Status of Ethiopian army - conflict in Somalia

[contedicavour]

I've read that the Ethiopian army fields some 160,000 soldiers, has some 500 T-55 and T-62 and 200 BMP/BRDM, besides 24 very useful MI-24 Hinds.
However, since these forces are likely to engage Somali Islamist forces soon, does someone know about the current organization and operational status of Ethiopia's army ?

thks

 

[Big-E]

They need to go back to war with Eritrea so they can get back a port. The way they were landlocked is just wrong.

 

[Snayke]

Man, I really need to get a new world map. Mine is from the Cold War and Eritrea isn't even on it.

 

[contedicavour]

They need to go back to war with Eritrea so they can get back a port. The way they were landlocked is just wrong.

Well, they've got Djibouti which is technically their harbour, even if it is an independent country.
Now their priority is making sure that Somalia doesn't turn into Taleban country. So they already have or soon will send the army into Somalia to protect the Transitional National Government from further expansion of the Islamic Courts movement.
This is why I'm asking if anyone knows how their army is organized and what is their operational status.

cheers

 

[Big-E]

I knew it's state of readiness was 30% and falling in 98'... can't imagine it being any better.

 

[adulis]

Ethiopian army is well trained in both conventional warfare as well as in guerrilla warfare. They have bought 50 T-72 tanks recently. Most Mbts they have are the T-55 and T-62. They have a modern tank repair facility to keep these old tanks running very well. Ethiopia has also about 2 dozen Mi-24 helicopter gunships, 6 su-39 close support aircrafts, lots of mig-21 and mig-23 jets. For air superiority they use 11 Su-27 fighters. Now it became clear that the Islamist militia was defeated with in one week of fighting. The usa army gave Satelite info to the Ethiopians

 

[Zzims]

No that I know much about the Ethiopian Army readiness. But they arent exactly fighting profesional soldiers in Somalia. even Eritrea fought them to a stalemate. They should stop doing all the meddling in neighbouring countries and focus on other things at hand.IMhO The country isnt really in a Golden state to be Attacking anyone and making enemies.

 

[Manfred]

It looks as if NOBODY knows for sure, damn.

I am glad somebody had the nerve to step in and do what had to be done, but how far will they go? Have the Pirates operating on the coast been taken care of yet?

 

[contedicavour]

The problem now is that there is an unknown number of Islamist guerrillas both in Mogadishu and in the bush on the Kenyan border, and they are causing mischief again (mortar fire on the airport for example).
Fighting the conventional war was going to be easy with SU27, MI24 and T72s but fighting a guerrilla war, especially the urban version, is another matter as we have all seen in Baghdad...

cheers

 

[Rich]

They aren't "meddling". They are deathly afraid of a Islamist entity surrounding them, stirring up a large part of their population, which is Muslim, and most of all they fear a united Somalian theocracy. Right now the separatists in northern Somalia, called Somaliland, provides ready access to port facilities for the all important coffee exports Ethiopia lives and dies with. A hostile/united Theocratic Somalia would be an even bigger problem for the Ethiopians as it would be for us.

Take a look on a map where Ethiopia sits and you will see what I'm talking about. Their geography puts them at ground zero in this 40yo clash between cultures I keep telling you about, and you all keep calling me a bigot for saying. And once the Islamists win the Somalian battleground they would next move on Djibouti, the last economic lifeline for the secular central African nations. Thats their goal, they are thinking 4 chess moves ahead. And once they hold Political/military power they can force their brand of religion and sharia Law on everyone. Dont underestimate this loose coalition of revolutionary Islamists.

In Djibouti they know they are on the hot seat which is why they currently host both Yank and French troops and are spending 4 & 1/2% of their GNP on defense. To bad they dont also spend 4&1/2% of the money they make in their sex/slave and child/slave exports to Arab countries. But, I dont want to say anything disparaging.

Besides I heard after a lot of Yank/Western pressure the Arabs are tying little mechanical children to their camels, for their camel races, instead of their foreign slave children. http://www.camelraces.com/

I hope I didnt lose my shot at "World citizen of the year" by pointing that out.

 

[Tasman]

In Djibouti they know they are on the hot seat which is why they currently host both Yank and French troops and are spending 4 & 1/2% of their GNP on defense. To bad they dont also spend 4&1/2% of the money they make in their sex/slave and child/slave exports to Arab countries. But, I dont want to say anything disparaging.

