Big_Zucchini
Well-Known Member
Venezuela can definitely make huge profit from the oil meme, trading almost exclusively with the US. That'd massively enrich the country and I think the average Venezuelans should be excited for this possibility.
Venezuela Update
- Thread starter Feanor
- Start date
The average Venezuelan didn't profit much the first time around tho, what signs do you see that this time it will be different for the average Venezuelan? This isnt a insignificant point as it was a major factor that lead to the mudro government in the first place. If they had reason to believe it would be different this time it would help quell any possible resistance.
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Musashi_kenshin
Well-Known Member
The old system in the 1990s was probably less corrupt and better at sharing economic prosperity than the mess than followed when the Socialists took over. It was far from perfect, but even a return to that would be a lot better than what Venezuela has now.
Maduro didn't win the last election, and probably not the one before that either (but the margin was close enough it could be fudged with a modicum of credibility).
If you mean Chavez, he was elected on a promise of bringing in an independent "third party" to break up the old two party system. At this stage the only established party is the PSUV.
John Fedup
The Bunker Group
Maduro is on his way to NYC jail. Will he be getting the Jeffrey Epstein suite?
Big_Zucchini
Well-Known Member
People didn't have to wait in line for bread, so that's one factor.
Anyway, a good analysis of the situation.
Venezuela was a brewing conflict and it is true they were threatening Guyana and other areas around them, and started to increasingly sell out to other malicious actors like Iran.
And what he's saying is that 2nd term Trumpian policy is to deal with a threat while it's still small.
Venezuela Might Have Soon Started a War. Trump Made the Right Call on Maduro
Trump’s Maduro raid is framed as prevention, not provocation—arguing early force can avert a bigger regional conflict and stop Venezuela’s slide.
www.19fortyfive.com
rsemmes
Active Member
Probably as excited as Libyans and Iraqis.
But yes, this time we will have unicorns and rainbows, like with Brexit.
rsemmes
Active Member
US jus kidnapped a head of state and Iran is "malicious"?
Big_Zucchini
Well-Known Member
Is this supposed to be some flex about not understanding economy?
Venezuelans can take the W and develop a prosperous country. Or they can throw it in the bin once again, wage war, and remain a shithole synonymous with missed opportunity.
But judging by the public sentiment in Caracas right now I'm guessing they're leaning to the former.
Big_Zucchini
Well-Known Member
Yes.
True, but the foundations the movement started on are still relivent. Infact the American exploitation fears have been constantly pushed by both governments since the change. The effect sanctions played on the economy (both real and intentionally blamed for) also reinforced alot of those sentiments
And also true but the dissatisfaction with the old government was in no small part due to public opinion of the average Venezuelan being exploited by Americans. Thats the public perception that I think could be relivent. Or at the very least handled with a little more tact for this operation to remain a success. Messaging that confirms those ideas is at best unhelpful at the worst provocative.
Anyways I just find it a little mind-blowing that were once again declaring victory and telling everyone were going to be greeted as liberators. Well making public statements that objectively would be fuel for the fire of these who have a history of not seeing us as liberators at all. The fact maduro was Infact a bad dude is a important factor in all this but not the only one. I will of course be happy if time proves my concerns about this as irrelevant
rsemmes
Active Member
Meaning...
What country is not "malicious"?
No, is about what peasants will get. "La poule au pot".
Big_Zucchini
Well-Known Member
Various other countries. In broad strokes, I'll say western and west-aligned nations.
What?
Big_Zucchini
Well-Known Member
I'm gonna be real it has absolutely nothing to do with his criminal activities.
China, Russia, Iran, can no longer use Venezuela as a base against the US. Moral or not, this is a major blow to hostile force projection.
rsemmes
Active Member
If I am powerful enough I declare you criminal and I do with you what I want.
Precedent? Yes, Vae victis!
rsemmes
Active Member
The Rainbow Warrior was sunk by Iran?
Big_Zucchini
Well-Known Member
What?
I know it has nothing to do with crimes, it probably has more to do with distraction.
It is ironic, considering 47s legal issues, and that he has just pardoned a former South American leader who was serving a prison sentence for drug related crimes, that this is the justification being used.
What it does show is the US military and intelligence organisations are still highly professional and capable, irrespective of questions if competence at the executive level.
rsemmes
Active Member
Like invading Ukraine?
We agree in one thing: morality, like International Law, never had anything to do with actions.
And the USA has no credibility at all if it calls interference by any country in the affairs of another illegal . . . .