Go Bag - contents and rationale

[StingrayOZ]

This is the reason why you'll struggle to find anything for children under 4. It's why little kids are contained inside a tent or capsule, rather than using a mask, usually with some form of positive pressure generating device to force air through the filter to the kid.

That is very interesting.

I'm just trying to envision every possible situation and have some sort of cheap possible solution to deal with it or manage it.

Bushfires are a very real. Smoke can be pretty acrid in Australian fires, and as the fires can be quite large, they can affect very large areas. Getting down low and go go go doesn't really work. I have a pile of P2/N95 disposable masks (not those crappy P1) for general work which are fine for short term protection in moderate conditions. I've used them in backburns and in highly dusty environments and, while not perfect, they are better than nothing, and much light and more comfortable than a half or full mask.

I've started to carry one around in my work bag. Recent high rise fires have highlighted to me that some of the threats and challenges aren't as obvious as they may first appear and smoke is often the impenetrable barrier, not fire or heat. You may only need to wear the mask for a minute, but that can make the difference between walking out alive no problems and being trapped in a fatal fire or suffering from smoke inhalation.

 

[Todjaeger]

That is very interesting.

I'm just trying to envision every possible situation and have some sort of cheap possible solution to deal with it or manage it.

Bushfires are a very real. Smoke can be pretty acrid in Australian fires, and as the fires can be quite large, they can affect very large areas. Getting down low and go go go doesn't really work. I have a pile of P2/N95 disposable masks (not those crappy P1) for general work which are fine for short term protection in moderate conditions. I've used them in backburns and in highly dusty environments and, while not perfect, they are better than nothing, and much light and more comfortable than a half or full mask.

I've started to carry one around in my work bag. Recent high rise fires have highlighted to me that some of the threats and challenges aren't as obvious as they may first appear and smoke is often the impenetrable barrier, not fire or heat. You may only need to wear the mask for a minute, but that can make the difference between walking out alive no problems and being trapped in a fatal fire or suffering from smoke inhalation.

Do you have P95 or P100 masks in Oz? If so, they might be worth getting.

I myself keep a small supply of TB-rated N95 masks handy, but that is really to provide some measure of protection vs. possible airborne or aerosolized diseases.

I have no idea what sort of training is available in Oz, but I would recommend looking into it. Kit might not be available or work all the time, but training and knowledge always is.

In the US for instance, smoke inhalation is the primary killer in fires with hydrogen cyanide playing an active role like I had mentioned before. Unfortunately hydrogen cyanide does not have to be inhaled for it to have an effect, since it can also be ingested or absorbed through skin/eye contact. The NIOSH has an informative page about the substance here, but the basic gist is that just having a mask of some sort is insufficient protection for any zone other than the green/cold zone in a hazmat incident.

Another important consideration for small children is that they tend to be nose breathers, with less respiration through the mouth than adults. Between that, the high respiration rates for children and significantly lower tidal volume, masks tend not to work so well. In EMS (in the US at least, local protocols could be different in Oz) we tend to either assist respiration passively by providing a significantly higher concentration of oxygen via nasal cannula or non-rebreather mask (NRB), or actively via positive pressure ventilation (PPV) either using a bag-valve mask, or now in some areas some form of either CPAP, APAP, or Bi-PAP, all connected to an oxygen tank. Again though, the above is part of EMS and some fire protocols and requires specialist kit and training, and even if you had the training and could afford the kit... an oxygen tank is not something you want to have or bring anywhere near a fire if you can avoid it.

 

[StingrayOZ]

I looked into oxygen cylinders, and figured it wasn't worth the hassle and risks that come with it.

I have a range of options including a fire bunker which I can get to have a positive pressure for a short period. There is a major regional hospital ~30 minutes drive away. Most of the time I would be better off heading in that direction and meeting an ambulance, helicopter etc if its very urgent. Me trying to put in a nasal canular, or more realistically my wife as I would be driving or carrying or defending, is not likely to be optimal.

I know a lot of people prep for a lot of different eventualities, but the risks I tend to worry about is bush fires, snake bikes, spider bites, drownings, getting lost, accidents cuts, falls, floodings etc. With things being useful in multiple ways. That disposable mask can become a wound dressing, or filter water, or some other use.

