the road runner
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The Ramps did have yellow line markings down the centre so come to think of it...I may have been confused there but am sure there was 2 bridges(fly bridge) as opposed to one bridge in the centre of the LCM:drunk1
Royal Australian Navy Discussions and Updates
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weegee
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I see on the net that another Anzac HMAS Anzac has completed her ASMD refit. It looks as though the upgrades are being installed well and it seems that BAE has got it all under control smooth sailing. The whole fleet will be done before we know it.
I wonder if the New Zealand Anzac self defence upgrades are going to go as well in Canada? Lets hope for their sake they do. Just out of curiosity why are the Kiwis not hoping onto the back of this upgrade?
Is it ridiculously expensive compared to what the Canadians are offering?
I know that since the birth of the Anzac Class both Navies have gone their separate ways regarding install of kit. Is this the reason why they did not join in because their baseline is substantially different to ours or was it just not offered to them in the first place?
I wonder if the New Zealand Anzac self defence upgrades are going to go as well in Canada? Lets hope for their sake they do. Just out of curiosity why are the Kiwis not hoping onto the back of this upgrade?
Is it ridiculously expensive compared to what the Canadians are offering?
I know that since the birth of the Anzac Class both Navies have gone their separate ways regarding install of kit. Is this the reason why they did not join in because their baseline is substantially different to ours or was it just not offered to them in the first place?
The reason why us Kiwis haven't gone the same road on ANZAC upgrades is mainly because of expense. Right from the start of the ANZAC Project expense has always been an issue with Kiwi pollies. They are stingy when it comes to defence related issues.
Joe Black
Active Member
The AUS' ANZAC class and NZ's ANZAC will differ greatly from now on, especially in the combat systems, sensors and weapons area. So I guess NZ will not be able to leverage RAN's scale in supporting their frigates and I suppose collaboration in maintenance could drop or simply disappear?
Anzac is still a couple of months away from being ready to sail yet, she only came off the slip the other week. Ballarat is due to take her place up on the slip in a couple of weeks to begin the ASMD.
Cheers
There will probably be nothing too startling. Perhaps they might try and get the Collins sub replacement back on track. OCVs might also be put back on the table.
The big thing of course will be F-35s for the Canberra class.
If I had to pick a surprise option it would be plans for a proper carrier. Perhaps something based on the Canberra class.
t68
Well-Known Member
From what I have read it is the policy of the current goverment to increase the defence budget to 2% by the end of the decade, so could be awhile yet before we hit that mark again .
You would have to imagine the previously planned developments considered under the previous government could be on the table.
I am not sure a carrier is likely, but I guess the rumours have persisted.
I would imagine that perhaps both the LCH replacement and the OCV vessels could both be on the table. There is also the future frigate program.
Is it too late to add a 4th AWD (I suspect it may be)?
If the LCH replacement is back on the radar are we likely to go with something similar like the BMT Caimen or could we go with something more substantial like the JHSV? If the latter we could either go with US builds or perhaps a local build?
If there is a surprise, my pick would be replacement of the Armidales with the OCV, perhaps even up to the size of BMT's Venator (baseline or coastguard version). This would be in line with the current government's emphasis on border protection. Perhaps like the Anzac class they could be local builds.
Just to through it out there, is there any chance of us purchasing V-22 Ospreys to operate from the LHDs? I had considered the idea incredulous, but then again I considered the same about F-35Bs. With Japan looking to buy 17 Ospreys and the US Marines in Darwin, could they be an option that is considered?
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Trackmaster
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V-22 Osprey's.
IMHO...you only buy V-22s if you are awash with $$. An incredibly expensive and technically complicated solution to a problem. It's a narrow gutted thing...can't carry "normal" sized vehicles.
Again...IMHO...survived because of the Congressional power of the USMC lobby.
I agree with you (and I definately think it would be a long shot). Mind you I had thought the same about operating F-35Bs from the LHDs.It certainly seems there is genuine interest in substantially upgrading the LHD airgroup. I wouldn't see a small number (perhaps 6) being prohibitive if there was the requirement, but having said that, I think there are more urgent priorities.
The Mv-22 is expensive. To purchase and operate. ~$70 million fly away each. Which is a fair bit (double?) say the cost of a Chinook. Chinook is most likely going to be more useful for something like the ADF.
MV-22 is a very interesting aircraft, but cost verse capability at this stage is a bit short. You could be looking at half a billion to any significant MV-22 capability.
t68
Well-Known Member
only way I can think that the ADF would consider the Osprey is the develop the AEW&C version which would be mighty expensive and I don't see the Americans stumping up with the money when they are building new E2D Hawkeyes
What about the possibility of having an extra 3 frigates in the white paper (We can then build in batches of 3 continuously) = Total 11 frigates and 3 AWD
Continuous Build would look something like below :
3 x ASW - F100 Frigate (start ASAP / 2018)
3 x Subs (Collins Mk2) (Start approx Approx 2022)
3 x General purpose - F100 (mk2) (start to replace Anzac's Approx 2026)
3 x Subs (Collins Mk2) - first block upgrade
3 x General purpose - F100 - first block upgrade
#Hit repeat - with upgraded blocks on each build of 3 units ongoing.
The huge advantage is while building subs, gives you the design period to upgrade next block frigates/AWD and vise versa. .
Continuous Build would look something like below :
3 x ASW - F100 Frigate (start ASAP / 2018)
3 x Subs (Collins Mk2) (Start approx Approx 2022)
3 x General purpose - F100 (mk2) (start to replace Anzac's Approx 2026)
3 x Subs (Collins Mk2) - first block upgrade
3 x General purpose - F100 - first block upgrade
#Hit repeat - with upgraded blocks on each build of 3 units ongoing.
The huge advantage is while building subs, gives you the design period to upgrade next block frigates/AWD and vise versa. .
UK looked at it and it didn't happen.
With AEW&C a UAV might be a better bet with greater persistence and range. Much cheaper and more more suitable for say the RAN and operating off a LHD or light carriers.
We do need more helicopters. Particularly say look at the Chinooks, which are heavily used and we have so few air frames. With the LHD's I would imagine they would see even greater levels of use.
TheRealist
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I think as far as the RAN is concerned, an extra one or two future frigates is a real possibility. The OCV's would have to be on the cards as well. I don't think a dedicated Carrier is an option for the next couple of decades but limited fixed wing off the Canberras has a real shot I think
Interesting idea
The OCV vessels was previously planned around 20 vessels. I would like to see a two tiered approach with 6 larger vessels such as the BMT Venator (3200t) and 14 vessels like the Damen 2400.
With the 3 Hobart class, 6 Future Frigates and 6 large OCV we would have similar numbers to what we had with the Charles F Adams, Oliver Hazard Perrys and Anzacs. 14 Damens could replace the Armidales 1 for 1.
The move to build the replenishment ships offshore in interesting. I would imagine the future frigates would be local builds (perhaps with overseas input) and any OCV or LCH replacements could be local builds. Could 6 Future frigates, 20 OCVs and 6 LCHs be enough work to sustain the local ship building industry?
The submarines are interesting, it seems that there will be some level of collaboration with Japan, but as to how that pans it.
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