how would the UK defend from ICBMs?
- Thread starter Jambo_100
- Start date
Good to see that you worked out how to start a new thread Jambo. Welcome to the Forum.
I believe that the UK's defence, at this time, is its deterrent force of SSBNs that are deployed to ensure that such an attack doesn't happen.
Your question raises a worry that a lot of people are starting to have about an attack by a terrorist group who somehow get hold of a ballistic weapon and may be prepared to use it without fear of counter attack. It also raises the issue of defence against ballistic missiles with conventional warheads that might be used by a rogue state. A strike by the SSBNs would be inappropriate in these circumstances and therefore would not have a deterrent affect.
I stand to be corrected but I think that the Aster 30 SAM which will be deployed on the Type 45 destroyers would have some anti ballistic missile capability.
Cheers
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #4
I appreciate the question & why it was asked, but I don't understand the logic.
I believe that the UK is reasonably safe from such attack at the moment. The technology, never mind the funds or the reasoning required for such an attack to take place mean that IWO threat levels, this is just above Martians shooting us up with their green laser beams!
The logistics of such an action basically mean that the equipment/technology needed (launch facilities, tracking, access to satelites, etc) wouldn't go un-noticed by our neighbours & allies, who would probably try & avert it happening to the best of their abilities.
The other side of such an action is reasoning.
Only a complete maniac, who wanted to destroy the planet would contemplate such a move. ICBM's are usually wholly for the use of Nuclear warheads. If any of the few countries across the globe that have access to them / their technology, found that one was "missing", or had been hijacked & went missing, then no doubt the media worldwide would be alerted, as well as military forces, to track it down.
Finally, why would anyone want to attack the UK......?
Systems Adict
I believe that the UK is reasonably safe from such attack at the moment. The technology, never mind the funds or the reasoning required for such an attack to take place mean that IWO threat levels, this is just above Martians shooting us up with their green laser beams!
The logistics of such an action basically mean that the equipment/technology needed (launch facilities, tracking, access to satelites, etc) wouldn't go un-noticed by our neighbours & allies, who would probably try & avert it happening to the best of their abilities.
The other side of such an action is reasoning.
Only a complete maniac, who wanted to destroy the planet would contemplate such a move. ICBM's are usually wholly for the use of Nuclear warheads. If any of the few countries across the globe that have access to them / their technology, found that one was "missing", or had been hijacked & went missing, then no doubt the media worldwide would be alerted, as well as military forces, to track it down.
Finally, why would anyone want to attack the UK......?
Systems Adict
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #6
Icbm
the USA is under constant threat from terrorists and rogue states like iran and N.korea. britain possibly being USA's closest ally is under threat. we help the americans in wars we shouldnt get envolved in and therfore the Uk is under threat. what if terrorists we are fighting got hold of a nuclear weapon? what if iran or N.korea fired at us? it is quite possible for Al-Quida to get hold of a nuke, remeber iran are supposedly making them and iran fund terrorism. so do N.korea. the UK should a number of patriot missiles or something similar to defend itself. germany have already done it so it would be wise if we did it aswell. the ground based air defence missile we have is the rapier and its only a short distance missile, 5km range.
though a rapier managed to track a B-2 bomber at an airshow, the british MoD released the video and it caused a massive uproar. but i cant find it on the net.
the USA is under constant threat from terrorists and rogue states like iran and N.korea. britain possibly being USA's closest ally is under threat. we help the americans in wars we shouldnt get envolved in and therfore the Uk is under threat. what if terrorists we are fighting got hold of a nuclear weapon? what if iran or N.korea fired at us? it is quite possible for Al-Quida to get hold of a nuke, remeber iran are supposedly making them and iran fund terrorism. so do N.korea. the UK should a number of patriot missiles or something similar to defend itself. germany have already done it so it would be wise if we did it aswell. the ground based air defence missile we have is the rapier and its only a short distance missile, 5km range.
though a rapier managed to track a B-2 bomber at an airshow, the british MoD released the video and it caused a massive uproar. but i cant find it on the net.
How often do B-2s fly over a Rapier at 5km height?
Sorry couldn't resist...
As to terrorists using ICBMs to deliver a nuclear weapon? How should they? Using ICBMs is not that easy...
And terrorists who are able to get a WMD are not dumb.
