The Royal Navy Discussions and Updates

[StobieWan]

I THINK these 'pics' are based from data extracted from THIS website:
Royal Navy Type 26 Frigate

Which took the data posted by BAE & that you linked to here :
Type 26 Frigate - Global Combat Ship datasheet pictures photos video specifications

Pity that most of this stuff is now about 18months old & that the ACTUAL SHIP may only partially resemble the BAE models / pictures....

Also MOST of that T-26 data was posted back in July 2010 on this thread...

SA

Yup..

Last solid updates were from DSIE 2011 and that was all still "the story so far" - hopefully with funds being allocated in the latest "ooh, we've found a couple of billion" incident, we'll see something firmer shortly. I'm all agog to find out more as Type 26 will be the single most important element in the RN for the next couple of decades. Fingers crossed it'll be a good 'un.

 

[AndrewMI]

I THINK these 'pics' are based from data extracted from THIS website:
Royal Navy Type 26 Frigate

Which took the data posted by BAE & that you linked to here :
Type 26 Frigate - Global Combat Ship datasheet pictures photos video specifications

Pity that most of this stuff is now about 18months old & that the ACTUAL SHIP may only partially resemble the BAE models / pictures....

Also MOST of that T-26 data was posted back in July 2010 on this thread...

SA

My apologies for the duplication - i was looking for a picture that showed the "second" CAAM silo towards the stern of the ship.

Do you have much info on how the design has changed that you are able to share SA?

 

[RobWilliams]

Another big step on the UKs carrier project

Construction of Second Carrier Begins at Portsmouth | Navy & Maritime Security News at DefenceTalk

Anyone have any idea on how far HMS Queen Elizabeth is along the construction path?

 

[ProM]

Another big step on the UKs carrier project

Construction of Second Carrier Begins at Portsmouth | Navy & Maritime Security News at DefenceTalk

Anyone have any idea on how far HMS Queen Elizabeth is along the construction path?

In truth steel cutting on POW started some time ago, this latest one was more a PR thing.

If youl look at the ACA site you can see that the first superblock (lower block, upper block plus sponsons) is all together at Rosyth. The bow is alongside, and the other blocks are nearing completion. I think the next one is due to move to Rosyth soon and the others in the summer (that is my memory, see ACA site for latest schedule) .

Meanwhile less publicly many of the mission systems are being accepted this year to allow (progressively) whole system integration and testing

 

[AndrewMI]

Meanwhile less publicly many of the mission systems are being accepted this year to allow (progressively) whole system integration and testing

Mission Systems? MASC?

Do we know if there are any plans to provide BMD defence for the fleet by the time these carriers come into service? It seems silly not to provide such a defence for something so valuble.

 

[StobieWan]

Mission Systems? MASC?

Do we know if there are any plans to provide BMD defence for the fleet by the time these carriers come into service? It seems silly not to provide such a defence for something so valuble.

There's work gone into software mods for the SS8150 volume search radar and that's being tested right now. Aster-30 has been demonstrated against a simulated IRBM target of the type that might get lobbed by a hostile nation so yes, the ground work is being done.

Ian

 

[AndrewMI]

There's work gone into software mods for the SS8150 volume search radar and that's being tested right now. Aster-30 has been demonstrated against a simulated IRBM target of the type that might get lobbed by a hostile nation so yes, the ground work is being done.

Ian

Cheers Ian - I had thought that Aster 30 lacked the range to do this effectively and that it would be some form of Aster 45 missile, which would likely require the A70 VLS Silos?

 

[StobieWan]

Cheers Ian - I had thought that Aster 30 lacked the range to do this effectively and that it would be some form of Aster 45 missile, which would likely require the A70 VLS Silos?

SAMP/T Successful on First European Missile Defense Intercept Test | Defense Update


Depends on what target you're trying to intercept - Aster-30 can tackle the shorter range stuff.

 

[deepsixteen]

Cheers Ian - I had thought that Aster 30 lacked the range to do this effectively and that it would be some form of Aster 45 missile, which would likely require the A70 VLS Silos?

Hi
I understand that the aster 30 will be okay against theatre missiles and the uprated aster fills the whole a50 silo and will be okay against ICBM.

Deepsixteen

 

[swerve]

Daewoo preferred builder of four BMT-designed tankers for the MARS requirement.

BBC story.

With regard to Aster & BMD:

There is considerable scope for confusion here, because there are two different BMD missiles called Aster 30.

Aster 30 Block 1 is an enhanced Aster 30, effective against short range ballistic missiles. I think the enhancements may be limited to software & perhaps minor hardware changes to radars. It exists, has been tested against ballistic targets, & is in service in the SAMP/T land-based system.

Aster 30 Block 2 (article & picture) is a new missile under development. It has three stages. The booster & cruise stages are built up to the full width of the Sylver launcher, without fins. The upper stage (the kill vehicle) is pretty much full width at the base, conical at the top. It's meant to be effective against medium or intermediate range BMs, I think. It fills a Sylver A50, as deepsixteen says.

I have no idea why Aster 30 Block 2 isn't called Aster 45, or some other new name. It certainly isn't an Aster 30.

 

[overlander]

MOD information about the building of the 4 new tankers.

http://www.mod.uk/DefenceInternet/DefenceNews/EquipmentAndLogistics/ModToOrderFourNewRfaTankers.htm

I hope they follow with these good news in the long term and they increase the number of escorts at least to 22, building 16 type 26 frigates instead of 13 and please keep the 2 carriers.