Besides I heard after a lot of Yank/Western pressure the Arabs are tying little mechanical children to their camels, for their camel races, instead of their foreign slave children. http://www.camelraces.com/

I hope I didnt lose my shot at "World citizen of the year" by pointing that out.

I found this an interesting post Rich. What really worries me is that the West seems to be once again propping up a regime where appalling practices like those you describe are carried out. It is a bit too reminiscent of supporting the Mujahideen in Afghanistan for my liking.

Cheers

 

[radiosilence]

Rich do you get-off on piling on Arabs?

 

[Rich]

Rich do you get-off on piling on Arabs?

Your kidding right? Are you a father?

I found this an interesting post Rich. What really worries me is that the West seems to be once again propping up a regime where appalling practices like those you describe are carried out. It is a bit too reminiscent of supporting the Mujahideen in Afghanistan for my liking.

I dont know if you were alive during our support of the Mujahideen, or of age, but its funny how history has almost forgotten it was one of the most brilliant strategic moves this country has ever done. First off, and people always forget this, there were many factions of the Mujahideen. Osama Bin Laden was never supported by America, the west, or the CIA. I dont want to twist this thread around but, Ive posted on this before, but I will say Al Qaeda is like The Mickey Mouse Club compared to the Soviet Union. Besides Bin Laden wasnt Mujahideen per say ; He was a founding member of the Maktab al-Khadamat which raised funds/recruited for the Holy War. The seeds of what became Al Qaeda didn't begin to form until about the time the Soviets left and their empire crumbled.

So I dont think supporting the Mujahideen really qualifies as a warming. If your going to play "the game", and unfortunately we have to, you have to anticipate your enemies moves and either block them or frustrate them in some way. We were forced to do it in the cold war and we are forced to do it now. Believe me the regime in Djibouti is not the only odorous regime we are supporting. There simply is no choice because the alternative is unacceptable.

And its why from the beginning I sensed a Yank hand in the planning and execution of the Ethiopian attack on the emerging Somalian theocracy. Somalia was becoming another Al Qaeda base for Jihad as Afghanistan was, and the ICU was becoming another Taliban. The opening shots of this war in Africa were actually back in 1998 when our Kenyan and Tanzanian embassies were bombed by Al Qaeda operating out of Somalia, along with an Israeli Hotel in Kenya in 2002. In actuality the war for East Africa started with our stupid "Blackhawk down" days in Somalia when Al Qaeda was already in country training the forces of War Lord Mohammed Farah Aidid.

And while they have an overall strategy the really important factor is this region is pretty ripe for their kind of activity. Corrupt Officials, divided cultural, tribal, and religious factions. And almost a constant state of conflict. Here again, we simply have no choice but to nation build.

Maybe Radio silence can do better. Hes such a great contributor to these threads.

 

[merocaine]

Besides I heard after a lot of Yank/Western pressure the Arabs are tying little mechanical children to their camels, for their camel races, instead of their foreign slave children. http://www.camelraces.com/

I hope I didnt lose my shot at "World citizen of the year" by pointing that out.

what is the relevence of this to the state of the Ethiopian army?

 

[Tasman]

I dont know if you were alive during our support of the Mujahideen, or of age, but its funny how history has almost forgotten it was one of the most brilliant strategic moves this country has ever done. First off, and people always forget this, there were many factions of the Mujahideen. Osama Bin Laden was never supported by America, the west, or the CIA. I dont want to twist this thread around but, Ive posted on this before, but I will say Al Qaeda is like The Mickey Mouse Club compared to the Soviet Union. Besides Bin Laden wasnt Mujahideen per say ; He was a founding member of the Maktab al-Khadamat which raised funds/recruited for the Holy War. The seeds of what became Al Qaeda didn't begin to form until about the time the Soviets left and their empire crumbled.

So I dont think supporting the Mujahideen really qualifies as a warming. If your going to play "the game", and unfortunately we have to, you have to anticipate your enemies moves and either block them or frustrate them in some way. We were forced to do it in the cold war and we are forced to do it now. Believe me the regime in Djibouti is not the only odorous regime we are supporting. There simply is no choice because the alternative is unacceptable.