Put it into a container and ship it to New York.
That's it.
And against states the nuclear deterrence provided by your boomers (Not to talk of the whole NATO) should be a good reason for not attacking you.
Sorry couldn't resist...
As to terrorists using ICBMs to deliver a nuclear weapon? How should they? Using ICBMs is not that easy...
And terrorists who are able to get a WMD are not dumb.
Put it into a container and ship it to New York.
That's it.
And against states the nuclear deterrence provided by your boomers (Not to talk of the whole NATO) should be a good reason for not attacking you.
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #8
UK missile defence
a scud missile is capable of holding nukes. iran are supposeldy developing nuclear weapons and have scuds and there are many long range ballistic missiles out there being developed. but what if a missile was launched at the UK. what would we do in the 10 minuits before it hit? would there be any way of intercepting it? aircraft with long range missiles? ship based missiles?
the thing about the B-2 - it happened at an airshow.
a scud missile is capable of holding nukes. iran are supposeldy developing nuclear weapons and have scuds and there are many long range ballistic missiles out there being developed. but what if a missile was launched at the UK. what would we do in the 10 minuits before it hit? would there be any way of intercepting it? aircraft with long range missiles? ship based missiles?
the thing about the B-2 - it happened at an airshow.
People always act out desperately when they are threatened, How about try to intercept the missile with F18E maybe:nonsense ? Chance are little, better than none. It seems UK have similar experiences in the WWII with V2. (just a joke)
Anyway, I am new and innocent, correct me if I am wrong. I do not believe that Iran or any terroist can have a long rang missile can have such a level of tech that can evade the current air defense of most advance countries. For example multiple war head or irregular dodge patterns. As long as they do not lay their hands on the space tech, we are pretty safe.
I believe it's easier to to set a nuke in UK via a container or make dirty bomb in the backyard. That's what we should worried about:shudder
Anyway, I am new and innocent, correct me if I am wrong. I do not believe that Iran or any terroist can have a long rang missile can have such a level of tech that can evade the current air defense of most advance countries. For example multiple war head or irregular dodge patterns. As long as they do not lay their hands on the space tech, we are pretty safe.
I believe it's easier to to set a nuke in UK via a container or make dirty bomb in the backyard. That's what we should worried about:shudder
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #10
missile defence
right, i know this probably wont ever happen but just imagine that it does!
ok then, imagine this
--------------------
An balistic missile is launched at the UK, the radar stations in the norht of england (flyingdales i think) detect it. we would usually have 10 - 12 minuits before the missile hits london. so then, what are the government going to do? are they going to try and interecpt it? if so, how are they going to do it? or are they just going to let it kill the intire population of london while they snuggle safely in there bunkers?
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any one have any ideas what they would do or what would happen?
right, i know this probably wont ever happen but just imagine that it does!
ok then, imagine this
--------------------
An balistic missile is launched at the UK, the radar stations in the norht of england (flyingdales i think) detect it. we would usually have 10 - 12 minuits before the missile hits london. so then, what are the government going to do? are they going to try and interecpt it? if so, how are they going to do it? or are they just going to let it kill the intire population of london while they snuggle safely in there bunkers?
---------------------
any one have any ideas what they would do or what would happen?
10~12mins?
I guess when the government knows the situation, perhaps another 2 mins has passed. What can the government do in such a short time anyway except order to fire all the Anti-Missile & Anti-Air weaponry at the missile hope to bring down to nuclear missile without let is blow up above the sky of the Island. There is not even enough time to launch fighters to intercept!
If that happens, I say forget about people:shudder , they are dead anyway. Let's prepare a speech to condemn this terrorist act and declare for war. There are may not be enough escape time for the head of the state:shudder
some one think know the correct way to protect yourself in such condition can save 9 life out of 10. Perhaps UK should dig out those instruction video during the cold-war and teach her people how to survive under a nuclear attack.
-------as far as I remember , a store of preserved food and water(tin , can etc```) some iodin-pill, respirator, clean clothes ```````
and when the shock wave came , take cover beside the roadbed, river bank ,hill foot in the oppsite direction . escape to the upper wind erea , use rain coat to sheild radiated dust `````etc
-------as far as I remember , a store of preserved food and water(tin , can etc```) some iodin-pill, respirator, clean clothes ```````
and when the shock wave came , take cover beside the roadbed, river bank ,hill foot in the oppsite direction . escape to the upper wind erea , use rain coat to sheild radiated dust `````etc
I always get a giggle out of reading this event presented as proof.
