Bushmaster 'Ute'

[buglerbilly]

this is the details from an Ausa-based article on ARES blog..........

“We know our vehicle passed all the tests,” says Ross Montalio from Thales Australia, which joined Oshkosh on the Bushmaster truck for MRAP I. Despite being popular with the Dutch and Australians in Afghanistan, Bushmaster failed to win an MRAP production contract. A lack of side doors for the driver and commander might be to blame, although Motalio insists his team was prepared to add doors on short notice. Some observers have questioned whether the Pentagon favored certain traditional defense firms specializing in combat vehicles, as opposed to Oshkosh with its core civilian market.

Regardless, MRAP ain’t over, with a second round of purchases — up to 8,000 trucks — slated to begin in January. Oshkosh is back in a big way in MRAP II. It has teamed up with Thales Australia on a re-designed Bushmaster in both 4×4 and 6×6 models and is also partnered with Ceradyne on the Bull, which was conceived from the ground up to defeat those super-lethal EFPs.

The new Bushmaster actually has its roots in the U.S. Army’s new program to buy as many as 1,400 MRAP-type vehicles for engineers and bomb squads. The so-called Medium Mine-Protected Vehicle program is essentially an MRAP adjunct but has slightly tougher requirements than MRAP I. And if the new Bushmaster — with its side doors, raised roof and bigger payload — meets the MMPV standards, it should be good for MRAP II, too, Montalio says.

Regards,

BUG

 

[gf0012-aust]

this is the details from an Ausa-based article on ARES blog..........

Regards,

BUG

it took over a year of tests to assess bushmaster (and others) in its current guise.

as soon as you add doors (eg) that means that you'd have to requalify the vehicle again (if you wanted to pitch it into Aust service)

 

[lobbie111]

Thanks for the info they better get in it would be great seeing something Aussie that we can be proud to have designed

 

[buglerbilly]

it took over a year of tests to assess bushmaster (and others) in its current guise.

as soon as you add doors (eg) that means that you'd have to requalify the vehicle again (if you wanted to pitch it into Aust service)

It does in most Services of course BUT it would be a much-abbreviated qualfication routine for such changes.

You'd have to question exactly how much of a qualification routine some MRAP I vehciels went thru for example...............

"Ordered with indecent haste" is an expression that springs to mind.........no idea why.........NOT!

 

[buglerbilly]

Thanks for the info they better get in it would be great seeing something Aussie that we can be proud to have designed

Hmmm depends on how you qualify Aussie.

An Irish original design by a company now owned by the Singaporeans modified for use in the Americas by a US company from Aussie-built, in-service vehicles thru a European-owned company.............a real Aussie vehicle this one!

Regards,

BUG

 

[gf0012-aust]

It does in most Services of course BUT it would be a much-abbreviated qualfication routine for such changes.

You'd have to question exactly how much of a qualification routine some MRAP I vehciels went thru for example...............

"Ordered with indecent haste" is an expression that springs to mind.........no idea why.........NOT!

it does make you wonder at how fast "fast tracking" really is...

 

[MARKMILES77]

AGRA:However the Government is pissed off big time with Thales australia and Oshkosh for not selling Bushmasters to the US Army for MRAP.

Why is the Government pissed off?

lobbie111: thanks for the info agra it would have been a great complement to the bushmaster in my opinion 5 tonnes you say wow more than i thought

The 6X6 Copperhead is said to have a payload of 10 tonne!

jacktar: But we will have to wait until after the election to see if anything will ever come of the Copperhead.

Might be one area where an ALP win would be an advantage!
The Oshkosh/Thales offer for Project Overlander would have delivered around 700 Copperheads as part of this project but obviously the Government chose to go with the FMTV. Perhaps the ALP might make a Copperhead order to kick start this derivative?

BUG: There is an argument that says we should procure Portee's rather than traditional gun tractors for our new M-777's

If the Portee route is not chosen, then I have long felt a good choice would be the Copperhead 6X6 with dual cab. It retains a significant rear cargo deck which could carry a large load of shells/charges. I'd guestimate 6 tonnes worth. Plus retains the ability to tow the M777, while offering the crew a high level of protection. Single cab 6X6s with the full 10 tonne payload could act as ammunition carriers.

BUG: with a development of Bushies with higher roof, side doors for Driver & Commander, etc.

Photos anywhere?