But I will have a look at better disposable masks. Ratings are different here in Australia, but often the same type of mask is sold.

 

[Todjaeger]

I looked into oxygen cylinders, and figured it wasn't worth the hassle and risks that come with it.

I have a range of options including a fire bunker which I can get to have a positive pressure for a short period. There is a major regional hospital ~30 minutes drive away. Most of the time I would be better off heading in that direction and meeting an ambulance, helicopter etc if its very urgent. Me trying to put in a nasal canular, or more realistically my wife as I would be driving or carrying or defending, is not likely to be optimal.

I know a lot of people prep for a lot of different eventualities, but the risks I tend to worry about is bush fires, snake bikes, spider bites, drownings, getting lost, accidents cuts, falls, floodings etc. With things being useful in multiple ways. That disposable mask can become a wound dressing, or filter water, or some other use.

But I will have a look at better disposable masks. Ratings are different here in Australia, but often the same type of mask is sold.

A nasal cannula is dead simple to put it. Now putting an NPA into a toddler, especially while in the back of a moving automobile...

As for using a mask as a dressing or a water filter, I would need to be desperate indeed before going down either route. The properties that make for a good mask/air filter, tend to make poor dressings and bandages. With a dressing, one is looking for an absorbent material, preferably one that will provide a matrix for clotting and that can be easily wrapped or contoured around a wound. Most masks either are made from poor absorbent materials, or are contoured to fit around the noise and mouth with a good seal. If it is a mask with a one-way valve and/or a charcoal filter element, it tends to be even worse and IMO one would be better off just using a piece of cloth.

As for using a mask as a replacement water filter... That might work for some of the largest particulate matter, but I would not expect it to filter out either microorganisms or fine/dissolved particulates like fuels, chemicals, etc. I would use other methods of water purification like boiling or distillation before I would use a mask filter.

I definitely believe that to conserve space and weight, it is better to have items which are multipurpose in a kit, but one needs to be realistic in terms of what items can cover what additional roles.

 

[Todjaeger]

I have a range of options including a fire bunker which I can get to have a positive pressure for a short period. There is a major regional hospital ~30 minutes drive away. Most of the time I would be better off heading in that direction and meeting an ambulance, helicopter etc if its very urgent.

I know this is a dangerous sign, but I had an additional thought here. If there is the potential that would might need to head towards the regional hospital, and especially if you might need to arrange an ambulance or medevac intercept, have you considered kit which can make arranging that intercept safer and easier?

I have some coloured smoke signal grenades for SAR work that I can use to signal an aircraft LZ in the daytime. During stormy or overcast conditions as well as at night I have phosphorous flares and waterproof LED strobe signals. Something to consider at least.

 

[StingrayOZ]

I know this is a dangerous sign, but I had an additional thought here. If there is the potential that would might need to head towards the regional hospital, and especially if you might need to arrange an ambulance or medevac intercept, have you considered kit which can make arranging that intercept safer and easier?

I have some coloured smoke signal grenades for SAR work that I can use to signal an aircraft LZ in the daytime. During stormy or overcast conditions as well as at night I have phosphorous flares and waterproof LED strobe signals. Something to consider at least.

I should get some boating flares

It would be definitely something I would take if I was on a serious hike. The bush is impossibly thick. Twisted ankle or broken leg or fall(which is easy to do on the rugged rocky ground) and they would have great difficulty finding you, even from a helicopter directly above. Even with an ERB.I never used to worry about it, but then an international student went missing near my backyard after a doof, they never found him even after looking for 12 months with dogs and aircraft.

So it would be something I would carry now. Flares are light and cheap.

All of my kits have multiple torches. I probably own 20+ torches. We use them all the time. I love those small 3xaaa short and stubby led ones. I lost one hiking once, then found it 12 months later. Still works.

 

[John Fedup]

My niece brought a life straw water filter bottle with her while travelling in Tanzania's Serengeti. Didn't have to use it though. Google lifestraw for information. My main item while winter traveling in Ontario is a warm sleeping bag.