Apparently everyone forgets that US aircraft of that capability are always "transmission hot" when they are over proscribed air space.
The important counter to that is when the F117's were ferrying over saudi airspace during the gulf war. they radioed in to the ATC and asked for a courtesy permission to land. The AFB which was on full alert (as they were worried about an Iraqi air attack) stated that they couldn't see the aircraft on scan. The lead pilot at that stage was on finals - so visible to the tower but not visible on scope. Refer to Bandits over Bagdhad - written with ex stinkbug pilots contributing.
another example is also during desert storm. stinkbugs were inbound on proscribed corridors so as to keep their mission path clean. F-15's that were in WVR airspace and knew that the corridor existed could not see them.
thirdly, I was involved with the Rapier upgrade programme in aust, I can tell you that the rapier system (even with upgrades) would crap itself trying to find an emissions shutdown B2 or F-117.
Its a nice little story, but it ignores so much fact that its not funny.
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #14
if you dont beleive me go and look it up yourself! the MoD released the video but its annoying because its been classified again. this is because it caused an uproar. go and look it up yourself my friend. you probably dont know anything about it because you live in another country.
I'm well aware of the story. and its not classified at all - thats a load of bollocks.
I'm also patently aware of the fact that you've either made no attempt to read my post, or don't understand any of what I've written.
My living in another country has got nothing to do with anything - and I've probably travelled and worked in more countries than you've had hot breakfasts - which is an interesting data set but means stuff all.
Make the effort to read my post properly - and appreciate the fact that some of us in here might actually have a little clue as to what goes on in the real world as far as some of this stuff is concerned.
I'm not angry - I just get a tad frustrated when throw away comments are made.yes i did read your post. please dont get angry, im very sorry if i have annoyed you.
Apart from my prev comments there are other realities here.
- Military aircraft over civil controled airspace are "hot" - ie they emit "normally". hence thats why the rapier tracked the aircraft - it was lit up like a normal emitting aircraft and could be easily tracked
- The USAF is not going to bring its primary LO platform into open sky and open area flying space and have it "emission negative". Its dumb, it achieves nothing and its an opportunity for any other interrogating system to pick up aircraft characteristics when emission managed - something they won't do.
- I tried to give you examples of how difficult it was for a fully war alert battlespace to pick up a first generation stealth platform. The B2 is an order of magnitude better than an F-117. The Saudi sensor system at their AFB in Southern Saudi Arabia was an order of magnitude more powerful than anything that a rapier unit could hope to achieve.
- Stealth aircraft on combat missions are given restricted corridors to fly in - thats so other aircraft don't smack into them by accident because they can't sense them - again I gave the example of DS where aircraft (F-15's and Prowlers) were unable to see electronically the stinkbug and yet were in WVR (and even more so as they were in a parallel corridor). As soon as they hit controlled or saturated air space they light up like normal. eg, once the F117 raises its antenna it lights up on a scope - its profile is so finely tuned that raising the antenna/aerial to start comms means that it then becomes visible. In the case of the F117, once they hit the primary corridor, they are shutdown completely at a comms level. An F117 is nowhere near the LO capability of a B2, and is actually "louder" (signature wise) than an F-22.
Its certainly not classified - its regarded as a standing joke as its often trotted out as an example by some enthusiasts of the fallibility of stealth.
I'm trying to help you not make the same mistake - thats assuming you're in here to learn something new every now and then (like all of us)
I think Waylander hit right when he mentioned UK`s Boomers, also if any country was to try that stunt then they would feel the whole wrath of NATO including some additional tricks that the U.S would do in addition to our NATO obligations.
The suite case bomb is what scares me, how many did Russia lose or cannot account for or this only a bad rumor that was started up a few years ago.
The suite case bomb is what scares me, how many did Russia lose or cannot account for or this only a bad rumor that was started up a few years ago.
During the Kennedy administration, there was an atom bomb in the Soviet Embassy, probably brought in in pieces through diplomatic pouches. Kennedy knew it was there, but everyone kept quiet about it. The bomb was eventually removed, I think.
I got this from Time magazine, a couple of years ago.