I would have to check the Defence Capability Plans and White Papers for the timeframe
Presumably the FRES contenders are options, but equally other systems will be as well once tenders are called for
I am not sure about the AS90,
the SPH has been narrowed down to two options the PzH2000 and the AS-9 (Australian version of the South Korean K-9)
As far as I know there has been nothing official for some time, it may be that the SPH aspect of Land17 is on hold.
Fres contract as you know has now been signed the down side the system the goverment has gone for is the one the British Army does not want, the one we wanted was removed from the bidding early and the 2nd choice cv90 was not picked dispite the armys request, so will be intresting when the first systems come on line and ATDU get there hands on them for full trials.
the other issue is the combat wieght, as the current RECCE has a combat wieght of 7 tons the new system is reported at 30 to 40 tons, which restricts its transportablity, and would not have been able to have been used in the falklands in support of the infantry so there are concerns in the UK.
the other issue is the combat wieght, as the current RECCE has a combat wieght of 7 tons the new system is reported at 30 to 40 tons, which restricts its transportablity, and would not have been able to have been used in the falklands in support of the infantry so there are concerns in the UK.
from the Defence White Paper 2009
9.38 The Government places a high priority on the survivability and mobility of our land forces. To meet this priority, Defence intends to acquire a new fleet of around 1,100 deployable protected vehicles. These new vehicles will replace existing armoured personnel carriers, mobility vehicles and other combat vehicles which, in the past, have had limited or no protection. These new vehicles will offer greatly improved firepower, protection and mobility, in response to the increasing complexity and lethality of land operations. In the shorter term, Defence will continue to upgrade the protection, mobility and firepower of the M113 Armoured Personnel Carriers, some of which are already in service. By the time this project is completed in late 2011, the Army will have around 430 of these enhanced vehicles.
from the Defence Capability Plan 2009 (under planning for capabilities beyond 2013 pg 17)
Land Combat Vehicles. The LAND 400 project will aim to replace and enhance those combat systems currently provided by M113, ASLAV and Bushmaster. The project is likely to be split into phases to deal with vehicle classes or capabilities. This is likely to be an ACAT I Program and Defence will commence work on developing this project for Government consideration after 2016.
It seems to me that nothing much will happen before 2016, so perhaps the timeframe for these to be in service is somewhere around 2020+
Just out of curiosity what was " the one we wanted", and why wasn't it in the bidding?
Originally the Piranha V was selected for the FRES program, but that fee through
I believe the FRES been broken up into component projects with the CV90 being selected for the reconnaisance role.
As far as the ADF goes, the FRES programs will likely be options, but equally other systems will be viable options, particularly as it won't really happen until 2016+
It is also quite possible that the we use multiple systems for different roles (not unlike what is happening with the FRES). For example, a tracked vehicle like Puma, CV90 or ASCOD could be used to replace the APCs in the mechanised units an something like Piranha V or VBCI could replace the ASLAV
I guess from an ADF point of view, it is worth keeping an eye on the FRES program and we could leverage the experience and lessons learned when it comes time for LAND400 to start ramping up.
From memory it had to do with the ownership of the Piranha V design, between the UK MOD and General Dynamics UK.
"Defence Secretary John Hutton said he was withdrawing the company's provisional preferred bidder status as the two sides had been unable to reach commercial agreement on a deal to supply the Piranha V design under the current procurement strategy."
But really this should be discussed in the British Army thread....
Defence Department Tenders Investigation | BAE Systems
Now this is a fairly detailed story and somewhat alarming if true.
I find the line ".....Marshall was already despised by top brass within the Defence Materiel Organisation. Four years earlier, he had helped expose a major contracting scandal in the same area of the DMO, "
disturbing, again if true - why is it that whistleblowers in this country always attract such strong feelings of resentment? I can only imagine that it's from those that got bitten by being corrupt or incompetent. Which is scary that they may still be in their positions.
rb
Now this is a fairly detailed story and somewhat alarming if true.
I find the line ".....Marshall was already despised by top brass within the Defence Materiel Organisation. Four years earlier, he had helped expose a major contracting scandal in the same area of the DMO, "
disturbing, again if true - why is it that whistleblowers in this country always attract such strong feelings of resentment? I can only imagine that it's from those that got bitten by being corrupt or incompetent. Which is scary that they may still be in their positions.
rb
The FRES programme has been turned on its head by A-STAN. A wheeled variant is no longer a priority because of the UOR purchases of Coyote, Jackal, Warthog, Viking, Ridgeback, Mastiff et al. Plus the Canadian experience with wheeled vehicles in winter conditions exposed its limitations.
The UK went for ASCOD over CV90 because it's a better platform and can carry more additional weight in the form of armour upgrades. The military preferred it over CV90 for that very reason. BAE has the better turret though, and I suspect it will be chosen for the Warrior upgrade. As long as FRES Recce and Warrior us the same gun configuration (40mm) why not split the work load between GD and BAE.