 

[StingrayOZ]

My niece brought a life straw water filter bottle with her while travelling in Tanzania's Serengeti. Didn't have to use it though. Google lifestraw for information. My main item while winter traveling in Ontario is a warm sleeping bag.

Those lifestraws are rated very highly.

But they don't remove salt. Don't improve drinking your pee much either, apparently.

 

[Todjaeger]

Those lifestraws are rated very highly.

But they don't remove salt. Don't improve drinking your pee much either, apparently.

The do not remove salt, and I would not trust them to remove a number of other potential dissolved chemicals either. They are very good to have just in case, but one always needs to consider the quality of their water source prior to doing any water treatment.

 

[John Fedup]

I guess when it comes to water, plastic bottled water is handy. In Ontario it is not uncommon to see a case of 24 bottles, 400-500 mL, on sale for under $2 a case. Keeping 3-4 cases around at these prices makes sense.

 

[StingrayOZ]

I guess when it comes to water, plastic bottled water is handy. In Ontario it is not uncommon to see a case of 24 bottles, 400-500 mL, on sale for under $2 a case. Keeping 3-4 cases around at these prices makes sense.

I have 45,000 litres of storage on the farm. But I need a new generator to pump more water up the hill.

But it is useful to have bottled water. If you need to run out you can grab one for each person or just grab the lot. People lose their mind when water is shut off. If there is ever an emergency handing out water bottles can make it a lot more comfortable for others as well.

When I used to drive longer kms than i do now. I always had a 6x1litre pack in the boot.

 

[Todjaeger]

I guess when it comes to water, plastic bottled water is handy. In Ontario it is not uncommon to see a case of 24 bottles, 400-500 mL, on sale for under $2 a case. Keeping 3-4 cases around at these prices makes sense.

In emergency situations, there is a Rule of Threes which is different than the one commonly used for military forces.

For survival, a person can typically last:
3 minutes without air
3 hours without shelter
3 days without water
3 weeks without food

Of course this is on average, and subject to situational and conditional environments.

Having said that, and with the caveat that I hate the notion of spending money on buying water... I keep four cases (24x 500 mL bottles ea) stored at home, because purchased water has a longer shelf-life than water I can store on my own. I also having additional water containers which I keep in the freezer. Incidentally doing that is a potentially helpful trick in the event of a prolonged power outage helping to keep the contents cold while not making a mess and being a source of drinking water. I use the same trick when loading a cooler bag rather than using ice packs or bags of ice.

In terms of Go Bags though, there is a limit to how much water is practical to carry due to both volume and especially weight. Water is nearly 1 kg per L and while a normal adult with a relatively sedentary life might only need to consume 1.2 L per day, that number can quickly rise to 4-5 L per day if making considerable exertions, or high temp and humidity conditions. Carrying nearly 5 kg of water, plus other gear tends to get old very quickly.

 

[old faithful]

I spend a fair bit of time prospecting here in the NT. Its 30 deg days all year round, except in the hot months, Sept - March where its typically 34 in town and 36-40 out bush with extreme humidity. I carry an Engel in my car (permanently) and always have a 15lt jerry in the back as well. I usually go through about 6 Lt a day whilst detetecting, and another 2 driving home in the aircon. As well as a couple of Pepsi Max's. I always carry a filter bottle, 1lt, similar to a life straw, but it also filters chemicals. Other bits I carry when out bush, keeping in mind I try to travel light, is a head torch, my phone, a solar battery bank, smokes,a lighter, a knife, a leathermans, a light weight raincoat, a couple of Musli bars, a GPS, spare batteries, and water. I use an old army canteen (with the alloy cup) and 2 South African 2 Lt bottles. All in a small day pack. That is standard every time I leave my car to go prospecting. Once I suffered heat exhaustion, didn't have my GPS with me, got confused and walked up the same hill twice after circling around it. Lucky I did have my phone, and google maps saved my life! I was in big trouble, no water left, getting dark, and extremely hot and humid. When I got back to the car. I drank, poured about 5 lt over my head,and just sat with engine running with the aircon on for about an hour. Never left the GPS at home since!