And its why from the beginning I sensed a Yank hand in the planning and execution of the Ethiopian attack on the emerging Somalian theocracy. Somalia was becoming another Al Qaeda base for Jihad as Afghanistan was, and the ICU was becoming another Taliban. The opening shots of this war in Africa were actually back in 1998 when our Kenyan and Tanzanian embassies were bombed by Al Qaeda operating out of Somalia, along with an Israeli Hotel in Kenya in 2002. In actuality the war for East Africa started with our stupid "Blackhawk down" days in Somalia when Al Qaeda was already in country training the forces of War Lord Mohammed Farah Aidid.

And while they have an overall strategy the really important factor is this region is pretty ripe for their kind of activity. Corrupt Officials, divided cultural, tribal, and religious factions. And almost a constant state of conflict. Here again, we simply have no choice but to nation build.

Yes. In fact I'd been alive for quite some time!

I found your explanation of the reasons for the US backing the Mujahideen enlightening. Certainly in the days of Soviet occupation I think there was general support in my country for the idea of backing anyone who opposed them and it was probably only after the Taliban seized power that questions began to be asked about whether the US had done the right thing. Perhaps some of us haven't discriminated between the Mujahideen as a whole and the Taliban as a part.

Supporting a group like the regime in Djibouti worries me but that doesn't mean I disagree with doing it for the greater good. I just hope that in the process of providing support influence can be applied to change the more 'odorous' aspects of the regime. In your earlier post you hinted that this is in fact happening with your reference to them using "little mechanical children" for their camel races, instead of "their foreign slave children." So that is at least a step in the right direction.

Cheers

 

[contedicavour]

Ehm folks we're getting off topic.
The whole point is about if and how the Ethiopian troops can provide enough of a safe heaven to stabilize Somalia so that the TNG can try governing it properly. This won't erase overnight 32 years of dictatorship (1969-1991) and 16 years of civil war between tens of factions (1991-2007).
When I think that the GDP per person was higher in 1960 when our UN sanctioned protectorate ended and the place became independent...

cheers

 

[Tasman]

Ehm folks we're getting off topic.
The whole point is about if and how the Ethiopian troops can provide enough of a safe heaven to stabilize Somalia so that the TNG can try governing it properly. This won't erase overnight 32 years of dictatorship (1969-1991) and 16 years of civil war between tens of factions (1991-2007).
When I think that the GDP per person was higher in 1960 when our UN sanctioned protectorate ended and the place became independent...

cheers

Yes your right contedicavour. I know I got into Djibouti and 'stayed' there!

The worry to me is that Ethiopian troops will not remain, or certainly not in sufficient numbers, for the country to be stabilised sufficiently. What will happen when the Ethiopian troops leave Somalia? In another thread, Get your war on' down in the Horn, in General Military Defence, we've discussed the need for a UN type intervention force for this reason.

Cheers

 

[contedicavour]

Yes your right contedicavour. I know got into Djibouti and 'stayed' there!

The worry to me is that Ethiopian troops will not remain, or certainly not in sufficient numbers, for the country to be stabilised sufficiently. What will happen when the Ethiopian troops leave Somalia? In another thread, Get your war on' down in the Horn, in General Military Defence, we've discussed the need for a UN type intervention force for this reason.

Cheers

Yep I guess we could merge the 2 threads since they are 100% converging.

The only hope is that Uganda and the other AU troops will be effective enough to replace the Ethiopian troops.

cheers

 

[radiosilence]

Ethiopian troops began pulling out from Somalia about a month ago. The initial plan was to pull out a third of their troops then gradually pull out competely and replaced by AU peacekeeping troops. Its very costly to maitain the approximately 10,000 Ethiopian troops present in Somalia who are very unpopular with the locals. The international community should help strengthen the central govt. and in return the govt. of Somalia would be expected to govern in a transparent manner. The reason the ICU came to power was because the because the locals didn't have any confidence in the govt. who was corrupted.

 

[Rich]

what is the relevence of this to the state of the Ethiopian army?

None whatsoever. I just have such a deeply entrenched hatred of anyone who would victimize children that I lose control at times. I hope my views on the strategy and history of the region, and how it connects with Ethiopia and their army, did provide a contribution to the thread.

In the future I will devote 100% of my efforts to locking such monsters up in jail for a long, long time. Instead of talking about it in Internet forums.

Again, my sincere apologies.