BAE has actually been asked to restart manufacturing of CVRT hulls. The 30 + year old platform remains popular because of its speed and performance in harsh conditions. Maybe they should retro-fit the BAE/GD turret on that platform?
SOF afganistan
Australian special forces are using the new British camo???
or were we cooperating with the brits or some other reason???
Operation SLIPPER Afghanistan - Department of Defence
interesting no?
why is that isn't our normal camo good enough?
Australian special forces are using the new British camo???
or were we cooperating with the brits or some other reason???
Operation SLIPPER Afghanistan - Department of Defence
interesting no?
why is that isn't our normal camo good enough?
A
Aussie Digger
Guest
What? Which soldier? I see Australian soldiers wearing Auscam in some of those photos...
I also see US and Afghani operators too. Who's to say a UK operator couldn't have been involved in these shots?
http://www.defence.gov.au/op/afghanistan/gallery/2010/20100507/20100425_909_0059.jpg
that is what i thought originally, but this picture in particular made me think that Australians were using the new camo...
if you look carefully he is wearing both the brit stuff and auscam.
also the captions identify some as Australian but the may be wrong as they have been in the past.
http://www.defence.gov.au/op/afghanistan/gallery/2010/20100507/20100424_909_0103.jpg
and in this picture the man crouching on the roof has what appears to be an Australian flag badge...
the flag badge like the one this guy is wearing...
http://www.defence.gov.au/op/afghanistan/gallery/2010/20100504a/20100428adf8246638_201.jpg
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New Army Vehicles
Hi guy's, not sure if this has been covered in the thread before, is so appologies. Would be interested in hearing opinions on the likelyhood of the Australian Army getting new vehicles along the lines of the EFV (Expeditionary Fighting Vehicle) which is under development in the US ? With the new Canberra class on the way and a big change in ADF capabilities would seem such a vehicle would be a smart buy ? If not the EFV, what other types of vehicles are available on the market to fill such a role. My thinking is the available distance such a vehicle can travel in the sea mode would be extremely usefull, expecially with the Canberra class lacking self defence at this stage, over the horizon deployment would be an advantage ?
Hi guy's, not sure if this has been covered in the thread before, is so appologies. Would be interested in hearing opinions on the likelyhood of the Australian Army getting new vehicles along the lines of the EFV (Expeditionary Fighting Vehicle) which is under development in the US ? With the new Canberra class on the way and a big change in ADF capabilities would seem such a vehicle would be a smart buy ? If not the EFV, what other types of vehicles are available on the market to fill such a role. My thinking is the available distance such a vehicle can travel in the sea mode would be extremely usefull, expecially with the Canberra class lacking self defence at this stage, over the horizon deployment would be an advantage ?
The defensive capacity of a Canberra isn't particularly lacking when you consider if it has to be deployed anywhere near a credible threat it'll very likely be accompanied by multiple warships...
I've never heard anything about any Australian interest in the EFV or similar vehicles, though there are more well-informed people hereabouts who could probably give you a more detailed rundown as to whether its necessary and what we would be looking at if we did need it.
Personally I think the chances are nil, but I'm happy to be corrected.
A canberra deployment into a hot zone would be huge.
Min would be escorted by an AWD and atleast 1 frigate that would be just from australia. More likely as part of a massive international task force with a supercarrier or US/uk amphibs and cruisers and destroyers The LHD are designed to sit inside the defence umbrella of other ships.Most of the time the canberras are designed to be deployed together, so they will go with everything we can offer.
A EFV might be concidered if we have a need for it and the project is generally a sucess. At the moment we have stacks of procurements that results in it not really being a priority, tracked artillary, bushmasters, M113 upgrades, etc. Money is proberly better spent else where as that particular area has yet to offer definative models to purchase and intergrate.
Min would be escorted by an AWD and atleast 1 frigate that would be just from australia. More likely as part of a massive international task force with a supercarrier or US/uk amphibs and cruisers and destroyers The LHD are designed to sit inside the defence umbrella of other ships.Most of the time the canberras are designed to be deployed together, so they will go with everything we can offer.
A EFV might be concidered if we have a need for it and the project is generally a sucess. At the moment we have stacks of procurements that results in it not really being a priority, tracked artillary, bushmasters, M113 upgrades, etc. Money is proberly better spent else where as that particular area has yet to offer definative models to purchase and intergrate.
This is pretty old (pre GFC), but it is straight from the horses mouth so to speak.
http://www.defence.gov.au/capability/LEWGBRIEFS/docs/LAND 400 UPDATE.pps.
LOT for M1113 & ASLAV is stated as 2020
rb
It is obvious with the coming Canberra class that Australia will not have a dedicated Marine corps. Does anyone have any info on what the Army's intentions are ? Will they set up a "Marine" style detachment assigned to the ships, with maybe rotational detachment's out of Townsville for instance ? Any information appreciated