US Army making recruiting targets

[RubiconNZ]

I don't doubt the mission of the army is to protect.
But the mentality of "having fun" in battlefield is a dangerous one to have. This is exactly why we have these scandals of Private Kovco and also ADF soldiers displaying blantant disregard of law. ("Playing" with firearms in barrack- and you wonder why there wasn't more)

Worst would be to "seek" fun in local population, and resulting in such thing as
Mahmudiyah incident.

Fair enough then, I'm rather defensive of soldiers, so I can get wound up fast, I agree about the negativity and bad attitudes my biggest worry for consequences of that is how it portrays service men/women, the treatment of Returned Serviceman from Vietnam is one of Australia’s and the US biggest disgraces in my books, I fear similar results, I mean in the UK just recently return squadies wounded complained of poor treatment from staff and other patients in the Hospital because of anti war attitudes can you imagine hopsital views mistreating fellow countrymen because of poltical views , in terms of recruiting to tie it back to the thread if that kind of treatment continued it would make it pretty tough to justify signing on. Its hard to call it patriotism if a large normally louder group decries all purpose and reason for soldiers serving overseas.

 

[dioditto]

Thanks!

Umm maybe but not in mine. Like Icelord said, I mean the experience of being in the forces.

You seem to think like a lot of people I know, mainly uni people, who immediatley relate anything to do with the military to killing. This to me is disturbing. I never get into the whole 'killing is killing, or is killing for ones country different' debate, its one you cant win. Im not having a go at you, I just wonder why that is (in general, not personaly) because if that perception could be challenged then maybe there would be less trouble with recruting.

I know what I say seems excessive, I am sorry I have said it. But I just think it is disturbing to put "fun" together with "military".

I mean, to consider a person who is handling the firearm (and trained to kill) to talk about "FUN"? what image does that suppose to give to general public?

 

[dioditto]

The US may have some "novel" ways of recruiting. I can tell you that how it done in my country, it is nothing but sober. "Fancy" ways of recruiting would be subject to fierce criticism.

I think you're letting yourself being taken away by ideology and semantics, disregarding the motives and very serious choices and considerations behind a military career.

It may be lack of empathy or comprehension, it could also be an unwillingness to accept that others may have a different outlook because it doesn't fit yours.

I am not. Trust me, I fully support Steve's joining of military.

And indeed this is a VERY SERIOUS CHOICE FOR CAREER. One that is more serious than any other career. I just hope that he or anyone would understand what's at stake, and what level of professionalism and ethics is required.

 

[dioditto]

Fair enough then, I'm rather defensive of soldiers, so I can get wound up fast, I agree about the negativity and bad attitudes my biggest worry for consequences of that is how it portrays service men/women, the treatment of Returned Serviceman from Vietnam is one of Australia’s and the US biggest disgraces in my books, I fear similar results, I mean in the UK just recently return squadies wounded complained of poor treatment from staff and other patients in the Hospital because of anti war attitudes can you imagine hopsital views mistreating fellow countrymen because of poltical views , in terms of recruiting to tie it back to the thread if that kind of treatment continued it would make it pretty tough to justify signing on. Its hard to call it patriotism if a large normally louder group decries all purpose and reason for soldiers serving overseas.

I think these are seperate issues. I have highest regard of soldiers serving in Vietnam who fights with professionalism for their country. And I do not condone the disrespect of these soldiers. What I do not support is the war. This is a political issue, not one to be confused with the one serving it.

My main point of concern in this is professionalism. As I stated in previous post, this is a serious issue, as a lot of soldier may consider the battlefield is a "plaything". That is why I stated that it is a dangerous mentality to have.

 

[Grand Danois]

I am not. Trust me, I fully support Steve's joining of military.

And indeed this is a VERY SERIOUS CHOICE FOR CAREER. One that is more serious than any other career. I just hope that he or anyone would understand what's at stake, and what level of professionalism and ethics is required.

Well, I expect the highest standard when servicemen are abroad. They represent me too.

There has been minor incidents. We've had no Totenkopfskandalen, though.