If finally they decide not install catapults in the Q.E. would be possible to buy around 20 VSTOL F-35,s and to operate them from the carrier in the LPH role the same as former HMS Hermes made in the falklands war ???
It would be a formidable asset combined with the embarkation of 1500 royal marines and helicopters.

 

[StobieWan]

Daewoo preferred builder of four BMT-designed tankers for the MARS requirement.

BBC story.

With regard to Aster & BMD:

There is considerable scope for confusion here, because there are two different BMD missiles called Aster 30.

Aster 30 Block 1 is an enhanced Aster 30, effective against short range ballistic missiles. I think the enhancements may be limited to software & perhaps minor hardware changes to radars. It exists, has been tested against ballistic targets, & is in service in the SAMP/T land-based system.

Aster 30 Block 2 (article & picture) is a new missile. It has three stages. The booster & cruise stages are built up to the full width of the Sylver launcher, without fins. The upper stage (the kill vehicle) is pretty much full width at the base, conical at the top. It's meant to be effective against medium or intermediate range BMs, I think. It fills a Sylver A50, as deepsixteen says.

I have no idea why Aster 30 Block 2 isn't called Aster 45, or some other new name. It certainly isn't an Aster 30.

Ah - thanks for that - that fills in a useful chunk of information there.

 

[ProM]

Mission Systems?

Radars, CMS. Navigation system, ATC, Comms , IR,. Cameras etc etc

 

[StobieWan]

MOD information about the building of the 4 new tankers.

Ministry of Defence | Defence News | Equipment and Logistics | MOD to order four new RFA tankers

I hope they follow with these good news in the long term and they increase the number of escorts at least to 22, building 16 type 26 frigates instead of 13 and please keep the 2 carriers.

If finally they decide not install catapults in the Q.E. would be possible to buy around 20 VSTOL F-35,s and to operate them from the carrier in the LPH role the same as former HMS Hermes made in the falklands war ???
It would be a formidable asset combined with the embarkation of 1500 royal marines and helicopters.

If they are actually getting four tankers, that's the single best bit of news for the Navy and it's blue water capability in a *long* time - there was discussions of "up to" which effectively would have sounded the death knell of any serious effort to keep a fleet at sea in any serious capacity.

I don't think the QE (first in sequence and not fitted with cats) still has a ski jump - she's been converted to an angle deck, ski jump deleted and basically we're all pinning our hopes to a second set of arrester gear with EMALS.

 

[Sea Toby]

If they are actually getting four tankers, that's the single best bit of news for the Navy and it's blue water capability in a *long* time - there was discussions of "up to" which effectively would have sounded the death knell of any serious effort to keep a fleet at sea in any serious capacity.

I don't think the QE (first in sequence and not fitted with cats) still has a ski jump - she's been converted to an angle deck, ski jump deleted and basically we're all pinning our hopes to a second set of arrester gear with EMALS.

I believe the first carrier will have a ski jump ramp without EMALS. After the Ford, the second EMALS is scheduled for the Prince of Wales, not the Queen Elizabeth. I believe the plan is to back fit the Queen Elizabeth with EMALS with either the third or fourth built EMALS after the Prince of Wales is built. Keep in mind the British won't be receiving the bulk of their C versions of the JSF until late this decade and early the next decade.

 

[1805]

Daewoo preferred builder of four BMT-designed tankers for the MARS requirement.

BBC story.

.

Thanks for posting this, It seem a poor descision in a number of regards:

1, It does nothing to improve the image (in practice it sounds like there is work there, but perception is everything) of the RN as sustaining UK jobs/industrial capability. The world has change completely since foreign construction was first considered.

2, Even with the operation of a carrier group, 4 ships at 37,000t just seems the wrong mix, when we see more single ship operations and we already have the 2 Waves. Surely 6-8 x 15-18,000t (30-50% larger than a Rover).

3, It does nothing to "spin the wheel" to help get back into the commercial ship building business. If we built a larger number of 15-18,000t ships we could build over a 10-12 year run and quietly sell a few secondhand to ensure production us kept going?

 

[kev 99]

No UK bider for the build contract, £450m seems like a bargain for 4 of these and a third of that money goes to UK businesses. Buying more smaller ships would of cost more money and we don't have the budget to find the extra crewmen.

Also the shadow defence spokesman is a hypocrit for condemning this contract, the plan is the same as it was under labour, foreign build.

 

[Anixtu]

Thanks for posting this, It seem a poor descision in a number of regards:

1. To change from foreign construction would require restarting the bidding process at the beginning, specifying that they must be built in the UK, and assuming that UK yards bother to bid. Leafs and Rovers need replaced yesterday, we can't wait. To build these in the UK concurrently with CVF/T26 would require creating UK shipbuilding capacity, not sustaining it. The yards that could have built these stopped building ships years ago.

2. A larger tanker can support small deployments and larger deployments and coalition operations. A small tanker is useless. The Rovers have been relegated to APT(S) and FOST because they are too small for anything else and the bigger ships can't get alongside in the Falklands. In reality our tankers support very few "single ship operations", most of them are providing support to allied as well as UK units, something allies struggle to provide for themselves, including the US in some theatres.

3. The UK is never getting back into that business. It went east in the 70s and it ain't coming back.

 

[kev 99]

3. The UK is never getting back into that business. It went east in the 70s and it ain't coming back.

It would require massive levels of government subsidies to make it work (somewhat similar to what happens in Italy), culturally that only really seems to happen in the defence sector.

 

[AndrewMI]

Radars, CMS. Navigation system, ATC, Comms , IR,. Cameras etc etc

CEC?

Having a CEC capability via what i hope will be a Hawkeye aircraft would be very useful.