don't know yet until it is official. However getting those mirage as stop gap is reasonable. Just like Fincantieri offer of two Maestrale as stop gap for FREMM.

Let's see how this developing. However as I mentioned many times, looking on MinDef wish list on reality of Financing capabilities, something must give. Either projects drop, or being stretched time schedule to meet financing availabilities.
 

Arji

Active Member
I hope they are wise enough to choose the latter option. Even with the current plan, there will be 4 different type of fighter. Dont need to add another one.
 

Ananda

The Bunker Group
The moment they (MinDef) wants Rafale, F-15ID, FREMM, Iver/Arrow based Frigates, Plus Scorpene and AEW, Long Range MPA, ISTAR specialist Aircraft, multilayer airdefense, and still talking to be committed with IFX, etc.I know there will be not enough money trail to cover.

So what's must give either in projects or time table of order. Getting 42 Rafale to be delivered by six years or stretched to 9 years it will be different on financing batch calculation. I don't know in the end how many type of Aircraft will be maintained. I do suspect if the order of Rafale or F-15ID being stretched to end of this decade or early next one, those Flankers and Hawks already at the end of life time. They're not being upgrade significantly anyway.
 

r0m8470

Member
At this juncture, with the propensity of Indonesian brass to create a collection, maybe it's time now to have fun with all kinds of hardware combination (assuming budget is not an issue), long logistical tail end be damned.

Mirages from the Gulf countries ~ those would be Qatari and UAE, the dash 5 or dash 9 version. If the brass do it right, these Deltas and the Vipers can form a high/low mix. The weapon mix are also quite exotic ~ Hammers, Black Shaheen, MICA, maybe thrown in Exocet for good measure. ROCAF I think are employing their Mirages and Vipers as high/low mix, except their dash 5 are purely air to air. The dash 9 at this time is still a potent platform and should be a good lead-in (albeit expensive) for the Rafales.
 
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