 

[Waylander]

Don't relate FUN to the military because of what?
Nobody talks about having fun while killing people.
It is all about the daily service together with comrades.

 

[Grand Danois]

Don't relate FUN to the military because of what?
Nobody talks about having fun while killing people.
It is all about the daily service together with comrades.

And those who like the physically active outdoor life and makes a career of it.

 

[icelord]

I think the perceptions of a lot of people joining the military nowadays is that it is exciting, it is just like a "VIDEO GAME". This isn't helped by the fact that US Army is using exactly that, video game as recruitment tool. So, it is not too far fetch to assume that a lot of soldiers exhibit such mentality.

Hmm, seeing as how the navy has launched the battleships game as part of its recruiting, as well as a sims like version of HMAS Stuart should we be worried that our officers will continually say "you sunk my battleship" every time we go into excercises or combat. As for the sims, does the upgrade have a dating version...o wait it does, the expansions called HMAS Cerberus:nutkick

Perhaps it is a little bit excessive. I am sorry I have say it. But I like to bring my point across. Becoming a professional soldier is a serious business.

Indeed it is, but may i remind you that Digger history has a lot of fun in the service being had by all, from gallipoli to Iraq, troops have found ways of taking their mind of the seriousness of war, The Kovco situation comes down to this, he broke the rules and he paid the ultimate price, whether anyone is willing to believe it, that pistol should NOT HAVE BEEN THERE in the first place, and the completed report should be stating this.
Of course something stupid will happen when a group of men are let to roam free, but most if not all of the troops are trained to be better behaved, otherwise they're kicked out on their arse without any question.

What does my party affliation have to do with anything? What?? I can't state my opinion now ?? Only rightwing rednecks are allowed to state his opinions?

Hmm, you may have missed the joke on that one, i was commenting on the placing of the word killing into a talk about the military

 

[abramsteve]

I agree its a very serious job, but I still beleive that I will get a great deal out of it, not the least being job satisfaction and enjoyment. My Grandfather served in the RAAF during the war and he talks often of the good times, however once he told me about a not so good time when the Japanese were shelling the airfield. Its about the pro and the cons, somthing common to all jobs. One of my mates works at Holdens, he loves it, and you know what his job is? Inspecting car chassis for any dangerous imprefections. If he stuffs up people might die, he knows this but he still has a good time.

Speaking from personal experience I beileve that you may be a little worried about nothing. I know for a fact that people who join (or at least attempt to) with a 'video game' mentality will not get far at all, certainly not anywhere where they might harm others or themselves. This is to do with the high level of profesionalism that the modern service man/woman must have in order to be elgiable for service, a job characteristic which I think is also of great personal benifit. Trust me, lots of people get turned away because they dont meet the right psychological profile required.

I see what you mean when you worry about taking any military role to lightheartedly, but as long as training standards remain high then I dont think there should be any problem.

 

[Big-E]

I know what I say seems excessive, I am sorry I have said it. But I just think it is disturbing to put "fun" together with "military".

I mean, to consider a person who is handling the firearm (and trained to kill) to talk about "FUN"? what image does that suppose to give to general public?

Being a member in the US armed forces is alot like playing a video game. In fact we recruit many people based on how well they can play video games. A simulator is one big game if you think about it. In training all recruits do is play games on the simulators. Considering the high-tech nature of the US military the axiom we train like we fight is no lie. We train on video-games and we play the game on the battle-field, we are so advanced it is similar. It is not suprising that the disconnect between US advanced weapons and the effects they have versus soldiers reactions to the carnage they cause exist. It isn't until the realities of war are brought home by being under fire and suffering the loss of loved ones that war truly becomes reality for the war-fighter. It was fun for me until I was shot at and lost brothers/sisters in arms. Killing Al-Queda was a blast, killing Iraqis was not. This was the case for me anyways.

 

[Waylander]

For Navy and Air Force I believe it is more like a game but for the normal GI or Marine on the ground I don't believe the training is like a video game, not to talk of facing some Iraqi rebels or Taliban out there.