And does anyone know the development status of the 6X6 Bushmasters/ Copperheads? It was reported in early 2006 that ADI had started development of the 6X6 Copperhead.
Is there actually a driving 6X6 Copperhead prototype in existance?
Is there a 6X6 Bushmaster (with the higher levels of armour and mine protection that that would allow) prototype that can be shown to the Americans.

Now if I was in Government, I would change Australia's latest order of 254 Bushmaster 4X4s to an order for 254 of the 6X6 Bushmaster.
A firm order would boost it's chances in the US, provide security for Thales to commit to full development and provide a vehicle with even higher levels of protection to the ADF. Win, Win!

 

[MARKMILES77]

Forget to ask, will a 6X6 Bushmaster have the four front wheel configuration (two front axles) that the Timoney MP-66 is rumoured to have?

The 6X6 Copperhead would obviously need two rear axles.

 

[buglerbilly]

Photos anywhere?

You asking me for photos, me the image whore of Australia!

Dude IF I had them I'd show them................:unknown

Forget to ask, will a 6X6 Bushmaster have the four front wheel configuration (two front axles) that the Timoney MP-66 is rumoured to have?

The 6X6 Copperhead would obviously need two rear axles.

I never clearly understood nor accepted that the four front wheels offered anything compared to the more normal back arrangement IF one of the back wheel axles steers as well (or even both back axles). All-wheel steering has to be the way to go IMHO.

 

[lobbie111]

yeah I see what you mean because the load would be at the back but you have to take into account the weight of added protection and all the equipment like air con and the fresh water tank (if installed) so that kind of explains the odd arrangment but that is opinion not fact so if you do have the information please tell me thanks...

 

[gf0012-aust]

the fresh water tank (if installed)...

its part of the ballistic protection design

 

[lobbie111]

Ballistic protection design...so both 4x4 and 6x6 designs have one integrated on it? where is it exactly on the vehicle i cant find a pic

 

[Aussie Digger]

Ballistic protection design...so both 4x4 and 6x6 designs have one integrated on it? where is it exactly on the vehicle i cant find a pic

You won't find it in a photo either. My understanding is they are fitted under the crew compartment of the vehicles.

The "chilling"" equipment is finally to be added eventually too, I hear...

 

[jacktar]

You won't find it in a photo either. My understanding is they are fitted under the crew compartment of the vehicles.

The "chilling"" equipment is finally to be added eventually too, I hear...

Yes, the drinking water tank is located in the rear under the compartment floor. The Cold water chiller was in the original design but was removed as a cost saving exercise. The cost of re-engineering and retrofit to put it back in is yet another example of false economy.

The 6 x 6 is standard 4 rear wheel configuration.

Using the current Arvin Meritor axles on the Bushmaster, it would be relatively easy to have all wheel steering. The current model has the same axles front and rear, so the steering components are already fitted to the rear axle. The rear axles are currently just locked to steer straight ahead. You would still have to devise a steering linkage system etc. but it would make the job easier.

 

[buglerbilly]

Using the current Arvin Meritor axles on the Bushmaster, it would be relatively easy to have all wheel steering. The current model has the same axles front and rear, so the steering components are already fitted to the rear axle. The rear axles are currently just locked to steer straight ahead. You would still have to devise a steering linkage system etc. but it would make the job easier.

Hmm that would make it easy to achieve...........

Increasing the agility of wheeled armoured vehicles has always struck me as a huge plus when operating around semi-urban areas, villages and towns as we are in parts of Iraq (and Afghainstan if it comes to that).

Regards,

BUG

 

[lobbie111]

I was under the impression that the bushmaster was already a highly mobile beast, does a 6x6 configuration limit mobility to an extent?

 

[MARKMILES77]

jacktar: The 6 x 6 is standard 4 rear wheel configuration.

jacktar, are you aware of whether there are actual 6X6 variants in existence or whether they are merely a paper/theoretical excercise?

 

[gf0012-aust]

jacktar, are you aware of whether there are actual 6X6 variants in existence or whether they are merely a paper/theoretical excercise?

I'm pretty sure that I saw a sixer at one of the LWC's recently. I thought that ADI had one on external display at Sydney a few years back (along with some counter battery radar systems)

 

[kato]

jacktar, are you aware of whether there are actual 6X6 variants in existence or whether they are merely a paper/theoretical excercise?

There's a single mild steel demonstrator hull of the Bushmaster MP66. No production versions.

 

[MARKMILES77]

There's a single mild steel demonstrator hull of the Bushmaster MP66. No production versions.

At ADI or at Timoney?