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Andrea Doria (1st horizon) sea trials
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Mangusta CBT
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contedicavour
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- #23
Very similar, or at least much more similar to Doria than the Italian and French FREMM will be (2 masts vs 1, n° of guns, EMPAR or ARABEL main radar) ...
Let's hope this heralds the first of a long sequence of Pan-European programmes that can help reduce unitary costs of these ever more expensive DDGs and FFGs.
cheers
contedicavour
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- #24
Ehm it depends what you're talking about.In Lebanon we had send 3 ship, to do the work of one Galicia
The Galicia can carry as many helos as ONE of our 3 LPDHs ... so in terms of air transport we've got no issue.
Where the Galicias are better is in terms of personnel load, which is approx twice as many as one of our LPDHs.
Let's not forget however that with Cavour, Garibaldi, and the 3 LPDHs we can already transport 2 full regiments of Marines (San Marco & Lagunari).
So I agree with you that we do need this 4th LPDH but we also need to ensure complete integration of Lagunari Serenessima in the new Joint Amphibious Brigade so that we have 2,500-3,000 operational Marines to put on the ships
ciao
Mangusta CBT
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I don't know the details, i have read only 450 milion for Eurofighter, 160 for Tornado MLU and 435 for SAM. But 17 October the "Defence Commission" of Camera approve the 2007 budget at approximately at 0,97 % of PIL.
contedicavour
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- #26
I've read of 535 million for navy budget excluding EH101/NH90 helo programmes, the JSF costs, and the Aster 15/30 costs (which are in the missiles section you mention).
Since we need approx 160 to complete Cavour, and 200-250 to complete Horizon, and since the FREMM are paid for extra-budget, in theory there's enough money to complete Maestrale and De la Penne MLU and to exercise the option on the 3rd and 4th U212A, though not enough to start the 4th LPDH (unless the govt just puts a symbolic amount to start design/r&d)
ciao
Mangusta CBT
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Today, Admiral Giuseppe De Giorgi had demanded to find money for a new LHD and to replace Atlantique, some days before Giuseppe Bono had spoken of the design of this ship. I think, will see something at Euronaval.
what would be the replacement for the atlantique,will it be the new p8mma or the eads variant based on the airbus a-320 or the upgraded variants of the orion and the cn235m?
Mangusta CBT
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We never buy a CASA airplane, our C-27J is a competitor of CN235. The hypothesis are ATR-72 ASW (Turkey buy 10) or P8A MMA.
contedicavour
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- #30
Yes I confirm. The ATR-72 is more likely as it is much much cheaper (though obviously the performance we get with it is inferior to what we'd get with a P8)
cheers
contedicavour
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- #31
Where did you get that info from ?
My sources are
> www.paginedidifesa.it
> www.difesa.it (rassegna stampa)
> www.analisidifesa.it (nowadays not enough updated)
> www.dedalonews.com
At previous editions of Euronaval Fincantieri has often presented mock-ups for 12,000 to 15,000 tonne LPDHs (or LHD) ... let's hope this one is lucky enough to become reality
ciao
contedicavour
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- #33
Ah ! I should have read the article until the end !! I had only read a few lines, I though it was the umpteenth article on our Lebanese mission !
Grazie
ciao
Mangusta CBT
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Have you pics ?
contedicavour
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- #35
I have seen the picture of the mock-up in an old "Panorama Difesa", it resembled a scaled-down Garibaldi.Have you pics ?
The initial plan was : 12,000 tonnes, 150x24 meters, hangar for 5 EH-101, continuous flight deck with 4 landing spots, accomodation for 500 marines, and a well dock for 4 LCM or 2 LCACs.
Then, around 2002, new plan was for 20,000 tonnes, 200x?? meters, well dock for 4 LCM and 4 LCP, 1500m2 hangar for helos or MBTs or AIFVs, etc, and a continuous flight deck with 6 landing spots for EH101, accomodation for 750 men.
For this 2nd project, I have seen in a RID magazine a small picture resembling the French Mistrals.
I am almost sure Fincantieri will get a few million euro in 2007 to refresh its project and hopefully start building it in 2008 or 2009. The Navy needs to be careful however that any delay makes it likely that this ship will be a big LHD in the style of the Spanish BPE and end up being a replacement of the Garibaldi instead of being incremental to our 2 carriers and 3 LPD
ciao
Mangusta CBT
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A friend refer me a 247.8 mil of € for FREMM figates in this document, more two ship with the ordinal budget ? i dont know if the news is true, i dont have this document
Mangusta CBT
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Ops ... little mistake, 247.9 is for Horizzon.A friend refer me a 247.8 mil of € for FREMM figates in this document, more two ship with the ordinal budget ? i dont know if the news is true, i dont have this document
contedicavour
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- #38
Ouch that would leave only approx 300 million for other ships... you need to take out at least 150 for Cavour completion, 60-70 for MLU (mid life update) of the 4 last Maestrale and the De la Penne, which leaves precious few millions for the 3rd and 4th U212A and project definition of the 4th LPDH...
speriamo bene
ciao
contedicavour
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- #39
Dedalonews site is down since yesterday, I wonder what happened to one of our major sources of defence information in Italy
ciao
ciao
Why the Navy does not update this page (http://www.marina.difesa.it/programmi/index.htm) with the Fremm project ?
Does anyone know the main features of this class? Pictures?
Does anyone know the main features of this class? Pictures?