Big agree with this. They are long legged patrol boats and attempting to make them anything more than that is a highly questionable move.
Royal Australian Navy Discussions and Updates 2.0
- Thread starter OPSSG
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Redlands18
Well-Known Member
The Arafura is the type of Patrol Vessel we have always needed, and it still is. A 2000t Corvette is an expensive way to do Constabulary missions. You can put C-Dome on the Flight Deck of an Arafura but that not only adds nothing to the missions you would be using the Arafura for, but You still have to fit out the vessel with mission specific equipment and you have just lost a major mission asset in the flight deck.
The S-100 is going to be a game changer in the role the Arafura's are intended for, constabulary duties.
Whilst primarily intended for the Arafura as the noise is pointing towards, being a bolt on, bolt off system, should be fairly adaptable to any ship with sufficient deck space and available power and workforce…
What other ships do we have that have limited self-defence capability, yet have large flight decks and most definitely will be in the battlespace?
Strix is also a possibility, although 4-5 times heavier.
Those reports are wrong.
The landing deck has not been ”weakened” or de-rated from it’s official design. Both Defence and Luerssen have confirmed this publicly. The mere fact it can apparently manage a 12t modular SAM system should be enough of an insight into whether those reports are correct or not…
But, the vessels are not being equipped with aviation support capabilities to allow the operation of a naval helicopter capability.
Redlands18
Well-Known Member
Don't forget that without a hangar, any UAV will need a deployable shelter to operate out of and in the case of an armed UAV, you will need a deployable missile armoury as well, not sure the Arafura class can store missiles, probably only guns and ammo up to 50cal. The S-100 comes with its own fitted out container which will sit on the flight deck.
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Going Boeing
Well-Known Member
This article states “This is Rheinmetall's largest-ever order for ship protection technology, and the contract includes an option to equip the entire Australian fleet, which could result in a total sales volume of A$1 billion (about €610 million).”
I hope the option is taken up and the entire fleet gets an additional layer of defence.
Rheinmetall to equip Australia Navy's warships with Multi Ammunition Softkill System
STRIX can apparently be stored and deployed from a standard ISO container so shelter shouldn't be much of an issue. S-100 is also already a very useful asset for the Arafuras to have as you said.
Takao
The Bunker Group
Yeah, I find the hypocrisy about this hilarious.
"CASG/RAN over complicates the project demands, they should just stick to needs" versus "Arafura's should be able to fight everything from Akula's to Type 55's to J-20's all by themselves and so need more VLS/CWIS/guns/torps/aircraft".
How about we accept that the Arafura's are well designed for their role. If we need more VLS or fighting capability, than the answer is more FFG/DDG.
I'd really hope that we'd get SeaRAM instead of C-DOME. Not only is it lower footprint but it's also confirmed to be actually capable of intercepting manoeuvring targets unlike C-DOME. The only real downside to SeaRAM compared to C-DOME is that one launcher doesn't provide 360 coverage because of stuff like the superstructure getting in the way. And even this is significantly mitigated by RAM's around-the-corner capability.
My understanding is also that the deck strength is maintained and rated for an 11 t helicopter, but no aviation support capabilities are provided which if true I do find hard to understand.
Just keeping the Arafura Class as an OPV with no "Up Gunning", I could still see the utility of being able to refuel the ADF's medium sized helicopters.
Even if they don't deploy the helicopter themselves, the OPV's will be a useful lily pad for many scenarios.
Surely the installation of a modest fuel bunkerage complete with associated fuel and deck handling systems would not be that great a expense.
Not suggesting a RAST system
Cheers S
The capability decisions were all about cost, originally.
If the reports are true, that may have changed somewhat. Time will tell.
The issue with the most recent strategic review is that most of the pros here could of met at the pub and come up with something better over a few hours and charged the government for their snittys and a few schooners. How hard was it to work out we need longer range weapons and ships in number that can fight back over longer range than the potential enemy, and that it would be a good idea if we can produce missiles and other advanced weaponry ourselves?
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Yeah it is obvious, but it now makes it official. For better or worse it sets out the priorities and gives us an overall plan. The test is whether they will keep to the recommendations of the DSR or start fudging it to cut corners and save money.
Aardvark144
Active Member
Perhaps keep track of how many of the 'Agreed in Principle' recommendations are kicked down the road.
For anyone interested by the way that is my model.
3D Lurssen OPV 80 Patrol Vessel - TurboSquid 1782997
Royalty free 3D model Lurssen OPV 80 Patrol Vessel for download as max, max, fbx, and obj on TurboSquid: 3D models for games, architecture, videos. (1782997)
www.turbosquid.com
I'm still dubious of the ability of Tamir to intercept targets such as manoeuvring and/or sea skimming AShMs. Until they come out with a video demonstrating this capability I will remain dubious.
Good point, and this actually highlights just how seriously bad the Armidale decision was.
The Fremantle's were meant to be replaced with corvettes, that based on what we have seen with the ANZACs, would still be in service and performing well, while heading for their second major upgrade. Instead they were replaced with the Armidales that were pretty much inferior in most ways and are themselves being replaced now by Capes and Arafuras.